Chinese purchase of Su-35

siegecrossbow said:

Does standard meant that it isn't a monkey model?

If the deal actually gets through, I hope that China will use indigenous radar and avionics and modify it so that it is compatible with domestic armament.

Click to expand...

Built to the Russian Air Force Standard, not modified in any way to accommodate Chinese weapons or avionics,,, this deal ain't gonna happen ever, and why would it?? The Chinese Flankers are likely much higher in quality, and if the Chinese wanted the F-117, I'm sure the Russians would sell them? I mean really, if China wanted the engines, they would buy them? no reason to buy an airplane that you yourself can build to your standards, not just taking something that doesn't meet your needs? at one time this may have been considered, but no more.

Zool said:

That's funny, because I remember the same thing! I also remember similar comments to this over the last couple of years now - Boris Bregman: "I think that the contract will be signed at the end of 2014 or at the beginning of 2015,". And they always include a similar 'slippage clause' of the deal moving into sometime the following year.

At this point I would be less shocked to see J-20 flying with WS-15 at the beginning of 2015, then I would at this deal being closed.

Click to expand...

The Su-35 deal will only be closed in Russia's DREAM !!

siegecrossbow said:

Does standard meant that it isn't a monkey model?

If the deal actually gets through, I hope that China will use indigenous radar and avionics and modify it so that it is compatible with domestic armament.

Click to expand...

Makes sense only if the deal includes more than 24 Su-35s.

A Bar Brother said:

Makes sense only if the deal includes more than 24 Su-35s.

Click to expand...

Aint gonna happen.

The Chinese made it clear 2 years ago, that if they are ever going to buy the Su-35, it will be for the 117S engine, and they are NOT willing to buy more than 24 Su-35 for that engine, since the current Chinese engines are only about 5 years away from reaching 117S' performance.

Russia desperately wanted to sell Su-35 for several reasons:

1. No body, literately NO ONE has bought the Su-35. Su-35's export is currently ZERO !! Russia need to export Su-35 to China so that other countries will believe that Su-35 is even worth it to buy, otherwise Su-35's export order will remain to be ZERO !!

2. Russia want to sell 48 but China only wants 4, so the two reached an ongoing talk for 24 that's been dragging on for nearly 5 years !!!

Russians can keep dreaming about this deal !

At this point, it looks to me that the much heralded purchase of Su-35 is simply a PR ploy by the Russians to show that their gears are still up to snuff.

As we all know, Chinese purchase of Russian hardware have slowed to a trickle in the past 7 or 8 years. A dangerous perception had been formed that the Russian defense industry is rapidly losing competitiveness.

The Russians are fighting to reverse that perception. Their periodic announcements of an imminent Chinese purchase of Su-35 is a part of their perception management campaign, to show that their products are still wanted and needed. This is one of the oldest tricks in the public relations playbook.

To me, Russia's spin tactic is getting laughably desperate and simply embarrassing. Just stop it. Have some pride. Please.

The original talk came up because PLAAF indeed want the aircraft. Imo, it makes less and less sense for them to make this deal with each passing day. But the reason that these news articles are still coming out is because discussions are still ongoing. If China is stopping discussions, we won't hear about it anymore.

The theme song for the Chinese Su35 deal should be 'tomorrow', because the deal is always 'only a day away' apparently.

Tyloe said:

I don't know the entire history about the delays of the deal but does anyone think that this news has good or solid credibility?

Click to expand...

My opinion is that the Russians keep this hot and on the front burner, hoping that somebody will buy this bird. For all the bluster and bravado, there seems to be very little real interest from the Chinese side. I am rather certain that their might have been at one time, but that time has come and gone. Would they like an F-117S, I would think they would love one, I would, I bet the Russians would sell them, but they won't be cheap. I think with the advent of the F-35 without OVT, that everyones interest in OVT has lessened except for the Russians.

As our own engineer has told us time and again, OVT is not worth the loss of thrust, extra maintenance, weight, and money, I am a slow learner, but apart from the F-22, we've never fielded a production aircraft with OVT? and the F-117 without OVT would make a nice rumble in several aircraft???

I think the Chinese are just humoring the Russians by playing coy???

Actually I am very interested... more at how many of the Su-35 did the Russian buy till now (I believe up till today... only around 30 plus have been built), and how many more would the Russian be interested to buy and built for themselves.

Even if the Chinese are indeed interested in buying and signed a deal with the Russian, can the Russian fulfill the number in... say 2015 or 2016. If they cannot, and production is going to drag into 2018 or more, isn't it too close to when the Chinese's J-20 and most probably J-31 too is going to be operational? In view of that... so I can say that the interest in this deal is dwindling with every year pass and don't really think it is going to get through, unless something unforeseen happened (say the J-20 project hit a rock and must be scrapped)... it ain't gonna happen.

Finally... the Su-35's fate itself in Russian's inventory for the matter of fact is also going to be a bit shaky too... seeing that development is already so long and up till now... only around 30 plus are built and the T-50 on the other hand are about to come online.

rhino123 said:

Finally... the Su-35's fate itself in Russian's inventory for the matter of fact is also going to be a bit shaky too... seeing that development is already so long and up till now... only around 30 plus are built and the T-50 on the other hand are about to come online.

Click to expand...

Su-35 will be used alongside PAK FA, that is certain . There are plans to upgrade it with L-band radar in wings (it already has L-band interrogator there) so it could detect 5th gen fighters in f-35 class. Overall, Russia doesn't have funds to replace all of its fleet with 5th gen fighters, and yet what they have now would need replacement in 10-15 years. Therefore, you have projects like Mig-35 and Su-35 running alongside PAK FA .

As for China, situation is somewhat different . There are two project right now (J-20 and J-31) plus 4.5 gen planes like J-10B , J-11B , J-16 etc On the other hand, we have lot of older planes still flying (J-7 etc ) , therefore Su-35 would certainly have its place in PLAAF if China decides to purchase it .