China's SCS Strategy Thread

[duskylim]

What many are not aware of is that the People's Republic's claim in the South China Sea - the so-called 9-dashed line is that it is NOT an invention of the Chinese Communists.

Rather the claim goes back to Imperial China, pre-dating both Republican China (the Nationalists) and the the People's Republic.

In fact both the governments of of the PRC and Taiwan make SIMILAR claims, but don't just take my word for its, look at the territorial claims of Taiwan.

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(note the taiwanese claim even includes Sabah!)

It is not an accident that Taiwan occupies Itu Aba (Chinese name Taiping), the largest of the Spratly group and the only one with fresh water.

Thus the Chinese Communists are not being unusually belligerent in their claims, they are merely maintaining a old imperial policy.

 

[ManilaBoy45]

Philippines Lodges Protest Over China Ship Blockade

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11 March 2014 Last updated at 10:38

The Philippines has lodged a protest with China, accusing its coastguard of preventing two civilian vessels reaching sailors on a disputed shoal.The vessels were in the South China Sea on Sunday to deliver supplies to a military ship grounded since 1999, Philippine officials say.But Beijing's foreign ministry said China blocked the ships because Manila was attempting to build on the shoal.The incident is the latest in the rumbling South China Sea row.

The latest row involves the Second Thomas Shoal, known as Ayungin in Manila and Ren'ai Reef in Beijing.Philippine troops are stationed on a beached, rusting military ship that analysts say has become a symbol of the country marking its territory.The Philippine foreign ministry summoned China's envoy in Manila on Tuesday to lodge the protest."Ayungin Shoal is part of the continental shelf of the Philippines and therefore the Philippines is entitled to exercise sovereignty rights and jurisdiction in the area without the permission of other states," the Philippine foreign ministry said in a statement.

 

[ManilaBoy45]

Manila Air Drops Supplies to Troops on Disptued Shoal

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Wed Mar 12, 2014 4:06am EDT

MANILA (Reuters) - The Philippines air dropped food and water to soldiers stationed on a grounded transport ship on the disputed Second Thomas Shoal, after China blocked two Filipino supply ships from reaching the troops, a senior navy official said on Wednesday.Chinese ships patrolling waters around Second Thomas Shoal, known in China as the Ren'ai reef, on Sunday ordered the Philippine ships carrying construction materials to leave the area.Beijing claims Manila is trying to start construction on the disputed reef after it ran aground an old transport ship in 1999 to mark its territory and stationed marines on the ship.

Manila claims the Shoal is part of the Philippine's continental shelf."We only intend to improve the conditions there, we have no plans to expand or build permanent structures on the shoal," said a Philippines navy official, who declined to be identified because he was not authorised to speak to the press."On Monday, we sent a navy Islander plane to drop food and water but it will only last a few days. We really have to send back the civilian boats. Since last year, we've been resupplying our troops using civilian ships to avoid confrontation and this was the first time China blocked them."On Tuesday, Manila summoned the second highest Chinese embassy official to handover its strong-worded protest, calling the blockade "a clear and urgent threat to the rights and interests of the Philippines".

 

[Blackstone]

Philippines Lodges Protest Over China Ship Blockade

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11 March 2014 Last updated at 10:38

The Philippines has lodged a protest with China, accusing its coastguard of preventing two civilian vessels reaching sailors on a disputed shoal.The vessels were in the South China Sea on Sunday to deliver supplies to a military ship grounded since 1999, Philippine officials say.But Beijing's foreign ministry said China blocked the ships because Manila was attempting to build on the shoal.The incident is the latest in the rumbling South China Sea row.

The latest row involves the Second Thomas Shoal, known as Ayungin in Manila and Ren'ai Reef in Beijing.Philippine troops are stationed on a beached, rusting military ship that analysts say has become a symbol of the country marking its territory.The Philippine foreign ministry summoned China's envoy in Manila on Tuesday to lodge the protest."Ayungin Shoal is part of the continental shelf of the Philippines and therefore the Philippines is entitled to exercise sovereignty rights and jurisdiction in the area without the permission of other states," the Philippine foreign ministry said in a statement.

China says Philippine ships were bringing in building material to construct defense-related structure, which changes the status quo. If true, then China does have a good point.

 

[TerraN_EmpirE]

That is Highly Questionable though as the only structure on the Shoal is Ol'57 the Shoal spends most of it's time submerged . Ol' 57. once long ago she was the USS Harnett County (LST-821) until she was given to South Vietnam. after the fall of Saigon RVNS My Tho (HQ-800) sailed to Subic Bay and her crew turned her over. she was taken up by the Philippine navy as the BRP Sierra Madre in 1999 the Philippine Navy Grounded her on the Shoal. Since then she has served as the only habitation on the Shoal and as a remarkable monument to Corrosion. the Philippine Marines operate a small... Contingent... Think Gilligan's Island meets McHale's Navy with a bit of Survivor here people. A hand full of Philippine Marines who spend there days Fishing and cursing there assignment. These marines live on what fish they can catch and Rations, Fresh Water, Tetanus boosters and the next boat load of Castaways ( to hopefully take there place ) these supply ships bring.
The Chinese Stopped these Ships in the hopes that The Philippines Would be forced to Abandon this Hardship post. As the Saying goes, Possession is 9/10th of the law. As long as this McHales navy post exists the PRC cannot take the territory. Now the next step for the Philippines Marines? Helicopter. they will fly supplies out there.

