Chinese cruise and anti-ship missiles

Roger604

Senior Member
I wonder where they're getting this information.

The interview with Adm Willard, suggesting China has already tested the full system on land, and parts of the system at sea.

Q: Let me go into China's anti-access/area denial (A2/AD) capabilities. What is the current status of China's anti-ship ballistic missile development, and how close is it to actual operational deployment?

A: The anti-ship ballistic missile system in China has undergone extensive testing. An analogy using a Western term would be "initial operational capability," whereby it has--I think China would perceive that it has--an operational capability now, but they continue to develop it. It will continue to undergo testing, I would imagine, for several more years.

Q: China has achieved IOC?

A: You would have to ask China that, but as we see the development of the system, their acknowledging the system in open press reporting and the continued testing of the system, I would gauge it as about the equivalent of a U.S. system that has achieved IOC.

Q: Has China already perfected the technology to fly that missile and also the sensor systems for targeting? Has the entire system integration been completed?

A: Typically, to have something that would be regarded as in its early operational stage would require that that system be able to accomplish its flight pattern as designed, by and large.

Q: But they have not conducted the actual flight test or the test to attack moving ships yet, have they?

A: We have not seen an over-water test of the entire system.

Q: But do you believe they already have that capability?

A: I think that the component parts of the anti-ship ballistic missile have been developed and tested.
 

Ambivalent

Junior Member
"IOC" in the US sense means a fully tested system that is in full rate production and in service with a minimum number of front line units, the number of which is specified in the program's Capability Development Document. All development testing is complete, only follow on operational testing remains to be completed. This means you have a fixed configuration, trained personnel, all procedures in place and a logistics train stood up.
Is the Admiral implying China has this level of capability? The wording of the quotes seems to be ambiguous on this point, to put it as politely as I can. It sounds to more more like the Chinese may have demonstrated the necessary technology in an operationally relevant environment, but do not yet have anything resembling an operational system, or even a technology demonstrator.
 

Finn McCool

Captain
Registered Member
The interview with Adm Willard, suggesting China has already tested the full system on land, and parts of the system at sea.

Q: Let me go into China's anti-access/area denial (A2/AD) capabilities. What is the current status of China's anti-ship ballistic missile development, and how close is it to actual operational deployment?

A: The anti-ship ballistic missile system in China has undergone extensive testing. An analogy using a Western term would be "initial operational capability," whereby it has--I think China would perceive that it has--an operational capability now, but they continue to develop it. It will continue to undergo testing, I would imagine, for several more years.

Q: China has achieved IOC?

A: You would have to ask China that, but as we see the development of the system, their acknowledging the system in open press reporting and the continued testing of the system, I would gauge it as about the equivalent of a U.S. system that has achieved IOC.

Q: Has China already perfected the technology to fly that missile and also the sensor systems for targeting? Has the entire system integration been completed?

A: Typically, to have something that would be regarded as in its early operational stage would require that that system be able to accomplish its flight pattern as designed, by and large.

Q: But they have not conducted the actual flight test or the test to attack moving ships yet, have they?

A: We have not seen an over-water test of the entire system.

Q: But do you believe they already have that capability?

A: I think that the component parts of the anti-ship ballistic missile have been developed and tested.

Thanks for that Roger. Very interesting stuff. The ASBM project seems to be a little bit further along than I thought it was. Big things are happening lately in Chinese weapons development.
 

Roger604

Senior Member
^ You're welcome.

Western reports claim the first DF-21D brigade was organized (2009/2010) and is stated in Guangzhou MR. I think a DF-11 variant is also ASBM capable and was deployed earlier still (2008/2009).

Also, a top PLA officer (was it Ma?) on a visit to US addressed the ASBM issue in 2009 (as I recall) and said "yes we have it, but it's a limited defense and not a big deal as you make it out to be."
 

Blitzo

Lieutenant General
Staff member
Super Moderator
Registered Member
^ You're welcome.

Western reports claim the first DF-21D brigade was organized (2009/2010) and is stated in Guangzhou MR. I think a DF-11 variant is also ASBM capable and was deployed earlier still (2008/2009).

Also, a top PLA officer (was it Ma?) on a visit to US addressed the ASBM issue in 2009 (as I recall) and said "yes we have it, but it's a limited defense and not a big deal as you make it out to be."

LOL typical PLA... watering-down everything they have...
When the J-20 is declassified: "Oh it's not really a stealth fighter, it's only a twin engined J-10" :D
 

SNSD

Banned Idiot
LOL typical PLA... watering-down everything they have...
When the J-20 is declassified: "Oh it's not really a stealth fighter, it's only a twin engined J-10" :D


LOL more like "Oh it's not a stealth fighter. It was Mr Hu and Mr Wen's private jet".
 

Hendrik_2000

Lieutenant General
ASBM is not the only thing that the west has to worry, Atmospheric missile with maneuverable head is on the way. Here is the profile of a chinese missile designer It is a she.
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Beyond the Anti-Ship Ballistic Missile (ASBM): China’s Next Generation Long Range Precision Strike Systems
Posted on Thursday, December 30, 2010 by Ian Easton

By Mark Stokes

Recent comments by Pacific Command (PACOM) Commander Admiral Robert Willard regarding China’s anti-ship ballistic missile (ASBM) program have attracted considerable media attention. As the world focuses on what indeed is an interesting new capability, China’s space and missile industry is offering hints of programs beyond a basic ASBM.

The Chinese Society of Astronautics recently honored three senior aerospace system designers for significant contributions to national defense. One of China’s most accomplished senior conventional ballistic missile designers is a gifted, relatively young, gentle mother of one – Zhu Xuejun [祝学军]. Born in December 1962, Ms. Zhu graduated from the National University of Defense Technology’s Automated Control Department in 1987 and earned a graduate degree from the China Aerospace Science and Technology Corporation's (CASC) China Academy of Launch Technology (CALT, or First Academy) in missile systems design.

