Chinese semiconductor industry

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WTAN

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ZeEa5KPul said:
HEPS is scheduled to be completed at the end of 2025; I don't see how it can be used to test SSMB in the near term
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Could you be a little more specific on what's required? The schedule shows some components being installed in 2022, but the earliest commissioning happens in 2023. Furthermore, HEPS is a scientific instrument, it won't be used industrially for EUV lithography. HEPS might certainly be used to validate and test the SSMB phenomenon, and even to develop candidate EUV optics, but it won't be used to make chips. A dedicated synchrotron will have to be built, which I believe is what the Tsinghua project is. I believe that's what we should be keeping our eye on - it seems a much simpler device for the specific EUVL purpose, not a much more complex general-purpose experimental device.

This lends weight to my initial thoughts that SSMB is more for the 2030 timeframe (perhaps a bit earlier, 2027+ if things go well). Near term (around 2024-2025), I believe LPP is a more viable candidate. I believe China will at least have one generation of LPP EUV before it transitions to synchrotron light sources.
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The Chart showing the timeline for the construction of the Synchrotron dates back to 2019. Things have changed since then and i believe the whole project has been accelerated with many articles claiming that up to 70% of certain equipment has already been installed.

The HEP Synchrotron will certainly be used for SSMB Light Source Research as other Synchrotrons in China do not have the capability or are too old.

The Chinese Academy of Sciences developed a specially made Laser to be used to manipulate electron bunches and shipped it Germany to be used at the PTB's Synchrotron also known as the Metrology Light Source which operates in Low Alpha Mode.
The CAS would certainly use this same laser at the HEP Synchrotron in Beijing for SSMB R&D.
This is why the first Prototype of the SSMB Light Source would be developed at the HEPS Synchrotron.
The Synchrotron would have 90 Beam Lines which could be leased out to interested parties for use.

Ultimately where they decide to develop the first dedicated SSMB Light Souce Facility remains unknown and depends on funding from companies like Huawei etc.
With LPP EUVL, there remains issues like boosting the Power of the CO2 Laser and also Patent issues with ASML.
China is certainly working on a LPP EUVL and i agree that there is a good chance it will come out in 2025.
 
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gelgoog

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WTAN said:
With LPP EUVL, there remains issues like boosting the Power of the CO2 Laser and also Patent issues with ASML.
China is certainly working on a LPP EUVL and i agree that there is a good chance it will come out in 2025.
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Patents are irrelevant if the product doesn't get exported. Good luck getting ASML to ban a product with patents when they don't even sell a competing product in China. They would be laughed out of court.
 
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tokenanalyst

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gelgoog said:
Patents are irrelevant if the product doesn't get exported. Good luck getting ASML to ban a product with patents when they don't even sell a competing product in China. They would be laughed out of court.
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LPP-EUV is not new, has been develop since the earlies 2000s. The Chinese has been researching LPP-EUV from a very long time and without any access to ASML machine any breakthrough is almost certainly that will be self develop and ASML will have a really hard time trying to claim any IP claims. Of course you will see the stories in Western corporate media saying "But muh Chinese hackers" and all that propaganda crap.

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Skywatcher

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WTAN said:
The Chart showing the timeline for the construction of the Synchrotron dates back to 2019. Things have changed since then and i believe the whole project has been accelerated with many articles claiming that up to 70% of certain equipment has already been installed.

The HEP Synchrotron will certainly be used for SSMB Light Source Research as other Synchrotrons in China do not have the capability or are too old.

The Chinese Academy of Sciences developed a specially made Laser to be used to manipulate electron bunches and shipped it Germany to be used at the PTB's Synchrotron also known as the Metrology Light Source which operates in Low Alpha Mode.
The CAS would certainly use this same laser at the HEP Synchrotron in Beijing for SSMB R&D.
This is why the first Prototype of the SSMB Light Source would be developed at the HEPS Synchrotron.
The Synchrotron would have 90 Beam Lines which could be leased out to interested parties for use.

Ultimately where they decide to develop the first dedicated SSMB Light Souce Facility remains unknown and depends on funding from companies like Huawei etc.
With LPP EUVL, there remains issues like boosting the Power of the CO2 Laser and also Patent issues with ASML.
China is certainly working on a LPP EUVL and i agree that there is a good chance it will come out in 2025.
Click to expand...
Isn't that CAS laser a 30 kilowatt one?
 
