Chinese semiconductor thread II

[ansy1968]

The overwhelming assumption is SMIC producing 14nm or anything below in China.

But it's almost mutually exclusively. If SMIC maintains 14nm/12nm line that will take away 7nm, 5nm production capacity. If 7nm line is maintained, it will take away 14nm/12nm, 5nm production.

Assuming SMIC has limited capacity, it cant produce 14/12nm, 7nm, 5nm all simulatenously unless SMIC has expanded to multiple lines or there are other players are doing the production,


Do you know if SMIC has 14nm/12nm, 7nm and 5nm lines are setup and running ALL simulatenously? They are all finfet tech and use the same resources.

Assuming SN1 is setup for 7nm for huawei. Where's the fab for 12nm for Loongson? SN2? where's the fab for 5nm?

You can't have SN1 running at 7nm yesterday and 12nm today and 5nm tommorrow.

Nanjing TSMC line only setup do 16nm, it can't do anything else.

Hi bro my assumption is that SN1 produced its first 14nm in 2019.

Truth to be told, SMIC has been producing chips using its 14nm-class manufacturing technology since late 2019 (one of the products is Huawei's HiSilicon Kirin 710A) at its SN1

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N+1 is a sub 10nm is a experimental chip equivalent to Samsung 8nm, as they transition their production line for N+2 7nm line. Here I think a domestic solution may have found for 14nm line, Tianjin and Shenzhen FAB (the Chinese refer them as 28nm FAB line ) come to mind.

As @tphuang mentioned SN1 had a capacity of 35k WPM in 2023 and SN2 after finishing its construction is still calibrating its ASML equipment and may have start operation in 2024. And all Shanghai FAB will be using ASML machine even the rumored Huawei FAB (obtain 2 2nd hand NXT 1980i) as they had an established eco system.

SO where did China gets its 14nm chip? Nobody seems to talk about it anymore like yesterday news. And what about the recently finished SMIC Beijing FAB? IF we connect the dot maybe SMIC Beijing is the new 7nm domestic line that the article may have assume.

 

[Oldschool]

Hi bro my assumption is that SN1 produced its first 14nm in 2019.

Truth to be told, SMIC has been producing chips using its 14nm-class manufacturing technology since late 2019 (one of the products is Huawei's HiSilicon Kirin 710A) at its SN1

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N+1 is a sub 10nm is a experimental chip equivalent to Samsung 8nm, as they transition their production line for N+2 7nm line. Here I think a domestic solution may have found for 14nm line, Tianjin and Shenzhen FAB (the Chinese refer them as 28nm FAB line ) come to mind.

As @tphuang mentioned SN1 had a capacity of 35k WPM in 2023 and SN2 after finishing its construction is still calibrating its ASML equipment and may have start operation in 2024. And all Shanghai FAB will be using ASML machine even the rumored Huawei FAB (obtain 2 2nd hand NXT 1980i) as they had an established eco system.

SO where did China gets its 14nm chip? Nobody seems to talk about it anymore like yesterday news. And what about the recently finished SMIC Beijing FAB? IF we connect the dot maybe SMIC Beijing is the new 7nm domestic line that the article may have assume.

7nm line is being most used for Huawei mate 60 pro and mate 70.

Let's see if they can proceed to DUV 3nm.
Alot of folks think it can't be done under DUV

 

[ansy1968]

7nm line is being most used for Huawei mate 60 pro and mate 70.

Let's see if they can proceed to DUV 3nm.
Alot of folks think it can't be done under DUV

Sir that's my thinking too it really jive with a Chinese EUVL appearance in 2025. so we may have an all domestic line from 5nm to 3nm by 2026.

 

[tamsen_ikard]

Sir that's my thinking too it really jive with a Chinese EUVL appearance in 2025. so we may have an all domestic line from 5nm to 3nm by 2026.