Ms. Zhu’s record of accomplishments is impressive and revealing of the types of advances that China is making in long range precision strike systems. Assigned to the CASC First Academy’s First Design Department, she was an original member of the design team for China’s first generation of conventional short range ballistic missiles, specifically the DF-15 (NATO: CSS-6). After technology management training in the United States in 1996, Ms. Zhu was assigned as senior designer for follow-on variants in 1999, most likely the DF-15A and DF-15B, which was showcased in the 2009 National Day parade. She also appears to be overseeing the development of the next generation variant, the DF-15C.

The CASC First Academy’s DF-15 SRBM has long been the centerpiece of China’s coercive military strategy directed against Taiwan. With a decision made in 1988 to deploy ballistic missiles in a conventional role, the build-up began with establishment of a seed training group on August 1, 1991 that consisted of 11 junior and field grade officers under the leadership of then-Lieutenant Colonel Gao Jin [高津]. Working closely with the CASC First Academy design team and assembly factory personnel in Beijing, the group formed the core of China’s first SRBM brigade, the 96165 Unit based in Leping, Jiangxi Province. Most original DF-15 seed unit officers are emerging as the next generation of Second Artillery leadership. Major General Gao Jin now commands Southeast China’s 52 Base, the Second Artillery’s most powerful missile army. Senior Colonel Zhou Xiaolin [周晓林] was appointed as the fourth commander of the Leping brigade in 2010. He was formerly the brigade’s senior engineer, and an initial cadre involved in the establishment of the conventional missile force.

Looking toward the future, Ms. Zhu is at the cutting edge of some of the world’s most sophisticated long range precision strike systems. As lead engineer of a newly established CASC First Academy conventional weapon system business division [战术武器事业部], she serves as chief designer for CASC First Academy’s first conventional two-stage solid-fueled conventional ballistic missile. CASC First Academy’s two-staged conventional ballistic missile recently completed conceptual design flight tests. Existing SRBMs, such as the CASC’s DF-15 and CASIC 066 Base’s DF-11A, have a single solid rocket motor. A CASC First Academy missile system with two solid motors would be indicative of a competition with the China Aerospace Science and Industry Corporation's (CASIC) Fourth Academy’s 1700-kilometer range DF-21C medium range ballistic missile (MRBM). Appearing to be near completion of the research and development phase, the DF-21D ASBM likely is a variant of the DF-21C modified to engage moving targets at sea, such as aircraft carriers.

The China Astronautics Society also cites Ms. Zhu as serving as technical director for a maneuverable conventional missile system that remains in the atmosphere the entire range of its flight. As a type of hypersonic cruise vehicle, a system on a depressed ballistic trajectory with a maneuverable post-boost vehicle likely would complicate detection and engagement by sea-based missile defense interceptors, such as the Standard Missile-3 (SM-3).

As a final note, the September 2010 China Astronautics Society article also highlights the accomplishments of Fan Shiwei [樊士伟], a leading figure in the top level design and development of China’s space-based sensor architecture. As Director of the PLA General Armaments Department (GAD) Aerospace Bureau General Design Research Center [总装备部航天装备局研发中心], Fan likely has played a leading role in the design and operational requirements development process for the space-based surveillance system that would support an ASBM.
 

SinoSoldier

Colonel
New HN-2000 stealth supersonic cruise missile

http://project2049.net/documents/assassin_under_radar_china_cruise_missile.pdf

China is developing two major cruise missiles:
- HN-2000 (stealth supersonic cruise missile, 4000 km range)
- DH-2000 (submarine launched cruise missile)

China is currently developing its next-generation cruise missile, the Hong Niao-2000 (HN-2000). This missile will reportedly be equipped with millimeter wave radar, infrared image mapping, laser radar, synthetic-aperture radar (SAR) and the Chinese Beidou satellite guidance system, for accuracies of 1-3 meters. This missile will also incorporate the latest stealth technologies and have a supersonic terminal flight phase, with an expected range of 4,000km.

Highly-detailed, authoritative Chinese sources have shed light on the direction of China’s future cruise missile development and underscore the importance of cruise missiles in Chinese strategic thinking. One such article revealed interest in “super long range” and intercontinental cruise missiles with striking distances of 5,000 to 8,000 km and over 8,000 km, respectively. This article, a product of CASIC’s Third Academy, also revealed a strong interest in using long-range cruise missiles with a supersonic terminal phase to attack U.S. aircraft carriers, and discussed ways to defeat U.S. air defense. China has studied U.S. air defense capabilities and techniques in great detail, and is working hard on finding ways to defeat them in conjunction with the Second Academy.


China has also studied the U.S. common aero vehicle (CAV) program in great detail, and is looking at combining elements of both cruise and ballistic missile technology to develop a “Qian Xuesen Missile” for anti-ship and global strike missions. While the U.S. Navy is deeply concerned by China’s evolving ASBM program, much less attention has been paid to the role that cruise missile technology featured in the ASBM program or the fact that China is developing long-range cruise missiles such as the DH-2000 for anti-carrier strikes as well.

Recent unconfirmed Chinese reports state that the PLA Navy (PLAN) has deployed large numbers of long-range cruise missiles to the South China Sea for the purpose of “dealing with” U.S. carriers. And one Chinese journalist writing on behalf of the PLA Daily, Li Wenqi, reportedly left an interview with Third Academy researchers convinced that the success of the DH-10’s recent flight test meant that China now had a long-range, anti-carrier weapon.
 
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