China need a new geopolitical Doctrine ?

BMEWS · Jul 24, 2020

Nobonita Barua said:
U.S gave China the chance to hang U.S upside down in front of global audience on a platter, and China blew it out of the universe :/

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Here China had the opportunity to give "world's greatest speech"

Pompeo on Wednesday also accused China of working with the World Health Organization to downplay the growing coronavirus crisis. Earlier this month, the Trump administration submitted its notice to withdraw from the World Health Organization by July 6, 2021,
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.

"When you have an incident in your country that could potentially lead to a pandemic, you have an obligation to report that and to allow others to come in and help you be transparent about it. The Chinese Communist Party chose differently they co-opted the World Health Organization to achieve that cover-up," Pompeo said.

Lol.... so when is US going to let China come inside of Florida, Texas, California, etc to do inspections of COVID and help the US be more transparent about it?

Its farcical.

BMEWS · Jul 24, 2020

gadgetcool5 said:
Of course they will do certain things with Japan like pressure them not to export to their market or compete in certain industries. But they will not shut down the Japanese consulate or put Japanese companies on an entity list, put a visa ban on Japanese students in the US, or start a new Cold War with Japan. And even if they do, a China that acts more aggressive is only playing into their hands by alienating neutral third countries.

That is only because Japan kowtow'd, bent at the knees, and capitulated.. Remember they admitted to holding off on the hostage taking of Meng until the "trade talks" broke down... and it wasn't until later that it became obvious Xi wasn't going to sell out China as another American colony/vassal that they went down the Huawei banning paths.

Hendrik_2000 · Jul 24, 2020

gadgetcool5 said:
Cutting off all contact and shutting down all consulates except for one is not going to help. Sure, retaliate against US moves and increase its nuclear deterrence yes, but there's no reason to raise tensions needlessly.

The US perspective really is that it just wants China to be more of a responsible stakeholder and slightly liberalize. I know it's hard to believe but it's true. In every speech they say it, and if you listen to what average Americans say, that's what they believe too.

China has been responsible stake holder for a long time what are you talking here. China has a good track record of complying with WTO ruling. It is the American that defy most of WTO ruling China is not the trouble maker that the west make it to be. What they actually meant is for China to play second fiddle and deferential to the West which china refused to do. Every country has the right to choose thier own path of development. China has tried liberal democracy and it does not work. It is no body business to tell other country how one should run their own country. It is up to Chinese people to decide which form of government that they like

The problem is the west is now shut off from meddling and instigating revolt in China using their usual democracy protest etc that is why they don't like it

China is doing the right thing now concentrating on the well fare of its people and they are doing spectacularly well that is another sticking point. The myth is no other system of government can succeed except liberal democracy and that is a challenge for the west.

The west like to paint China as an aggressive bully but China has not gone into war in the last 40 years. Now who went to war constantly over the last 100 years ?

Gatekeeper · Jul 24, 2020

Phead128 said:
US needs a constant "adversary" in order to justify a military budget bigger than the next top 10 nations combined, 7 of which are US allies.

So that's why you have a "China threat" even though China has never fired a single bullet in over 40 years, while US is currently bombing 8 different countries now.

Hypocrites going to be hypocrites.

Great read with great chart showing comparison with military spending with other countries. But what is different, it showed comparison with its own wealth care spending. In another word, priority in killing or saving people! And it's quite telling.

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hullopilllw · Jul 24, 2020

gadgetcool5 said:
Frankly, it doesn't take that much to cool people off. Simply not doing any more provocative actions during the pandemic would help tremendously.

Why are you straying off from the premise of your own argument ?

vesicles · Jul 24, 2020

siegecrossbow said:
The consensus among Chinese military analysts is that there is a high probability that Trump will plan military action against Chinese island installations in the South China Sea. Before you say impossible, just remember how improbable it seemed for the Houston Consulate to get shutdown just a week ago.

I don't think so. The benefit of a diplomatic war, such as the one we see now, is that it is highly isolated. No matter how you escalate, it stays in the diplomatic circle. I believe this is the whole purpose of starting a diplomatic war, i.e. keeping it isolated and containable.

When a fight breaks out close to China in the SCS or Taiwan, China enjoys the overwhelming advantage of more efficient logistics (we all know how important logistics is to a war). When a fight occurs in the middle of the Pacific Ocean, the US enjoys the overwhelming advantage of its dominating carriers forces. I am sure American and Chinese commanders all know this very well. As such, China won't be lured far away from home no matter how much candy the stranger is giving him. And the US doesn't have confidence to win a war close to China. So here is a conundrum. Everyone will be standing far away and yell at each other: "you come here and fight me!" "No! you come here!" "No! You think I'm a fool? You come to me!" "Nah, I won't! I will stay where I am and you come to me!" So in the end, no fighting and just a shouting match.

manqiangrexue · Jul 24, 2020

gadgetcool5 said:
This is completely incorrect.

