Chinese purchase of Su-35

AndrewS

Brigadier
Registered Member
I think people missed the point that Su-35 is the perfect "blue army" to mimic India's "super sukhoi" for both China and Pakistan. (and for that matter, Su-35 is more advanced than what Vietnam can buy)

Actually, if you look at the wing-loading and thrust-weight ratios which determine agility, the Su-35 is closer? to F-22 levels.

And if China is going to create a "blue air force", it is the F-22 that China needs to train against.
 

Air Force Brat

Brigadier
Super Moderator
Actually, if you look at the wing-loading and thrust-weight ratios which determine agility, the Su-35 is closer? to F-22 levels.

And if China is going to create a "blue air force", it is the F-22 that China needs to train against.

Very true, and the SU-35 and SU-57 are two aircraft who's agility is on par with the F-22,,, but they would be very expensive if just for "blue force", the SU-35s represent capability "NOW". China has suddenly realized it needs more immediate capability with the totally different approach of the Trump administration, particularly with regard to the SCS and ECS operations. I think we should expect to see these aircraft operating on the East Coast,, maybe 12 East, and 12 West???
 

plawolf

Lieutenant General
I think people missed the point that Su-35 is the perfect "blue army" to mimic India's "super sukhoi" for both China and Pakistan. (and for that matter, Su-35 is more advanced than what Vietnam can buy)

China honestly doesn’t care remotely enough about India to bother training to fight them.

There is only one force the Chinese would train to fight against, because they are the best. But that ain’t India by a long shot.

Su35s would be poor stand-ins for Raptors, because enough if they could simulate the Raptor in WVR, that would be an extremely niche area to train on since it would be a poor raptor pilot indeed to allow legacy fighters to close within WVR on an equal footing.

For 99% of combat against Raptors and other stealths, the fight is decided in BVR, and stealths should only close with WVR to mop up what is left, and even then should still be maximising their stealth to try and come in from behind or the flanks of the enemy for easy kills rather than charge in head on for a proper fight.
 

b787

Captain
I think people missed the point that Su-35 is the perfect "blue army" to mimic India's "super sukhoi" for both China and Pakistan. (and for that matter, Su-35 is more advanced than what Vietnam can buy)
"This question, as far as I know, was raised in St Petersburg between President (Vladimir) Putin and esteemed Prime Minister(Narendra) Modi (last month). The Indian Prime minister once again reiterated that the Indian side needs time to evaluate it's strategy of development and how to spend money," Kladov said.

"The package is there. We are offering the package of modernising the Su-30 aircraft. It will obtain new capabilities, it will be very close to the fifth generation aircraft ..
This is a deep modernisation everything should be changed, radar engine etc," he said.


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to mimic? No it is business as usual, China buys 24 Su-35, India upgrade 200 Su-30MKI, then China either buys more Su-35s or upgrade its aircraft with what?

New Su-30MKI will have a new engine and an AESA radar, uhmmm let me see. you arm one side the other has to arm too.


Russia to Upgrade India's Frontline Fighter Jet Su-30MKI Into Super Sukhoi
© AP PHOTO / AJIT KUMAR
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11: 30 24.10.2017Get short URL
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5040337
From new sensors to radars, the fleet will see a major change in the cockpit as well. The two-stage modernization program will cost approximately US $6 billion.

NEW DELHI (Sputnik) — Indian Air Force's most formidable fleet of fighter jet Su-30MKI is gearing up for a complete overhaul of weapons and
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which will lend the aircraft unmatched stealth features. The upgrade is being carried out by Russian agencies in collaboration with the Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL).

"We will start the
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upgrade program as soon as possible to bring in new weapons and avionics to make the fleet more potent," T Suvarna Raju, chairman and managing director of HAL said on Monday.

Earlier this year, Russia's Unique Engine Corporation had offered a whole new engine for the fleet.

"We have developed a better successor to the AL-31F engine based on a new design and has been offered to IAF as part of the upgrade package," Alexander Artyukhov, the director of United Engine Corporation, had told the media at Aero India 2017.

The AL-41F-1S is a brand new engine, which produces 18 percent more thrust than its predecessor.
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AndrewS

Brigadier
Registered Member
Very true, and the SU-35 and SU-57 are two aircraft who's agility is on par with the F-22,,, but they would be very expensive if just for "blue force", the SU-35s represent capability "NOW". China has suddenly realized it needs more immediate capability with the totally different approach of the Trump administration, particularly with regard to the SCS and ECS operations. I think we should expect to see these aircraft operating on the East Coast,, maybe 12 East, and 12 West???

$2 Billion for 24 Su-35 works out as $83 Million each.

Given that it includes some support, that is likely near their actual cost. So they don't appear to be overpriced.
 
Well, you're directly contradicting sources we have on the Su-35 deal then.


According to sources, if I recall correctly, China only wanted 12 planes. Clearly they wanted some planes, but clearly they also didn't want too many.


What would China reverse engineer from the Su-35? They've already reached parity in most of their technologies. What external factors would result in an imminent need?

Per my previous posts:
- Yes.
- Sources also say that the deal was about components at first but Russia made the deal about planes instead.
- Foreign military meddling or instigating war around or with China.
 

Hyperwarp

Captain
Is that what I think it is? Or is it a Russian AF one?

upload_2017-11-10_18-37-21-jpeg.436048
 
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