Chinese Economics Thread

[SamuraiBlue]

Does it matter if it is deliberate? It is still protectionist either way.

No since Japan had no intention of manipulating the Yen against other foreign currencies unlike other nations who are accused of.Protectionist protects products that cannot compete in the market. Tell me if Japanese cars can or cannot compete in the global market.

Are you not happy?

Why?
It's a common known fact even in mainland China. You can see the large Mitsubishi emblem stamped on the engine.

 

[broadsword]

No since Japan had no intention of manipulating the Yen against other foreign currencies unlike other nations who are accused of.Protectionist protects products that cannot compete in the market. Tell me if Japanese cars can or cannot compete in the global market.

Don't shift the goal post. We are contending about protectionist policies of Japan and China, not about whether Japanese cars can be sold elsewhere. The fact is Yen depreciation of 45% since 2011 aids its protectionism.

Why?
It's a common known fact even in mainland China. You can see the large Mitsubishi emblem stamped on the engine.

But are you disappointed or angry that Geely cars are using Mitsubishi engines legally? Because your
comment:

As for engine design yes, I believe one of the Japanese companies filed a complaint. Better still I believe many of the Geely models still installs Mitsubishi engines. Basically PRC is still not at the level of designing their own engines that can rival first tier overseas competition.

sounds like Geely is doing something illegal and you are hurt about it.

 

[SamuraiBlue]

Don't shift the goal post. We are contending about protectionist policies of Japan and China, not about whether Japanese cars can be sold elsewhere. The fact is Yen depreciation of 45% since 2011 aids its protectionism.

Am I?
Basically the yen is considered the safe heaven currency when things go sideway.
3.11.2011 have you ever heard of it?
It the day the of the East Japan earthquake that devastated half of Japan. It was also the time Japanese yen struck gold for investors since they knew they are going to cash in big with all the undelivered components that was required through out the world. Japan is the linchpin of global supply chain and investors basically poured money into yen so they can hit big when those manufacturers wanting their supply and was willing to pay top money to obtain essential parts so those manufacturers can place their products into the market more then their competitors.
Guess what?
Japanese component makers denied providing parts until they were back to capacity in fulfilling the demands. That is why there was little confusion to the market in general and no single manufacturer gained in large.Japanese component manufacturers gain zero profit out of this financial scam created by the investors since they did not ask premiums from companies that wanted to be served first. They made quoted at same rate.

But are you disappointed or angry that Geely cars are using Mitsubishi engines legally? Because your
comment:

sounds like Geely is doing something illegal and you are hurt about it.

No, have I ever pointed Geely?

It still shows that PRC auto manufacturers are not ready to compete against other auto manufacturers that dominate the top tier though.

 

[Equation]

I'll answer both with one answer, Toyota and Honda are the largest exporters of cars built in the US.
They offer bigger contribution to the US economy and hire more employees then the Big Three. Their subsidiaries are also big contributors to the US in terms of Exporting goods and employing people.CEO of Toyota made that abundantly clear to Mr. Trump.
As for engine design yes, I believe one of the Japanese companies filed a complaint. Better still I believe many of the Geely models still installs Mitsubishi engines. Basically PRC is still not at the level of designing their own engines that can rival first tier overseas competition.

And they both Honda and Toyota come with defective Takata air bags that kills people. Chinese design engines are getting better therefore are making many Japanese car maker nervous. Is that why the Japanese government paid some British media to print bad things about China?

After five years they will seriously regret their choice once their batteries starts to fail. Nothing against Chinese EVs but we all know that capacity of batteries degrades over the years and cannot hold up half the capacity after five years. It's going to cost an arm and a leg to replace those batteries.
Basically EVs are a stop gaps until fuel cells become main stream(or people comes up with batteries that can maintain capacity over extend periods).

You are already assuming that China's electric vehicle are already inferior to Japan's when the number says other wise. With Japanese government poor behavior lately nobody in China (an important market Japan can't live without) would want to buy an electric car from Japan anytime soon, even with an already small number. China is also on pace to take over the global market for producing batteries for electric cars.

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[Equation]

Am I?
Basically the yen is considered the safe heaven currency when things go sideway.
3.11.2011 have you ever heard of it?
It the day the of the East Japan earthquake that devastated half of Japan. It was also the time Japanese yen struck gold for investors since they knew they are going to cash in big with all the undelivered components that was required through out the world. Japan is the linchpin of global supply chain and investors basically poured money into yen so they can hit big when those manufacturers wanting their supply and was willing to pay top money to obtain essential parts so those manufacturers can place their products into the market more then their competitors.
Guess what?
Japanese component makers denied providing parts until they were back to capacity in fulfilling the demands. That is why there was little confusion to the market in general and no single manufacturer gained in large.Japanese component manufacturers gain zero profit out of this financial scam created by the investors since they did not ask premiums from companies that wanted to be served first. They made quoted at same rate.



No, have I ever pointed Geely?

It still shows that PRC auto manufacturers are not ready to compete against other auto manufacturers that dominate the top tier though.

Yeah but they won't dominate for long or forever. Geely on the other hand has plenty of room to grow world wide and as well as in China alone.

