Chinese semiconductor industry

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Pkp88

Junior Member
Registered Member
What gave you the impression this is a philosophical discussion? This is about economic warfare. And what gave you the impression that I expect someone to come to the rescue of Chinese tech? China is coming to the rescue of Chinese tech. It would be helpful if you could address what I actually write or, failing that, refrain from quoting my posts entirely.

Just because you're unaware of things happening doesn't mean they aren't happening.
I can address all non technical posts in one go (they all fall into these camps) - 1) China is too big market to ignore 2) US will eventually realize it’s mistake 3) Japan etc… will provide alternative components 4) US is being unfair this is econ warfare 5) China is really capable and US is really kidding itself 6) China should invade TW and take equipment 7) EUV syncotron thing whatever that is 8) Bro China is like 1yr away from DUV & 2-3 yrs away from EUV 9) China has a forever backlog of equipment inventory - it’s 1500 pages of this
 

ZeEa5KPul

Colonel
Registered Member
I can address all non technical posts in one go (they all fall into these camps)
Good for you, why did you quote my post? If you're so bored with this thread, don't participate in it.
China is too big market to ignore
It is, but that assumes sanity on the part of the US which is an assumption I don't make.
US will eventually realize it’s mistake
Japan etc… will provide alternative components
US is being unfair this is econ warfare
Did I say anything remotely like that, ever? If not, why are you quoting my post?
China should invade TW and take equipment
Yeah, this is, like, the complete opposite of anything I've ever said. I've advocated China destroy fabs in Taiwan (and possibly Korea) with cruise missiles if the sanctions tighten around it to an extent it can't mitigate and it can't substitute for. If China can't have advanced chips, nobody can have them.
EUV syncotron thing whatever that is
It would be worth your while to educate yourself on this (and many other things) if you want to continue participating in this thread.
China is like 1yr away from DUV & 2-3 yrs away from EUV
China already has DUV and will have better DUV next year. And China is 3 years away from EUV. It's good that you're finally learning something!
China has a forever backlog of equipment inventory
Didn't you read the articles posted about the scores of DUV lithography machines China's bought from ASML? If you have a problem with it, take it up with the authors of those articles.
 

horse

Colonel
Registered Member
Man, got to give it to them for this round. This is a Chad move.

Basically they utilised Chinese brains, Chinese infrastructure, Chinese money (i am sure they got some subsidies) to develop a cutting edge product which is then banned from selling to Chinese customers but allowed to American companies which are then going to use it for increasing their dominance in this space.

Beautiful.

Of course its still a a dumb decision for the long term but I have to admit that for short term play this stinks quite a bit for China. Anyway, lesson learned for next time I guess

Yeah, but, comrade, all the technical know-how is in the brains of all the other comrades in China.

The United States government is saying that China cannot have this H100 chip, even though it was designed in China in collaboration with an American company (with a ethnic Chinese as boss).

Like WTF?

If people could design the H100, then the same people probably can go out and design another.

Then, of course, the Americans will cry about how China stole this American blueprint designed by the same Chinese.

Maybe we are seeing the USG getting closer to peak retard?

Just an idea!

:D
 

FairAndUnbiased

Brigadier
Registered Member
Yeah, but, comrade, all the technical know-how is in the brains of all the other comrades in China.

The United States government is saying that China cannot have this H100 chip, even though it was designed in China in collaboration with an American company (with a ethnic Chinese as boss).

Like WTF?

If people could design the H100, then the same people probably can go out and design another.

Then, of course, the Americans will cry about how China stole this American blueprint designed by the same Chinese.

Maybe we are seeing the USG getting closer to peak retard?

Just an idea!

:D
big picture: they're paying high salaries to train Chinese GPU design engineers.

where do they go?

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China’s high-end GPU chip startup Biren Technology (壁仞科技) announced on February 21 that Yang Chaoyuan, the former general manager of Nvidia Shanghai, joined the company as the vice president and special assistant to the chairman.
 

horse

Colonel
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big picture: they're paying high salaries to train Chinese GPU design engineers.

where do they go?

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Yeah, exactly!

There lies the big question mark.

1) Why do this ban of that H100 chip now? This chip is developed in China, close to full completion. Now it is banned from China? Are those guys serious? Are those guy retarded?

2) Although I have not looked that website that ranked servers lately, the best servers in the world and by a lot where no one is going to catch up soon, are Chinese made. This H100 will not make a difference in the market for data center products. Why do we think Huawei was able to make so many deals across ASEAN, the Middle East, Africa, and South America, because they were providing a completion solution, the network, the data center, and any further products to do whatever you want to do, even industrial fish farming.

The people in the US government dreaming up these bans, seem unaware of the technology world at large.

:oops:
 
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tokenanalyst

Brigadier
Registered Member

Celebrate the successful delivery of Shengmei Shanghai ECP equipment 500 electroplating cavity!​

2022-8-23 16:26:19
On August 22, the 500th electroplating chamber of the Electrochemical Plating (ECP) equipment series of Shengmei Semiconductor Equipment (Shanghai) Co., Ltd. (hereinafter referred to as "Shengmei Shanghai", stock code: 688082) was delivered to customers. This is a very important milestone in the development history of Shengmei, marking a key step for Shengmei Shanghai to a new journey.

General Manager Wang Jian delivered a speech at the ceremony. He said that with the shrinking of IC circuit technology nodes and the improvement of advanced packaging integration, electroplating technology has been widely adopted, including copper, cobalt, nickel, tin-silver, gold and other metal electroplating applications. At present, more than 90% of the global electroplating equipment market is occupied by large international companies. Since its establishment in 1998, Shengmei has focused on copper interconnection technology and laid out patent achievements. It is one of the first three companies in the world to enter the field of horizontal electroplating and independently master the core technology of electroplating. Shengmei's original structural design and electroplating technology not only has global patent protection, but also fully meets customer product specifications and has cost advantages.

