Chinese Economics Thread

[AssassinsMace]

Who said China commits no wrongs and is perfect? No one. Just because there's resistance to hypocrisy doesn't mean Chinese are arrogant. Arrogance is those who dictate rules but believe they don't have to follow them themselves.

 

[Blitzo]

Im Chinese and its certainly not my point of view and as Typhung said earlier, some criticisms of Chinese actions are deserved

Not wanting to get too personal, and I'm certainly not saying that Blade is like so, but it's interesting to note that many people who are against china outside of the People's Republic are actually Chinese.

Also, just before the mod's stop the undeniably interesting discussion, I'd like to say thank you to A-mace as , it's nice to see that a few general ideas about things are shared among people (SDF should get the "thank you for your post" function that is used on PDF as a thought), espicially about the hypocrisy part.

 

[bladerunner]

And do you see India being vilified like China is for organ transplants for sale? That is not being used as propaganda for anti-India politics in the West.

YES

I just saw a TV news story about Westerners as organ brokers that go to China and India and offer people on the street money for their kidneys for Westerners. And this business doesn't involve the governments of these countries. It's purely Westerners doing all the brokering on their own.

and I saw one where it was entirely indian Brokers

The cart before the horse? Another kick the can analogy?

Actually its a idiom which I think I used incorrectly. Maybe I should have said "what comes first, the chicken or the egg?' which is a way of pointing out the futility of identifying the first case of a circulur cause and consequence

Did I tell you to? I'm not trying to convince you of anything.

NO you didnt, but on the other hand, my original comment wasnt directed at you. Anyway as this is is a Forum where views can be expressed, im merely doing that.
Which reminds me I wonder if the Chinese company , managed to acquire a major share holding in the Australian rare earth processing company, in its attempts to achieve total dominance in this industry. I think its a bad if they were successful and allowed to have their way.

Uh yes. Because if you go back to your posts in here you seem to never have give China a break. Someone counters you then there's always another spin or angle you'll take to spell out something negatiive about China while at the same time giving the West a pass.

Its a Forum where a interchange of points to support ones views is the norm, is it not? The reason for my silence on the past and present practices of the WEst is because I think its pointless in a forum frequented by mainly people of Asian origin. I use to lamblast the West in the Economist using the name Sam8. BUt Ive been warned by the editorial staff to tone it down or Ill be barred so I havent posted there for a while.
Hey ........... Im hard on China because I would like to see it do well and with integrety , but I wonder if some of this self congratulations is not a little premature as China still has a long way to go.

But that wasn't the case. The environmentalists spread false information. So if the examples you expressed makes you believe it to be possibly then this example shows that your example could be lies to spread false information as well.

Believe what you want but if you get the chance , ask any Western NZder their views on Asian seafood acquiring practices. Dont be surprised with a load of swearing.

Tell that to the anti-China propagandists who say China is totally responsible for that masscare. I'm sure many of the anti-China environmentalists upset that China doesn't blindly obey their orders believe it.

You give too much importance to their views

As an afterthought directed at members who think that China should be able to continue with the past practices of the West. Would members who were following the car in front for directions, see it take a wrong turning, and drive off the road and over the cliff, do the same thing?

 

[Blitzo]

As an afterthought directed at members who think that China should be able to continue with the past practices of the West. Would members who were following the car in front for directions, saw it take a wrong turning, and drive off the road and over the cliff, do the same thing?

On the car thing, obviously not. But I get the drift of what you mean as continuing with some past practices of the West.

I personally think that though China shouldn't follow the bad practices of the West, I also feel that the West shouldn't have a right to criticise actions which China take which the West already has taken (i.e.: pollution due to industrialization, the whole "colonial china and tibet/xinjiang" thing).

Basically, many Chinese people, feel that the West are hypocrites for criticising China due to the fact they've already done the mistake themselves (in some situations, which I can't think of any examples right now). Some feel that the West are kind of "zhan pian yi" (don't know the chinese characters right now), which basically translating to getting a cheap sale. Some of the West's actions which have led to them getting more wealthy/successful in the past, and if China does something similar, then the west would criticize it and Chinese people then feel their country isn't getting the same rights as the West had gotten before. The whole "cheap sale" thing, goes to the idea that the West was able to get away with things in the past before international laws, in which they didn't get punished much by anyone, but continued with their (arguably) abusive actions, therefore getting a "cheap sale".

This doesn't necessarily reflect my view, but my parents for one, believe this idea to an extent.
I just think that IF China does take a route which the west already has, then the west shouldn't criticize it so aggressively, or portray it so badly in the media, but rather be a bit less angus.

 

[bladerunner]

Who said China commits no wrongs and is perfect? No one. Just because there's resistance to hypocrisy doesn't mean Chinese are arrogant. Arrogance is those who dictate rules but believe they don't have to follow them themselves.

I dont think the West have a monopoly on hypocrisy

 

[bladerunner]

On the car thing, obviously not. But I get the drift of what you mean as continuing with some past practices of the West.

I personally think that though China shouldn't follow the bad practices of the West, I also feel that the West shouldn't have a right to criticise actions which China take which the West already has taken (i.e.: pollution due to industrialization, the whole "colonial china and tibet/xinjiang" thing).