The dollar is by far the world's reserve currency, and the second currency is the Euro. When push comes to shove, as we saw with Huawei, Hong Kong, ASML, etc. Europe will side with the US. European companies are too integrated with the US to do otherwise. Europe maintains the NATO alliance with the US. The two of them together are more than x2 the size of China's economy. Additionally, Japan, Korea and Taiwan side with the US. Additionally, India and Australia side with the US. All in all, the alliance encircling China is far more technologically advanced, has a far larger economy, and far larger population. That is not even counting SEA nations like Vietnam which have disputes in the SCS against China. Even more countries against China. Against this, China can only muster Pakistan, Iran, North Korea... a collection of nobodies.

Russia is playing both sides selling weapons to India and China at the same time.

China is smaller, weaker, less advanced, less populous, and poorer than the anti-China alliance. Some people on here are literally advocating going to war against all these countries and committing suicide. That would do more damage to China than Mike Pompeo could even dream of in his wildest dreams.

I know this is a defense forum but seeking war is not good.

There is no anti-China alliance. Everything is fluid. China's largest ally is Russia, the biggest somebody there is in the world other than the US and China. Nobody's advocating war against all other nations; that's your reading comprehension issue.

gadgetcool5 said:
Cutting off all contact and shutting down all consulates except for one is not going to help. Sure, retaliate against US moves and increase its nuclear deterrence yes, but there's no reason to raise tensions needlessly.

The US perspective really is that it just wants China to be more of a responsible stakeholder and slightly liberalize. I know it's hard to believe but it's true. In every speech they say it, and if you listen to what average Americans say, that's what they believe too.

Just because you say it's true doesn't mean it's true, even if your "evidence" includes, "I live in the US." LOL It's clear now that China is far more responsible than the US and this is America throwing a temper tantrum that it can't be number one forever. The only appeasement is capitulation to forever be second. In every speech, the US lies and cheats, just ask Pompeo himself. And you're the dope who still swallows everything they feed you hook, line and sinker. I know it's hard for you to believe but outside of your spineless Falun Gong hanjian bubble, this is true.

gadgetcool5 said:
Frankly, it doesn't take that much to cool people off. Simply not doing any more provocative actions during the pandemic would help tremendously.

So the US should stop provocations and show everyone how little it takes to cool off.

gadgetcool5 said:
Of course they will do certain things with Japan like pressure them not to export to their market or compete in certain industries. But they will not shut down the Japanese consulate or put Japanese companies on an entity list, put a visa ban on Japanese students in the US, or start a new Cold War with Japan. And even if they do, a China that acts more aggressive is only playing into their hands by alienating neutral third countries.

Little Japan crumbled early so no further escalations were necessary. That is the only factor.

MortyandRick · Jul 24, 2020

gadgetcool5 said:
Of course they will do certain things with Japan like pressure them not to export to their market or compete in certain industries. But they will not shut down the Japanese consulate or put Japanese companies on an entity list, put a visa ban on Japanese students in the US, or start a new Cold War with Japan. And even if they do, a China that acts more aggressive is only playing into their hands by alienating neutral third countries.

That's because japan gave in to all US demands then their economy burst and they had the 'lost decade'. If they pushed back against US wishes or didn't give in to US depends, I'm sure the US would have progressed to limiting visas for Japanese students and other things. That's a guarantee.

hullopilllw · Jul 24, 2020

BMEWS said:
That is only because Japan kowtow'd, bent at the knees, and capitulated.. Remember they admitted to holding off on the hostage taking of Meng until the "trade talks" broke down... and it wasn't until later that it became obvious Xi wasn't going to sell out China as another American colony/vassal that they went down the Huawei banning paths.

That is an understatement. Japanese executives got arrested for 'stealing IPs' no ? US use her position as the main pc market to dismantle the DRAM industry of Japan and force them into tech transfer deal with US memory makers. A nice reward for behaving like the little good democratic bro to US.

Gatekeeper · Jul 24, 2020

hullopilllw said:
That is an understatement. Japanese executives got arrested for 'stealing IPs' no ? US use her position as the main pc market to dismantle the DRAM industry of Japan and force them into tech transfer deal with US memory makers. A nice reward for behaving like the little good democratic bro to US.

You just got to ask one question to see how the geopolitics plays out.

Who's got troops in who's country? If you can answer that, you'll know the pecking order to see who's boss.

China need a new geopolitical Doctrine ?

BMEWS

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Hendrik_2000

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Gatekeeper

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hullopilllw

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vesicles

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