 

[ManilaBoy45]

Second Thomas Shoal Tensions Intensify

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By Zachary Keck
March 13, 2014

The U.S. has criticized China for provoking the Philippines in the Second Thomas Shoal even as Manila air-lifted supplies to its marines stationed on the disputed reef.On Sunday, Chinese coast guard vessels blocked two Filipino civilian vessels from resupplying marines located on the Second Thomas Shoal, which the Philippines calls the Ayungin Shoal and China refers to as the Ren’ai Reef.A military hospital ship ran aground near the Second Thomas Shoal in 1999 and since then Filipino troops have been stationed on the vessel at all times as a symbol of the Philippines claims to the territory, which lies just 105 nautical miles from the Philippines. For some time now, Chinese coast guard vessels have guarded the approach to the Philippines ship, which has prompted Manila to start using civilian vessels to resupply the ships instead of naval assets.

The U.S. also waded into the dispute on Wednesday when State Department spokeswoman Jen Psaki said Washington is “troubled” by China’s blocking of the two civilian vessels.“This is a provocative move that raises tensions. Pending resolution of competing claims in the South China Sea, there should be no interference with the efforts of claimants to maintain the status quo,” Psaki added.The U.S. also rejected China’s claim that Manila was violating the 2002 CoC in the South China Sea, by noting that Manila had been resupplying the military ship stuck on the island well before 2002. The statements were consistent with the harder line the U.S. has been taking against China over its maritime disputes in recent weeks.Meanwhile, the Filipino Navy official speaking with Reuters said that Manila had begun resupplying the marines stationed on the Second Thomas Shoal by air, but warned that this was at best a temporary solution.
__________________

 

[TerraN_EmpirE]

So now what? The Philippines will keep there base and resupply via air. The PRC will now have to respond, either by trying to blockade the air, moving their own aircraft into the air space to try and force the Resupply craft away or by firing on them. The situation changes dramatically if any lives are lost.

 

[Jeff Head]

So now what? The Philippines will keep there base and resupply via air. The PRC will now have to respond, either by trying to blockade the air, moving their own aircraft into the air space to try and force the Resupply craft away or by firing on them. The situation changes dramatically if any lives are lost.

From what I have read, it sounds like that this "base" is the grounded vessel.

It's an old ship, grounded there by the Philippines 15 years ago.

If so, and they have been maintaining a presence there since 1999, then IMHO they should be able to construct something out there for their people to live in that represents better living conditions. Particularly since this shoal/reef is only 105 miles from Philippines land.

Can you imagine that duty? A 50+ year old ship that has been grounded for 15 years?

After all, it is not like the PRC has not constructed numerous habitats and facilities on islands/sholas/reefs that it claims.

 

[plawolf]

Its amusing and disappointing how even experience members fall so easily for the same old bait and switch.

This current stand off occurred because the Phillippines were trying to bring in construction supplies to build a real permanent outpost on the shoal, and these transports turned back are almost certainly not the first ones to bring in construction materials and equipment since China would have only known about the construction work after the Philippines have started work based on surveillance images.

Even the Philippines admitted this fact, so its not a case of China trying to change the status quo so much as the Philippines trying to change the status quo and the Chinese telling them its not on.

The Chinese don't have to respond in any way to the Philippines air dropping food and water to the marines because the dispute was never about mere resupply, nor was the Chinese intention to somehow stave the Philippines marines out.

Everyone knows that time is on China's side wrt this particular dispute because that relic transport isn't going to last forever. Sooner or later its going to corrode beyond a point where its safe to continue to inhabit it, and a little while after that its structural integrity will give and it will break up and get wash away.

That is why the Phillippines is trying to build on the shoal, and that is also why China does not need to press this issue any time soon since as far as Beijing is concerned, so long as the status quo is maintained, this problem will solve itself in the full course of time.

 

[Rutim]

Even the Philippines admitted this fact, so its not a case of China trying to change the status quo so much as the Philippines trying to change the status quo and the Chinese telling them its not on.

Everyone knows that time is on China's side wrt this particular dispute because that relic transport isn't going to last forever. Sooner or later its going to corrode beyond a point where its safe to continue to inhabit it, and a little while after that its structural integrity will give and it will break up and get wash away.

That is why the Phillippines is trying to build on the shoal, and that is also why China does not need to press this issue any time soon since as far as Beijing is concerned, so long as the status quo is maintained, this problem will solve itself in the full course of time.

lol, it's a real Chinese logic (magic) at work here!

Filipino wreck grounded on the reef with marines living there for 15 years
->
Deny any possibility for them to build any permanent constructions (we don't have problems when we do it ourselves and ignore others)
->
Deny transportation to the wreck (after all they might start building there something!)
->
Wait for the wreck to wither, corrode and wash away
->
STATUS QUO MAINTAINED!