"With the support of the Ministry of Science and Technology's 02 major project, it has undergone industry-university-research cooperation research and development, and customer-end mass production verification. Today, Shengmei's electroplating technology has been used in the front-end dual damascene and advanced packaging, 3D TSV and third-generation semiconductor applications. A qualitative leap has been achieved respectively. Whether it is the multi-ring anode technology, the second anode technology, or the high-speed electroplating technology, they all show better performance than competitors in the customer's production line. At present, our product orders have been It has reached 67 units, with a total sales volume of more than 1.2 billion. As of today, a total of 500 electroplating cavities have been produced."

According to General Manager Wang Jian, Shengmei Shanghai's electroplating technology has passed the production line process evaluation of major semiconductor manufacturers and is applied to 55nm to 28nm, TSV, high-density fan-out packaging, conventional Pillar, RDL product production lines have all been highly praised by customers. As of December 2021, Shengmei's electroplating equipment sales accounted for 4% of the global integrated circuit electroplating market. In addition, in 2022, the company's former copper interconnect electroplating equipment and Huali Microelectronics will jointly apply, and won the achievement industrialization award of the "Integrated Circuit Industry Technology Innovation Award" sponsored by the China Integrated Circuit Innovation Alliance.

Ultra ECP map front copper interconnect electroplating equipment
Built on the company's proven Electrochemical Plating (ECP) technology, it is designed for dual damascene applications for increased productivity and reliability. The ECP electroplating system is equipped with Shengmei Shanghai's unique multi-anode local electroplating function, which allows customers to effectively control the metal copper deposition layer on the Damascus structure. The key process advantages of the equipment include excellent pattern structure filling capability, good intra- and inter-die metal film thickness uniformity, compatibility with ultra-thin seed layers below 5nm, meeting the needs of damascene electroplating at the most advanced technology nodes, and at the same time Reduce consumables and cost of ownership to ensure high productivity and uptime.

Ultra ECP ap plating equipment
This equipment can perform many key WLP plating processes, including copper bumping and high density fan-out (HDFO) processes. With a specially designed process chamber and fluid supply system, the system can maintain a strong and stable flow output for fast and uniform plating. The single-wafer horizontal plating design also eliminates the problem of cross-contamination between different baths that exists with the vertical plating design. The device excels in copper, nickel, tin, silver and gold electroplating processes.

Ultra ECP 3D Plating Equipment
This equipment can be used to fill 3D through silicon vias (TSV), and with the platform of Shengmei Semiconductor plating equipment, it can provide high-aspect ratio (HAR) TSV copper applications with high performance, no hole copper plating function. In the bottom-up filling process of high aspect ratio silicon vias, when the copper electrolyte is immersed in the electroplating solution, the vias must be completely filled without trapping any air bubbles. To speed up this process, we employ an integrated pre-wetting step. This state-of-the-art technology solution guarantees higher efficiency, plating efficiency and productivity in the manufacturing process.

Ultra ECP GIII Electroplating Equipment
This equipment supports compound semiconductor (SiC, GaN) and gallium arsenide (GaAs) wafer level packaging for copper, nickel, tin silver, and gold plating. This series of equipment can also plate gold (Au) into the backside deep hole process with better uniformity and step coverage. The Ultra ECP GIII is also equipped with a fully automated platform that supports batch processing of 6"/8" flat-edge and V-groove wafers, while incorporating Sammy's second anode and high-speed grid technology for optimal performance

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tygyg1111

Captain
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Ginger River Review writeup of risks ahead post US Nvidia restrictions:

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In the past decade, China has witnessed its chip industry heading onto the right track. If we continue with the industrial policy support, capital accumulation will become increasingly mature, and a sufficient number of talents will join the industry. Small changes will amount to a sea change eventually.

Second, we must rely on cross-border tech acquisition and international cooperation. Though the encirclement is hard to break, in Europe, Israel, and even Southeast Asia, there must be light in the cracks.

Despite endless meddling by the US, chip companies around the world don't want let go of China, which is the world's largest chip market. This is the basis for China to get an upper hand in the global chip battle.

"We might be benched for a decade." As a cutting-edge industry that requires the uttermost efforts of generations and the hard work of the whole nation, accomplishments can only be made if we let go of short-term interests and aim for the bigger picture.

Someone argued that in the 1960s, China went all out to develop "Two bombs, One satellite", and benefited tremendously from it. In the 1970s, no such effort was done in semiconductors, and it turned out to be a great loss.

When the “historical opportunity” was wasted in the 1970s, China missed the golden opportunity for development in the 1980s and 1990s under the wrong ideas of "buying beats manufacturing, and renting beats buying." As a result, China’s chip industry was merely a huge market and a source of profit for foreign investors over several decades.

The signing of the chips bill indicates to some extent that the future global chip industry landscape will shift from free market competition to an arms race, from a global division of labor to domestic circulation.

The encirclement around China's chip industry is increasingly tightening. To succeed in "counter-encirclement", the country must pull together and work hard.
 

olalavn

Senior Member
Registered Member
20 domestic GPU manufacturers

Core GPU: Zhaoxin, Loongson, Feiteng, Lingjiu, Xiangteng

Independent GPU: Innosilicon, Granfi, Jingjiawei

MBXY-CR-e647b5a2849cf897d1bc89a014358da3.jpgMBXY-CR-c7ce33cd84da19f5ef8a8984ac96ba11.jpg
The current domestic GPU industry chain import substitution: In the design phase, Jingjiawei, Innosilicon, Moore Thread, and Muxi Technology are constantly catching up.
 
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