Chinese semiconductor industry

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tamsen_ikard

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Can China Leapfrog ASML in Its Quest for Semiconductor Self-Reliance?​



Is this a bad take or an accurate take?

"All these patents are, however, specifically for creating an EUV light source, rather than the machine as a whole. "

"Furthermore, the light source requires an array of gases, light collectors and amplifiers, and magnetic field technology in order to work and so far, China has been unsuccessful in the development of any of these components. It is predicted by specialists that it will take a minimum of two years for China to create these light sources. "


How far is China from a domestic EUV? 3? 5? 10? 15? I have seen them all by various people.
 

tokenanalyst

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"All these patents are, however, specifically for creating an EUV light source, rather than the machine as a whole. "
In 2017 the CIOMP and others, believe or not, tested an EUV lithography machine, tested Vacuum systems, Projection optics, hydrogen Cleaning systems, anti-vibrations systems. Including a LPP EUV light source, maybe is not as powerful as cymer but was an start.

2. Key technologies of extreme ultraviolet lithography

After years of hard work, we have broken through core unit technologies such as ultra-high-precision aspheric processing and detection, extreme ultraviolet multi-layer film, and projection objective system integration testing that have restricted the development of extreme ultraviolet lithography in our country, and successfully developed a wave aberration better than 0.75 nm RMS . The two-mirror EUV lithography objective lens system built an EUV lithography exposure device, and for the first time in China, the EUV projection lithography 32 nm line width photoresist exposure pattern was obtained. It has established a relatively complete research and development platform for key technologies of exposure optical systems, successfully completed the research content and mission objectives of major national special projects, achieved a leap in EUV optical imaging technology, and significantly improved the core optical technology level of extreme ultraviolet lithography in my country. At the same time, the implementation of the project has formed a stable research team, laying a solid technical and talent foundation for my country to achieve sustainable development in the field of next-generation lithography technology.

6. Key technologies of extreme ultraviolet lithography

We have successfully developed an exposure device based on the principle of extreme ultraviolet lithography. We have obtained the 32nm 1:1 L/S exposure pattern for the first time in China. We have successfully developed a principle prototype of the LPP-EUV light source. The conversion efficiency index is far higher than the target stated in the mission statement.

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That was between 2014-2017, like 6 years ago, wow time pass fast, so it beg the question, how much more they have achieve since?​
Apart from that UPrecission already developed an maglev dual workbench stage, which is a requirement for working in a vacuum environment.

If you search back in this thread I and others had posted a lot of patents that go beyond just the light source, for others subsystems and components of a lithography machine.

"Furthermore, the light source requires an array of gases, light collectors and amplifiers, and magnetic field technology in order to work and so far, China has been unsuccessful in the development of any of these components.
How this person know, what is develop or what is not? of course, believe me bro, they don't give any technical explanation or lead to technical sources.
It is predicted by specialists that it will take a minimum of two years for China to create these light sources. "
Which lead to this statement because 2 years is not a lot of time,


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Personally I think that the real issue that have been plaguing China lithography efforts for years could be the overlay precision technology and that was something that a guy from ASML said.
 

OppositeDay

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New High-Performance RISC-V based SSD controller

SSD Controller is slated to be one of the first mass market applications for RISC-V chips (Western Digital and Phison are also working on RISC-V designs)

A year ago I built a PC for my mom to store and process her photos. Bought a 16TB enterprise HDD to store her uncompressed 61 megapixels RAWs. I had to buy a gigantic case with optical drive slots so I could install the HDD in a suspension box to minimize noise.

And now one year later domestic RAND and controllers have gotten so cheap that a full domestic 16TB SSD is almost at price parity with a HDD of the same size. In hindsight it was one of my worst PC building decisions as my mom did have a 8TB portable HDD - enough to last her a couple of years. But it was a good thing that Chinese IC industry can surprise even optimist casual watchers like me.
 

Johnlee

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A year ago I built a PC for my mom to store and process her photos. Bought a 16TB enterprise HDD to store her uncompressed 61 megapixels RAWs. I had to buy a gigantic case with optical drive slots so I could install the HDD in a suspension box to minimize noise.

And now one year later domestic RAND and controllers have gotten so cheap that a full domestic 16TB SSD is almost at price parity with a HDD of the same size. In hindsight it was one of my worst PC building decisions as my mom did have a 8TB portable HDD - enough to last her a couple of years. But it was a good thing that Chinese IC industry can surprise even optimist casual watchers like me.
shoulda went with all nvme, this guy has 56 TB storage spread across 7x 8tb nvme

 

tphuang

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@tphuang Could you clarify your question, not sure what you are asking?
just the idea that their 21nm (G1) DRAM is actually 18nm, which points to 19nm (G3) being more advanced than 18nm. This seems to contradict what you said before, where their D1x (or as they call it 17nm) got relaxed to 18-19nm to conform to the Oct sanction guidelines
 

Blitzo

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New High-Performance RISC-V based SSD controller

SSD Controller is slated to be one of the first mass market applications for RISC-V chips (Western Digital and Phison are also working on RISC-V designs)

It was posted about two weeks ago.
Multiple pages back, and lots of more news since then.

 

hvpc

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just the idea that their 21nm (G1) DRAM is actually 18nm, which points to 19nm (G3) being more advanced than 18nm. This seems to contradict what you said before, where their D1x (or as they call it 17nm) got relaxed to 18-19nm to conform to the Oct sanction guidelines
That article probably misunderstood or misquotd the TechInsight guy. If you actually read the TechInsight report, it would be aligned with what I said.

There's clues to the misquote or misunderstanding. For example, CXMT never called their G1 as 21nm, they called it 19nm. It's TechInsight and industry that called CXMT's G1 as 21 or 22nm. It's clear that the article some how flipped flopped what CXMT claimed and what TechInsight found G1 to be.
 
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