China need a new geopolitical Doctrine ?

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KYli

Brigadier
There is a Chinese way. It's not particular inviting because outside of economic power there isn't much else.

China has stopped preaching the little red book decades ago. There is no ideological concept that China is exporting to the rest of the World. So what Chinese way you are talking about.
 

davidau

Senior Member
Registered Member
Mao was a political and military leader, a strategic thinker. Under his leadership, China stood up as a nation.
Under his reign, China's socioeconomic yardsticks were way better than before. Give the man credit where credit is due, despite all his shortcomings.

Discerning what is fluff from substance is much harder. People normally don't need to actually touch and smell turd to know it is a turd. It's not ignorance, just common sense.

If there were no Mao, there would be no China. After all Mao's human, he could be wrong late in life. In the war against Japan which blundered into China for years in Manchuria etc, with extreme inhumane cruelty eg the Nanking massacre that killed over 300, 000 innocent Chinese citizens, Mao stood up and wanted to unite Chinese Communists with the Chang's Nationalists; the later wanted to eliminate all Communists first, before fighting the Japanese aggressors. Hence the famous Long March. Being a lapdog of the USA the corrupted Chang fled to Taiwan [Formosa] with all the gold, silver, coins, museum pieces, ancient treasures under the protection of the US military. China was militarily poor, ill-equipped to fight against the US. China was utterly poor, but has the will to survive and rebuild. Mao once said the Chinese people are like a blank sheet of paper: beautiful poems can be written on it! How true, China stood up on 1 October 1949 as a unified nation. And is now relatively prosperous, scientifically advanced, conquered the COVID-19, landed the lunar probe on the far side of the moon, soon China's own space station, ultra fast trains, soon maglev with speed of 600kph, explorations of deep oceans, renewable, clean energy, Beidu Navigation System[BNS] covering all parts of the world ... Most importantly, China has lifted all the poorest of the poor, including all minority ethnic peoples, out of poverty by year end.
 
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manqiangrexue

Brigadier
That's actually a lot of nothing. China itself abandoned the Chinese way after the disasters of Mao's Great Leap Forward and the Culture Revolution.
China economical and political situation improved after adapting western thinking and measure itself with western standards. China is incapable of formulating an alternative to the old established power structures - it has massive economic power but there is no Chinese Way for other states to follow.
This kind of thinking lacks creativity; it shows that you are bogged down by Western protocol and dogma. You think that in order to combat an "American way" or "Western way," you need to rival and displace it with a "Chinese way" and that's just nonsense. Every country is unique and needs to find its own way; there is no success guaranteed in copying others on something so grand. No country understands this more than China as it followed neither communism or Western capitalism but developed its own way unique to China, that allowed China to flourish. India tried to copy Western democracy and failed to thrive. China's world is one of freedom where countries find their own paths without having a superpower breath down their necks and threaten them with death simply because they don't follow the superpower's "way," and this way of freedom to explore and develop without sabotage should have far more appeal than a China that simply wants inflict itself upon the world like America is doing but with a different, Chinese flavor.
 

Pmichael

Junior Member
China has stopped preaching the little red book decades ago. There is no ideological concept that China is exporting to the rest of the World. So what Chinese way you are talking about.

Belt and Road Initiative, Africa, Iran, China's attempt to reshuffle the power dynamics in the South China Sea etc.. China's totalitarian ideology is obviously less appealing than Western associated values. People will always look at Hong Kong and Taiwan and to a lesser degree the treatment of the Uyghurs and Falun Gong and are instantly put off. Combine it with the absolutely lack of cultural reach of modern China - and China is stuck in a corner absolutely incapable of showing itself as a alternative to the West at the end of the day.

If there were no Mao, there would be no China. After all Mao's human, he could be wrong late in life. In the war against Japan which blundered into China for years in Manchuria etc, with extreme inhumane cruelty eg the Nanking massacre that killed over 300, 000 innocent Chinese citizens, Mao stood up and wanted to unite Chinese Communists with the Chang's Nationalists; the later wanted to eliminate all Communists first, before fighting the Japanese aggressors. Hence the famous Long March. Being a lapdog of the USA the corrupted Chang fled to Taiwan [Formosa] with all the gold, silver, coins, museum pieces, ancient treasures under the protection of the US military. China was militarily poor, ill-equipped to fight against the US. China was utterly poor, but has the will to survive and rebuild. Mao once said the Chinese people are like a blank sheet of paper: beautiful poems can be written on it! How true, China stood up on 1 October 1949 as a unified nation. And is now relatively prosperous, scientifically advanced, conquered the COVID-19, landed the lunar probe on the far side of the moon, soon China's own space station, ultra fast trains, soon maglev with speed of 600kph, explorations of deep oceans, renewable, clean energy, Beidu Navigation System[BNS] covering all parts of the world ... Most importantly, China has lifted all the poorest of the poor, including all minority ethnic peoples, out of poverty by year end.

Mao's archivements in the war were more innerparty than actual fighting the Japanese. His charismatic personlity helped him to take control over the party and China at the end but it doesn't change the fact the his complete lack of understanding regarding goverment, economic and social policy are responsibily that a round 80 Million Chinese died directly as a result of his policy. Hong Kong and Taiwan will always be reminder what China could have archived sooner without the disaster that was Mao's China.