If China can get Domestic EUV going with a complete domestic production of 3nm with EUV in just 2 years, it will blow the minds of the west. Right now, news articles only talk about SMEE kind of working on 28NM Lithography machine. Its also not widely shown to be used in Fabs yet. Its kind of a mystery. To go from that to having EUV in production Fab will be Sputnik level of Shock.

 

[ansy1968]

If China can get Domestic EUV going with a complete domestic production of 3nm with EUV in just 2 years, it will blow the minds of the west. Right now, news articles only talk about SMEE kind of working on 28NM Lithography machine. Its also not widely shown to be used in Fabs yet. Its kind of a mystery. To go from that to having EUV in production Fab will be Sputnik level of Shock.

Hints and clues, Liang Mong Song had stated during his famous resignation letter that 5nm and 3nm had finished its development and is waiting for the necessary equipment to verify and produced it. That was in December 2020

Liang Mong Song: SMIC's 7nm node has already completed full development, and is preparing for mass production in April 2021. Designs and most of the development for 5nm and 3nm nodes have also already been completed, only awaiting EUVL delivery at this point.​

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Dec 15, 2020 — China's biggest chipmaker SMIC said on Wednesday its board is aware that Mong-song Liang intends to resign from his co-chief executive role.

Fast forward today, there are rumors that Huawei Mate series phone will be using SMIC N+3 5nm chip late this year using NXT 2050i, Like my mentor @Oldschool had stated 3nm nodes is only possible with an EUVL and I intend to believed him, while waiting for its appearance, there are numerous scientific and private institution researching the necessary materials like mask and photoresist and major breakthrough had been achieved. So by 2025 when the Chinese EUVL is ready it can produce a commercially viable 3nm chip by 2026.

 

[tokenanalyst]

Lixin Technology's annual production of 3 billion RF chip packaging project started with a total investment of 200 million yuan​

On June 12, Lixin Technology's annual production of 3 billion RF chip packaging project officially started in Pinghu Park, Zhangjiang Yangtze River Delta Science and Technology City.

According to the news from Pinghu Xindai, the 3 billion pieces of RF chip packaging project of Lixin Technology is located in Pinghu Park of Zhangjiang Yangtze River Delta Science and Technology City, with a construction area of about 30 mu, a total investment of 200 million yuan, a total land area of 20,012.9 square meters, and a total construction area of 44,358.46 square meters. After the project is put into production, it will achieve an annual output of 3 billion pieces of RFID chip packaging products, and it is expected to achieve an annual output value of 350 million yuan after reaching full production.

It is reported that Zhangjiang Yangtze River Delta Science and Technology City Pinghu Park is dominated by manufacturing, with 113 industrial enterprises above the designated size. The average annual industrial added value accounted for more than 50% from 2021 to 2023.

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[tokenanalyst]

Tsinghua Unigroup's high-reliability chip packaging and testing project production line is put into production​

On June 12, the brand unveiling and production line opening ceremony of Wuxi Ziguang Jidian Technology Co., Ltd. was held. According to Wuxi High-tech Zone Online, the Ziguang Jidian project is a key layout project of Ziguang Group in the field of chip manufacturing, and is also an important industrial chain extension of Ziguang Guowei in the field of high-reliability chips. It plays an important role in ensuring the stability and security of the industrial chain of high-reliability chips.

Tianyancha shows that Wuxi Ziguang Jidian Technology Co., Ltd. was established on February 23, 2023. The legal representative is Li Tianchi. The registered capital is 50 million yuan and it is 100% owned by Shenzhen Guowei Electronics Co., Ltd.

Wuxi Hi-tech Zone Online News shows that based on the strategic cooperation between Wuxi Hi-tech Zone and Tsinghua Unigroup and the good integrated circuit industry supporting facilities of Wuxi Hi-tech Zone, in 2023, Shenzhen Guowei Electronics Co., Ltd., a subsidiary of Tsinghua Unigroup, decided to build a high-reliability chip packaging and testing project in Wuxi Hi-tech Zone and build a small-batch, multi-variety intelligent information high-quality reliability standard plastic packaging and ceramic packaging production line.

