Chinese Economics Thread

[bladerunner]

Re: China's recent important victories at the WTO

I am knowledgeable about matters regarding China. I have no expertise regarding Korea or Japan. I cannot help you. Sorry.

However, I will speculate. I believe that the United States has not sued South Korea or Japan at the WTO. The United States places military bases and priorities above its economic interests. In my opinion, the United States would easily win at the WTO against such blatant protectionist measures, but the United States has to be willing to sue its military allies/puppets.

I forgot which country it was that made an issue about it, but around about the Clinton presidency Japan was made to allow imported rice, but it was set at 8%? of internal consumption/ or domestic production, Ive forgotten which.
But my main point is, thats its very different to the unlimited amount of chicken China can export to the U.S.

 

[Martian]

Re: China's recent important victories at the WTO

I forgot which country it was that made an issue about it, but around about the Clinton presidency Japan was made to allow imported rice, but it was set at 8%? of internal consumption/ or domestic production, Ive forgotten which.
But my main point is, thats its very different to the unlimited amount of chicken China can export to the U.S.

If the United States is unwilling to sue the Japanese over their protection of the rice and car markets in Japan then that is the choice of the United States. It has nothing to do with China.

For your information, the United States also quietly acquiesces to the violation of American pharmaceutical patents by Indian companies.

Anyway, China follows the WTO rules, originally drafted by the United States and Europe.

 

[AssassinsMace]

Re: China's recent important victories at the WTO

Well according to this US chicken exports are one of the top 10 trade surpluses the US has with China. So the US must send a lot more unlimited amount of chicken to China than the other way around.

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[xywdx]

Re: China's recent important victories at the WTO

Some of these limits/bans have legitimate concerns, you have to look at it case by case.
For example I know Canada(along with EU and others) doesn't import American milk and dairy products for fear of the adverse effects of rBST.

Governments have quoted immunology related concerns for the ban, but unofficially researchers have raised concerns about the speeding up of puberty in girls and issues with sexual orientation of boys.

 

[Martian]

Re: China's recent important victories at the WTO

Some of these limits/bans have legitimate concerns, you have to look at it case by case.
For example I know Canada(along with EU and others) doesn't import American milk and dairy products for fear of the adverse effects of rBST.

Governments have quoted immunology related concerns for the ban, but unofficially researchers have raised concerns about the speeding up of puberty in girls and issues with sexual orientation of boys.

There is an exception in WTO rules for health and safety, based on scientific evidence.

However, "bladerunner" is arguing WTO rules are unfair, which is simply not true. The United States and Europe were the architects of GATT and the successor organization WTO. China is out-competing both the United States and Europe. This has led to American and European protectionism. The WTO has ruled in China's favor on important cases and judged American and European trade barriers to be in violation of WTO rules.

 

[bladerunner]

Re: China's recent important victories at the WTO

There is an exception in WTO rules for health and safety, based on scientific evidence.

However, "bladerunner" is arguing WTO rules are unfair, which is simply not true...... .

I said and still maintain that the WTO was is open to manipulation. So if it leads to some unfairness.........

To illustrate my point I brought up the issue of the Japanese protectionist policy towards rice imports .Lead by America, this has been and ongoing dispute since the GATT. era.

" In fact the issue of Japans policy of rice protectionism proved to be a major obstacle up during the World Trade Organization negations in Cancun. In fact, it was one of the primary contributors to destroying negotiations completely.".

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The result of all these negotions Gatt/WTO only managed to extract an agreement from Japan to allow imports of 8%of rice. They also included tarriffs which made it prohibitive to exceed this limit.

IMO THe Japanese have no legitimate concerns and are thumbing their noses at the notion of "free trade" when it concerns rice, and the WTO are letting them get away with it.

To show some consistency they should be telling Japan to cut out the nonsense and open the market completely in the same way they have told the U.S. to do towards Chinese chicken imports.

Similarly until late last year Australia has managed to play the WTO and its forerunner concerning apple imports from NZ, for decades.

