Hold up....Lantern Festival greetings from AECC.
I counted 24 fan blades. The CFM-56-5 models, which allegedly the WS-20 is based off on, also have 24 fan blades.
Am I reading too much into this, or is it a hint about the WS-20?
Chinese Engine Development
- Thread starter jackbh
- Start date
I counted 24 fan blades. The CFM-56-5 models, which allegedly the WS-20 is based off on, also have 24 fan blades.
Am I reading too much into this, or is it a hint about the WS-20?
lcloo
Captain
If you believe in hints, there is another one, i.e. "XX". one X is 10, two X, or Roman numeral XX is 20. You can find them on the illustrated engine.
These feel to nuanced to be a coincidence, don't you think?
Pardon me, i m posting this late but this is very significant. AECC gave the biggest hint so far..
AECC wishes Lunar Happy New year to All Chinese people with Engines posters.
Last year Order was, Taihang was on first day of Lunar month , AEF-1300 on the second day of Lunar month and 30kg/s flow rate gas turbine on Third day of Lunar month..
This year Order is like
CJ-2000 is for day1
CJ-1000 is for day2
AEP-500 is for day3
All heavyweights AECC mentioned with order wise. this is another strong hint, where AECC is looking for in near future..
and @by78 posted ''Lantern Festival greetings'' from AECC with allegedly the WS-20 on front ..
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so in span of 14 days, AECC posted all heavyweights for the first time. the biggest surprise for me is CJ-2000 on top of the list.
according to my interpretation this year first Engineering prototype of CJ-2000 will complete the assembling process.. CJ-1000 further push for more air testing and AEP-500 will be completed too. and WS-20 will enter in service this year..
let see ..
@Alfa_Particle ..
AECC wishes Lunar Happy New year to All Chinese people with Engines posters.
Last year Order was, Taihang was on first day of Lunar month , AEF-1300 on the second day of Lunar month and 30kg/s flow rate gas turbine on Third day of Lunar month..
This year Order is like
CJ-2000 is for day1
CJ-1000 is for day2
AEP-500 is for day3
All heavyweights AECC mentioned with order wise. this is another strong hint, where AECC is looking for in near future..
and @by78 posted ''Lantern Festival greetings'' from AECC with allegedly the WS-20 on front ..
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
so in span of 14 days, AECC posted all heavyweights for the first time. the biggest surprise for me is CJ-2000 on top of the list.
according to my interpretation this year first Engineering prototype of CJ-2000 will complete the assembling process.. CJ-1000 further push for more air testing and AEP-500 will be completed too. and WS-20 will enter in service this year..
let see ..
@Alfa_Particle ..
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To compliment your post, here's a CJ-1000A with revamped titanium-leading edge composites fan blades.
manqiangrexue
Brigadier
From what I understand, the reason for which it is years behind schedule is that the WS-10 later variants proved to be superior than what had been originally planned, to the point where they would nearly overlap with the initially projected design and power of the WS-15. This caused the WS-15 to undergo redesign into a more powerful engine in order for it to be substantially better than the WS-10 and this redesign is the reason it is years behind the initial projection. If it's true, then it's basically the best reason for it to be behind, perhaps even better than being on time.years behind the schedule, I cannt call it very smoothy``````product defective rate is one of the problems, it drives-up production cost and brings down reliability. But the development as a whole appears better than what we had with WS-10's
anyway good to see one senior member from PDF```
Regarding performance of WS-15. We can guessitimate where Chinese military turbofan industry is at by looking at WS-20, which is on a similar schedule (first flight on Y-20 in 2022 vs first flight on J-20 in 2023 for WS-15) but has more public information available. The consensus seems to be WS-20 is comparable to early-mid 1990s CFM-56 variants. I wouldn't be surprised if WS-15 has worse performance parameters than F-119 which first flew in late 1990s.
this is completely wrong.
just tell me one thing, what materials were available back in 1990 and what material and manufacturing techniques available right now ? its day and night difference..
AECC confirmed in march, 2023. we have not yet selected the material of WS-20.. i believe material and components have selected now and they choose best available option right now in China. AECC also developed civil version of WS-20 called AEF-1300 with better components in context with fuel consumption..
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there are three process that can define the ENGINE efficiency and performance
1. engine cycle design (that’s things like the number of fan compressor and turbine stages, and mechanical efficiency of the turbine, etc).
2. material quality, which determines “how hard and fast and hot can run this engine
3. and the most important is your production process quality.
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just because WS-20 derived from WS-10, and WS-10 itself share same core with CFM. doesn't mean WS-20 performance will be like early 1990's engines. we are living in 2024. China evolving at unprecedented speed. Gas turbine industry is one of the examples.
same with WS-15, an Engine developed in 21st century and again redesigned in 2018 just to increase the technological parameters. early WS-15 targeted 150kn-155kn maximum thrust but that plan totally scrapped. this is a reborn WS-15 what we are currently watching..
WS-15 definitely will be better than F-119 in TIT/Thrust and other parameters. but Engine life span , MBTO , durability. can't say anything. only time will tell.. but WS-15 will be a very advanced machine confirmed by many inside source.
I don’t understand your logic here. What do you consider the most important aspects of a transport aircraft engine, such as the WS-20? Do you really think those are the same set of characteristics for a fighter engine? If my son is doing better at math than the rest of class, he must also perform better in English literature, music, art, and even sports? If the answer is yes, thank you so much then
As I said I was trying to make a guessitimate on WS-15 based on public information without relying on supposed insiders or academic papers that are open to multiple interpretations. Things like fan blades construction on WS-20 display models at air shows are public information, where not much information about WS-15 itself are public except nozzles and such.
In this case I think it's reasonable to extrapolate from what we know about WS-20 to the overall progress of the industry and then extrapolate again to WS-15. It's not good but it's the best we have if we want to rely only on public information. If I am to use a Bayesian model I'm going to set my prior to something like 70% likely it's slightly worse than F-119 and update from that using supposed insider information or journal article based on credence I assign to the sources.