 

[nugroho]

I'll answer both with one answer, Toyota and Honda are the largest exporters of cars built in the US.
They offer bigger contribution to the US economy and hire more employees then the Big Three. Their subsidiaries are also big contributors to the US in terms of Exporting goods and employing people.CEO of Toyota made that abundantly clear to Mr. Trump.
As for engine design yes, I believe one of the Japanese companies filed a complaint. Better still I believe many of the Geely models still installs Mitsubishi engines. Basically PRC is still not at the level of designing their own engines that can rival first tier overseas competition.

geely has many car type, most of them use "volvo"
can you name what type of geely car that still use mitsubishi nowadays?

 

[broadsword]

https://www.sinodefenceforum.com/chinese-economics-thread.t3715/page-698#post-445932

Am I?
Basically the yen is considered the safe heaven currency when things go sideway.
3.11.2011 have you ever heard of it?
It the day the of the East Japan earthquake that devastated half of Japan. It was also the time Japanese yen struck gold for investors since they knew they are going to cash in big with all the undelivered components that was required through out the world. Japan is the linchpin of global supply chain and investors basically poured money into yen so they can hit big when those manufacturers wanting their supply and was willing to pay top money to obtain essential parts so those manufacturers can place their products into the market more then their competitors.
Guess what?
Japanese component makers denied providing parts until they were back to capacity in fulfilling the demands. That is why there was little confusion to the market in general and no single manufacturer gained in large.Japanese component manufacturers gain zero profit out of this financial scam created by the investors since they did not ask premiums from companies that wanted to be served first. They made quoted at same rate.

So 45% depreciation help the domestic industries, right?

It still shows that PRC auto manufacturers are not ready to compete against other auto manufacturers that dominate the top tier though.

We are not contending on that. Don't deviate from the PROTECTIONIST issue.

No, have I ever pointed Geely?

Maybe, I misunderstood you. But can you shed more light on this, with a link preferably?

As for engine design yes, I believe one of the Japanese companies filed a complaint

 

[broadsword]

After five years they will seriously regret their choice once their batteries starts to fail. Nothing against Chinese EVs but we all know that capacity of batteries degrades over the years and cannot hold up half the capacity after five years. It's going to cost an arm and a leg to replace those batteries.

Are you able to back your claims with studies? Your claims are equivalent to saying no one has done a cost-benefit analysis on the viability of using electric vehicles over the long term.

Basically EVs are a stop gaps until fuel cells become main stream(or people comes up with batteries that can maintain capacity over extend periods).

The Chinese government is not putting all eggs in one basket. It is also devoting some resources to hydrogen power.

 

[Equation]

It looks like China is ready for the next Mega city build out.

Here's how much more steel China will need for its new megacity

China [/a]'s new project to

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will drive steel demand, with the country likely gobbling up an extra 12 to 14 million metric tons of the

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a year if plans are implemented in 10 years, Citi Research analysts said in a note released on Tuesday.

While the amount will just be a minuscule proportion of the nearly 1.63 billion tons in global crude steel production last year according to the World Steel Association, it will nonetheless provide "greater certainty on continuation of Chinese steel demand at high levels," wrote Citi analysts.

alleged dumping of the commodity [/a]on international markets due to domestic over-capacity.

The newest special economic zone of Xiongan in Hebei was announced on Saturday in a bid to boost domestic growth in a province that has been hit by massive job layoffs from heavy industries as China moves to maneuver economic growth away from manufacturing toward services.

Xiongan, south of Beijing, will initially cover 100 sq km (38.6 sq miles) and will be expanded in the long run to 2,000 sq km.

infrastructure [/a], that would provide 12-14 million tons of extra steel demand per year on a current domestic demand rate of about 700 million tons, i.e. about a 2 percent uplift," wrote the analysts.

According to Citi's calculations, around 120 to 140 million tons of steel are required to replicate Shenzhen.

latest incarnation as a startup hub [/a].

With well-connected infrastructure and reasonably high urban density, Xiongan will need 25-30 million tons of steel for residential infrastructure, another 35-40 million tons for the non-residential floor space, 35-40 million tons for the transportation and logistics infrastructure and 25-30 million tons for other utilities and infrastructure, Citi said.

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Gonna need some more oil to go with construction of those Mega city as well.

China's imports of crude oil from the U.S. quadrupled in February vaulting the nation past Canada to the top of the list of American Oil Customers. Bloomberg's Stephen Engle reports on "Bloomberg Markets."

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[SamuraiBlue]

So 45% depreciation help the domestic industries, right?



We are not contending on that. Don't deviate from the PROTECTIONIST issue.

The yen can be traded freely on the currency market with NO intervention by the Japanese government meaning it is completely under control by the will of the market. It may rise and it may fall BUT it has nothing to do with PROTECTIONISM.
Protectionism is basically a mechanism or blockade placed by the government in forms of regulations and law targeting specifically import items resulting to artificially hiking up the price or making import goods and service or difficult to enter the market on their own providing a favorable situation for domestic manufacturers. This kind of mechanism is accepted by the global society in a limited capacity so that the developing nations can start their own domestic industry but is placed under tight scrutiny once the start up companies start trying to export those item into the global market.

As for diminishing capacity of batteries, it's a well known phenomenon that most all have encountered with their smartphones and various other rechargeable batteries. You can find a very good explanation on Wiki concerning this phenomenon.
In other words I really do not need to prove anything on this subject since it is known by most all.