Basically, many Chinese people, feel that the West are hypocrites for criticising China due to the fact they've already done the mistake themselves (in some situations, which I can't think of any examples right now). Some feel that the West are kind of "zhan pian yi" (don't know the chinese characters right now), which basically translating to getting a cheap sale. Some of the West's actions which have led to them getting more wealthy/successful in the past, and if China does something similar, then the west would criticize it and Chinese people then feel their country isn't getting the same rights as the West had gotten before. The whole "cheap sale" thing, goes to the idea that the West was able to get away with things in the past before international laws, in which they didn't get punished much by anyone, but continued with their (arguably) abusive actions, therefore getting a "cheap sale".

This doesn't necessarily reflect my view, but my parents for one, believe this idea to an extent.
I just think that IF China does take a route which the west already has, then the west shouldn't criticize it so aggressively, or portray it so badly in the media, but rather be a bit less angus.

Ah Ha your post clarifies a few things for me... thanks
Meanwhile theres an awful lot of unemployed Westerners, who think that going into China was a mistake. Im sure you are well aware of that so theres no need for a expanded rant

IM listening to Kerry Woodham on ZB talkback radio, and they criticising these pretty little Asian/but really chinese girls that like play chicken on the pedestrian crossing.They wait there and just b4 you hit the crossing, they run out holding hands and gigling. What a craze, if theyre not careful theyre gonna get splattered on the road while wearing their hello kitty tee shirts.

 

[bladerunner]

After all the discussion and debate, is it safe for me to state the following:

Humanity = greed, as long as China can produce goods cheaper, no amount of critics or scientific article can actually hurt Chinese products?

Would anyone in this forums be prepared to buy any similar products at double the price because it is environmentaly friendly, produced locally etc?

If you are? what percentage of the population are you representing?

Depending on what it is and why, I would. But on the other hand Ive bought a heap of Chinese made products. Recently I bought a Chinese skill saw sold under the G Force Brand by one of our super duper hardware outlets.
I wanted to cut some roofing iron and using a skill saw with the blade reversed was the cheapest option. It cost me $50 and was prepared to throw it away after about 5minutes use. Trouble was it never worked at all
I couldnt take it back because I threw the receipt away b4 I got home

Its amazing how many ex PRC immigrants have non Chinese made products in their household. Panasonic Sony Samsung Nokia seem to be the order of the day, even some well to do in China by foreign brands.

 

[Engineer]

Would members who were following the car in front for directions, see it take a wrong turning, and drive off the road and over the cliff, do the same thing?

Yes, I would, when it is a fact that driving off the cliff achieves and is the only way to achieve success.

 

[Damingli85]

Was the saw the cheapest saw though? My dad use to buy tools that were cheap and made in China. I remember once that he bought a bunch of Chinese made drill bits, I think he bought 20 of them, and after about 15 nails all the drill bits got worn out. However I don't think it is just the Chinese origin that is the problem, however it is also the cheap factor.

Also its not that we choose to buy non-Chinese brands here, its more that we don't have a choice. I mean they don't sell Chinese TVs or computers or whatever.

Also I don't know if you guys hit this yet, but with the tire tariffs, I highly doubt there will be a trade war, because China can't afford to go against US in a trade war. China is not economically or politically stable for it.

 

[bladerunner]

Was the saw the cheapest saw though? My dad use to buy tools that were cheap and made in China. I remember once that he bought a bunch of Chinese made drill bits, I think he bought 20 of them, and after about 15 nails all the drill bits got worn out. However I don't think it is just the Chinese origin that is the problem, however it is also the cheap factor.

Also its not that we choose to buy non-Chinese brands here, its more that we don't have a choice. I mean they don't sell Chinese TVs or computers or whatever.

.

It was the cheapest Skill saw avaliable, the next one was about $70 odd, Black and Deca about $100, with Japanese brands, several hundred.


No Chinese TV's??> I ve got a chinese LCD.TV Soniq in the rumpus room, with a SONIQ DVD Recorder. Ive had them for a couple of yrs now and they are still going strong , no problems , with the tv used to play PS3 games it gets alot of use.

Overhere we have a 'consumers guarantee act" which overides the manufacturers guarantee.. This works under the premise of reasonable expectation. So although any product from a car to anything bought new has a extended warranty, to the length of what the customer thinks the product should last for.

A car brand new comes with say a 2year warranty or 50k, but in reality when one buys a brand new car and has it regularly serviced, he might expect the car to last twice as long as the manufacturers guarantee without any problems, and thats what he will get.
Basically Id hate to be a retailer here, Ive taken items back that only had 1 yr gaurantee after 4yrs use and had it fixed for nothing or partial refund. All I have to tell them the law cite the act etc etc.

A lot of the speciality computer stores are owner operated Asian owned ones
the workers in my local one suddenly develop language barrier problems when I walk in (oh no here he comes quick shop I guess is what they are saying)

On that occassion I was taking back a 3yr old Western Digital 160 gig Hard drive which had completely packed up. After a bit of Haggling and $80 on my part they gave me aI terabyte hardrive.. Sweet seeing we have to pay $180-250 for them depending on brand