By the way, I didn't say Japan banned American cars, but the relative scarcityof U.S./foreign cars. The last time I read anything about it was a couple of yrs ago when foreign imports amounted to 4-5% in Japan, while foreign cars accounted for nearly half of American car sales.

 

[bladerunner]

Re: China's recent important victories at the WTO

Anyway, China follows the WTO rules, originally drafted by the United States and Europe.

Oh really hold on a sec Martian, I copied this from your posted item @ 1347-?

" The WTO recently issued two significant rulings against China, finding that it improperly imposes export tariffs on raw materials in order to protect domestic supplies, and ordering China to bust a state-backed monopoly on processing some credit-card payments. "

There is also the issue of "notice 1204" requiring domestic content which was in itself a violation of WTO Rules. (refer to earlier provided link for the Gamesa case study)

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and what other WTO rules that China might be infringing upon, that we don't know about, because countries are too scared to complain.

 

[Martian]

Re: China's recent important victories at the WTO

Oh really hold on a sec Martian, I copied this from your posted item @ 1347-?

" The WTO recently issued two significant rulings against China, finding that it improperly imposes export tariffs on raw materials in order to protect domestic supplies, and ordering China to bust a state-backed monopoly on processing some credit-card payments. "

There is also the issue of "notice 1204" requiring domestic content which was in itself a violation of WTO Rules. (refer to earlier provided link for the Gamesa case study)

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and what other WTO rules that China might be infringing upon, that we don't know about, because countries are too scared to complain.

There are three minor issues regarding the U.S. and China at the WTO. Compared to the value of millions of GM cars sold in China, these are minor skirmishes.

1. U.S. has complained that China is restricting rare earth exports. China's position is that you can go and dig up your own rare earths in your country. China has carried the world's burden long enough by producing 95% of all rare earth exports for over a decade. China needs to protect her limited supplies and more stringent environmental laws are naturally restricting supply.

The WTO ruling is coming out soon. I don't see how the WTO can force China to dig rare earths out of the ground and export it. An earlier WTO ruling against China was for non-rare earth raw materials. It's pretty trivial and China probably complied in full with the WTO ruling.

2. The U.S. is suing China at the WTO for not opening up its credit card system to U.S. credit card companies. We'll see how this case turns out.

The United States arbitrarily refused to permit China to buy UNOCAL or allow Huawei to execute a signed contract with Sprint on flimsy excuses of national security. In retaliation, given how Chinese companies have been discriminated against in the U.S., I do not foresee China opening up its banking system to the United States; irrespective of the WTO's ruling.

3. The United States has won at the WTO against China for not opening up its movie distribution. China is still refusing to allow the United States unfettered access to its movie theaters. China has acted in good faith in the past and American media companies and performers have resolutely attempted to undermine the Chinese government and violated the law.

For example, Google has refused to censor pornography, gambling, and seditious publications in accordance with Chinese laws. Also, Western singers have illegally yelled "Free Tibet" at the end of their performances.

In light of these regrettable past experiences in dealing with American media companies and performers, I do not envision China allowing a flood of American movies (many of which are R-rated with nudity, sex, vulgarity, and violence) into the Chinese market. There is a strong likelihood that China will absorb the permissible retaliatory damages allowed by the WTO. This is a price that China may consider worth paying.

 

[bladerunner]

Re: China's recent important victories at the WTO

There are three minor issues regarding the U.S. and China at the WTO. ..............
The WTO is wrong and its decision cannot be enforced.

Thats "labber gastng" logic. I could argue the same way on behalf of America but I wont because first and foremost all members are supposed to abide by any WTO rulings.

AS regards the question of Rare Earths China might want to be a bit careful as the biggest deposits/ reserves are in countries friendlier to the West and there will come a time when China may want some of it.

 

[AssassinsMace]

You mean like how China is the villain sending "unlimited" chicken to defenseless Americans when its the US with the chicken trade surplus to China? You didn't make a mistake with figures. You made them up. What does that tell you?