Tsinghua Unigroup is the largest integrated circuit company in China and the third largest mobile phone chip company in the world. Tsinghua Unigroup Guoxin Microelectronics Co., Ltd. is a core company of Tsinghua Unigroup and one of the largest listed companies in China in terms of integrated circuit design. Shenzhen Guoxin Electronics Co., Ltd., a core company of Tsinghua Unigroup, is one of the largest special integrated circuit companies in China. It is mainly engaged in the research and development, production, testing and sales services of special integrated circuits. Its products cover seven series, including microprocessors, programmable devices, memory, network buses and interfaces, analog devices, SoPC system devices and customized chips.

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[tokenanalyst]

Numerical simulation study of PIC-drift-diffusion hybrid model for multi-pulse EUV-induced hydrogen plasma​

School of Engineering Science, University of Chinese Academy of Sciences.

Abstract: Based on the PIC-drift-diffusion hybrid model, a two-dimensional column-coordinate hybrid model computational procedure suitable for EUV-induced plasma has been developed, which fully takes into account the characteristics of EUV-induced plasma, and adopts the PIC method to track the motion process of ions, and adopts the drift-diffusion model to deal with electrons rapidly entering the quasi-equilibrium state. Based on this hybrid model, the long-time dynamic evolution of multi-pulse EUV-induced H plasma is simulated. The results show that the hybrid model can accurately describe the dynamical behavior of the plasma, and also significantly improve the computational efficiency and expand the time scale. The plasma evolution shows a certain cumulative effect, with the increase of the number of EUV pulses, the average density of the H plasma gradually rises, the average kinetic energy of the electrons gradually decreases, and the flux of H ions reaching the wall gradually increases, all of which parameters tend to stabilize after the number of pulses reaches a value. In addition, the pressure of the background gas has a significant effect on the multi-pulse cumulative effect, and the plasma parameters require more pulses to reach a steady state as the background gas pressure increases.

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[sunnymaxi]

If China can get Domestic EUV going with a complete domestic production of 3nm with EUV in just 2 years, it will blow the minds of the west. Right now, news articles only talk about SMEE kind of working on 28NM Lithography machine. Its also not widely shown to be used in Fabs yet. Its kind of a mystery. To go from that to having EUV in production Fab will be Sputnik level of Shock.

your entire post is completely wrong.. its better for you if you start reading previous pages of this thread. this will definitely enhance your knowledge about China semi industry
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''SMEE working on 28nm lithography'' is years old statement.. they are still using this statement in their current articles. West is outdated with a margin.

that so called 28nm immersion Lithography machine SSA800i passed the verification test and currently pattering wafers in fab.. and its been already a year.. LOOL

and we are near the mass production of 28nm lithography machine..
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SMEE has nothing to do with EUV..
SMEE has nothing to do with EUV..
SMEE has nothing to do with EUV..

for your kind information, China is working on EUV project long before DUVi(Project 02) .. EUV progress is also faster than DUV.. this is surprise for many people..

 

[tphuang]

your entire post is completely wrong.. its better for you if you start reading previous pages of this thread. this will definitely enhance your knowledge about China semi industry
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
''SMEE working on 28nm lithography'' is years old statement.. they are still using this statement in their current articles. West is outdated with a margin.

that so called 28nm immersion Lithography machine SSA800i passed the verification test and currently pattering wafers in fab.. and its been already a year.. LOOL

and we are near the mass production of 28nm lithography machine..
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SMEE has nothing to do with EUV..
SMEE has nothing to do with EUV..
SMEE has nothing to do with EUV..

for your kind information, China is working on EUV project long before DUVi(Project 02) .. EUV progress is also faster than DUV.. this is surprise for many people..

let's correct you on one thing. EUV is not further along than DUV. However, EUV has lower criteria to use than DUV since there is no ASML alternative.

I'm pretty sure the huawei whisper is referring to DUV being in mass production. you don't need more than a couple of EUVs to start off. I would start trial production with production prototype of EUV since it's better than any DUV for advanced node