This kind of thinking lacks creativity; it shows that you are bogged down by Western protocol and dogma. You think that in order to combat an "American way" or "Western way," you need to rival and displace it with a "Chinese way" and that's just nonsense. Every country is unique and needs to find its own way; there is no success guaranteed in copying others on something so grand. No country understands this more than China as it followed neither communism or Western capitalism but developed its own way unique to China, that allowed China to flourish. India tried to copy Western democracy and failed to thrive. China's world is one of freedom where countries find their own paths without having a superpower breath down their necks and threaten them with death simply because they don't follow the superpower's "way," and this way of freedom to explore and develop without sabotage should have far more appeal than a China that simply wants inflict itself upon the world like America is doing but with a different, Chinese flavor.

China's historic benchmarks are Hong Kong and Taiwan, which both aren't making China look good.
 

manqiangrexue

Brigadier
Belt and Road Initiative, Africa, Iran, China's attempt to reshuffle the power dynamics in the South China Sea etc.. China's totalitarian ideology is obviously less appealing than Western associated values. People will always look at Hong Kong and Taiwan and to a lesser degree the treatment of the Uyghurs and Falun Gong and are instantly put off. Combine it with the absolutely lack of cultural reach of modern China - and China is stuck in a corner absolutely incapable of showing itself as a alternative to the West at the end of the day.

Mao's archivements in the war were more innerparty than actual fighting the Japanese. His charismatic personlity helped him to take control over the party and China at the end but it doesn't change the fact the his complete lack of understanding regarding goverment, economic and social policy are responsibily that a round 80 Million Chinese died directly as a result of his policy. Hong Kong and Taiwan will always be reminder what China could have archived sooner without the disaster that was Mao's China.

China's historic benchmarks are Hong Kong and Taiwan, which both aren't making China look good.
Everything here is laughable seeing how America treats its protesters and the incompetence with which it handles crisis. "Totalitarian," as you use it, is a word that just means a country that America disagrees with apparently. China couldn't have been softer on Hong Kong; that's what, if anything, makes China look bad. It is a tap on the shoulder compared to American police brutality. Don't put the cart before the horse because China hasn't touched the ROC yet but they'll have their day. As a matter of fact, I think 70+ countries have voiced support for China's new law in Hong Kong while some 20+ have voiced concern. After America's behavior as the champion of democracy, there are no Chinese actions that make it look bad except in the eyes of people who selectively attempt to interpret everything that see as a Chinese flaw. As a matter of fact, recently, the world has opened its eyes to what America really is, a country far uglier and more totalitarian than any country that it accuses. The alternative, China, looks better every day both in terms of morality and competence, causing the uptick in global sentiment towards China (see chart).
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Hong Kong and Taiwan are very small places and paid with their souls for some early "achievement"; China is too large for anyone to pull up that quickly but also, China needs to be strong on its own and develop in its own right to become a superpower. Kneeling at the feet of the current superpower is a short-sighted move that just won't cut it for a country with China's ambition, goal, and potential. Besides, Japan knows what happens when an American protege gets too close to matching its master.
 
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Pmichael

Junior Member
tu quoque or also known as Whataboutism is the typical reflex of Chinese nationalists making the wrong assumption that that there’s no difference between Western inner and foreign policies and China. It becomes absolutely absurd when we see Nationalists protest in Western states using a right which they would be denied in China.
 

manqiangrexue

Brigadier
tu quoque or also known as Whataboutism is the typical reflex of Chinese nationalists making the wrong assumption that that there’s no difference between Western inner and foreign policies and China.
Attempting to escape precise arguments and data by hastily retreating into some nebulous general statements is a typical reflex of Western zealots who cannot swallow but also cannot rebut China's superiority to their own ideals and competency in many areas. It becomes absolutely absurd when we see Western Zealots who know nothing about the rights and laws in China attempt to assert some kind of lack of freedom or human rights claim on China when the champion of Western democracy is actually more accurately the champion of police brutality.
 
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Bob Smith

Junior Member
Registered Member
tu quoque or also known as Whataboutism is the typical reflex of Chinese nationalists making the wrong assumption that that there’s no difference between Western inner and foreign policies and China. It becomes absolutely absurd when we see Nationalists protest in Western states using a right which they would be denied in China.

Whataboutism is a weasel word used by pseudo-intellectuals to dissuade being called out for hypocrisy. Nice meme, though.
 

zgx09t

Junior Member
Registered Member
Belt and Road Initiative, Africa, Iran, China's attempt to reshuffle the power dynamics in the South China Sea etc.. China's totalitarian ideology is obviously less appealing than Western associated values. People will always look at Hong Kong and Taiwan and to a lesser degree the treatment of the Uyghurs and Falun Gong and are instantly put off. Combine it with the absolutely lack of cultural reach of modern China - and China is stuck in a corner absolutely incapable of showing itself as a alternative to the West at the end of the day.



Mao's archivements in the war were more innerparty than actual fighting the Japanese. His charismatic personlity helped him to take control over the party and China at the end but it doesn't change the fact the his complete lack of understanding regarding goverment, economic and social policy are responsibily that a round 80 Million Chinese died directly as a result of his policy. Hong Kong and Taiwan will always be reminder what China could have archived sooner without the disaster that was Mao's China.



China's historic benchmarks are Hong Kong and Taiwan, which both aren't making China look good.

You need to update the political label for China. It seems you are still stuck in 20th century. Just look up what it means.
 

zgx09t

Junior Member
Registered Member
tu quoque or also known as Whataboutism is the typical reflex of Chinese nationalists making the wrong assumption that that there’s no difference between Western inner and foreign policies and China. It becomes absolutely absurd when we see Nationalists protest in Western states using a right which they would be denied in China.

I'm not quite sure I follow what you meant to say in the first sentence. Syntax is a bit troubling to fully understand.
There were thousands of protests, or more than you can count, in China every year, nobody got shot while walking away, or died from the knee on the neck.
 
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