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Appix

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US-China tech war: Taipei, Washington on same page when it comes to curbing Beijing’s semiconductor expansion​


Non paywall:
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I do not take SCMP very seriously when it comes to military affairs and semiconductor supply chains (these require more than a journalistic accreditation to write about in sufficient terms) but nonethless will share this article.​

 
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ansy1968

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Not only TSMC is having Yield problem on its 3nm , Samsung is even worst from its 10nm, 7nm and its much vaunted 5nm , losing Qualcomm to TSMC , now I know why the Chinese didn't go with Samsung Exynos 5nm , they manipulate and doctored their result.
From this we can surmised that SMIC had come a long way, its yield of 95% from its 14nm is very impressive and nothing to laugh at, I wish SMIC give us more detail about the yield performance of its N+2 7nm BUT with Liang Mong Song at the helm, I think it will be the same as that of TSMC first gen 7nm chip(DUVL).


From PhoneArena.com:

On the heels of a report claiming that
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that it dumped Sammy for TSMC, another alarming report has surfaced. According to
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(via
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), Samsung is investigating the possibility that fraud occurred inside the company's foundry business.


Unnamed Samsung Foundry executives are being accused in the Korean media of fabricating the yield rate data achieved by Samsung Foundry for its 4nm and 5nm process node. This data, expressed as a percentage, shows how many chips in a wafer meet quality testing standards. Yesterday's report indicated that the yield for Samsung Foundry's 4nm process node was a poor 35% compared to the 70% yield achieved by rival TSMC.

Samsung's poor 4nm yield has reportedly cost it the business of building the next-generation Snapdragon AP​


The poor yield was mentioned in a report as the reason why Qualcomm supposedly replaced Samsung Foundry with TSMC for the production of next year's Snapdragon 8 Gen 2 Application Processor. The new report claims that the 4nm and 5nm yields were faked by Samsung Foundry executives to make it seem that everything was going well with the division.


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1 day ago — But Samsung is having a major issue as its yield rate for the chip is reportedly a disappointing 35%. This means that for every 100 ...
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    5 hours ago — Samsung gets caught up in a crime as the company investigates a possible fraud related to 5nm chip yieldsand missing funds.

 
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Tyler

Captain
Registered Member
antiterror13 said:
Karma
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ansy1968 said:
Not only TSMC is having Yield problem on its 3nm , Samsung is even worst from its 10nm, 7nm and its much vaunted 5nm , losing Qualcomm to TSMC , now I know why the Chinese didn't go with Samsung Exynos 5nm , they manipulate and doctored their result.
From this we can surmised that SMIC had come a long way, its yield of 95% from its 14nm is very impressive and nothing to laugh at, I wish SMIC give us more detail about the yield performance of its N+2 7nm BUT with Liang Mong Song at the helm, I think it will be the same as that of TSMC first gen 7nm chip(DUVL).


From PhoneArena.com:

On the heels of a report claiming that
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
that it dumped Sammy for TSMC, another alarming report has surfaced. According to
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
(via
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!
), Samsung is investigating the possibility that fraud occurred inside the company's foundry business.


Unnamed Samsung Foundry executives are being accused in the Korean media of fabricating the yield rate data achieved by Samsung Foundry for its 4nm and 5nm process node. This data, expressed as a percentage, shows how many chips in a wafer meet quality testing standards. Yesterday's report indicated that the yield for Samsung Foundry's 4nm process node was a poor 35% compared to the 70% yield achieved by rival TSMC.

Samsung's poor 4nm yield has reportedly cost it the business of building the next-generation Snapdragon AP​


The poor yield was mentioned in a report as the reason why Qualcomm supposedly replaced Samsung Foundry with TSMC for the production of next year's Snapdragon 8 Gen 2 Application Processor. The new report claims that the 4nm and 5nm yields were faked by Samsung Foundry executives to make it seem that everything was going well with the division.


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1 day ago — But Samsung is having a major issue as its yield rate for the chip is reportedly a disappointing 35%. This means that for every 100 ...
  • Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!




    5 hours ago — Samsung gets caught up in a crime as the company investigates a possible fraud related to 5nm chip yieldsand missing funds.
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Koreans cheating in both semiconductor and skating.
 
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