China need a new geopolitical Doctrine ?

free_6ix9ine · Jun 9, 2020

If you guys think bashing and threatening the rest of the world with weapons or trade war is the key to winning against the US. You are sorely mistaken. Germany and Soviet Union tried the first route twice and failed, no country can be powerful enough to convince every single country to be on their side by simply issuing military threats. And never mind the fact that China is not even as powerful as the US. When we don't have the financial power or the military power.

foxmulder · Jun 9, 2020

free_6ix9ine said:
Cuba and China are not that different in terms of ideology. We are both post communism countries with majority non-white populations, but Cuba markets themselves wayyyyyy better. You hear left wing Democrats like Bernie Sanders praising Fidel Castro for all he has done for social justice, AOC defending cuba on socialism, Obama opening up trade relations, teenagers wearing che Guerra t-shirts etc. YES FOX News still tries to malign Cuba, but Cuba has supporters in the US.

Same thing with Iran who is enemy of Israel, a country that basically controls evangelical support in the GOP and is sworn enemy of the US. But Democrats still feel sympathy for Iran because they are fighting Israel who is an Islamaphobic right wing nationalist Nation.

Russia also had support from the GOP because they are aligned with the GOPs racist and despicable idea of white nationalism. And represent a counter punch to the "libs".

Even these poor countries have support from politicians in the US. While basically the only thing that is bi partisan in the US right now is Cold War with China. So thank you guys for being blindly Nationalistic and getting in the head of Xi jin ping, and pushing us into a Cold War that we aren't prepared for and probably won't win.

?? Seriously man you got the wrong end. Broadly speaking what you are doing/saying is a prime example of blaming the victim. China is just very tolerant and prefers to *do* smt then saying it. BRI and focus even more on global trade is Chinese answer to containment. One can only do business with a willing partner. China has a lot of willing partners.

Canuck place · Jun 9, 2020

free_6ix9ine said:
Cuba and China are not that different in terms of ideology. We are both post communism countries with majority non-white populations, but Cuba markets themselves wayyyyyy better. You hear left wing Democrats like Bernie Sanders praising Fidel Castro for all he has done for social justice, AOC defending cuba on socialism, Obama opening up trade relations, teenagers wearing che Guerra t-shirts etc. YES FOX News still tries to malign Cuba, but Cuba has supporters in the US.

Same thing with Iran who is enemy of Israel, a country that basically controls evangelical support in the GOP and is sworn enemy of the US. But Democrats still feel sympathy for Iran because they are fighting Israel who is an Islamaphobic right wing nationalist Nation.

Russia also had support from the GOP because they are aligned with the GOPs racist and despicable idea of white nationalism. And represent a counter punch to the "libs".

Even these poor countries have support from politicians in the US. While basically the only thing that is bi partisan in the US right now is Cold War with China. So thank you guys for being blindly Nationalistic and getting in the head of Xi jin ping, and pushing us into a Cold War that we aren't prepared for and probably won't win.

I agree with what you said regarding China developing a specific ideology. However I don’t think we can equate Cuba and Iran has having ideology and support. Definitely China has a problems with getting their message across due to the limited media. China needs to seriously work on their media strategies.

However Cuba and Iran, even though they have supporters, are in a much worse position in terms of sanctions than China, so makes one wonder if have some support in the US makes a big difference. The main difference is if one is strong enough that the US cannot afford to attack militarily or economically. The IS can have supporters for Cuba and Iran because those countries will never come close to US power, well never say never but unlikely.

The current Cold War environment would have been present even without Xu jinping. The US fears that another country is catching up to them technologically. They will do whatever is necessary to make sure it doesn’t happen. I don’t think this is due to any specific Chinese policy, the US will use any excuse to contain China because China is simply too big to ignore. They did it to Japan, and Japan was an ally in the 1980s. So much for being in an alliance. If China was weak and the US had another enemy, you will automatically see more pro China voices in the US and western world.

I for one feel that China needs to be better at media projection, and there are a lot of improvements to be made throughout the country but considering where they were just a few years ago, i have to be impressed. That what really scares the west.

foxmulder · Jun 9, 2020

free_6ix9ine said:
If you guys think bashing and threatening the rest of the world with weapons or trade war is the key to winning against the US. You are sorely mistaken. Germany and Soviet Union tried the first route twice and failed, no country can be powerful enough to convince every single country to be on their side by simply issuing military threats. And never mind the fact that China is not even as powerful as the US. When we don't have the financial power or the military power.

What?

Are you really talking about China? What military threats? what trade threats? China did none of these but respond very *mildly* to others' actions targeting her. Now I understand you well, though, what was the nickname you had that got banned

free_6ix9ine · Jun 9, 2020

foxmulder said:
What? Are you really talking about China? What military threats? what trade threats? China did none of these but respond very *mildly* to others' actions targeting her. Now I understand you well, though, what was the nickname you had that got banned

No I'm not saying that China is doing just that right now. I was replying to manqiangrexue who was suggesting we do that to "win" over neutral countries.

manqiangrexue · Jun 9, 2020

free_6ix9ine said:
No I'm not saying that China is doing just that right now. I was replying to manqiangrexue.

If you're replying to me, then quote me or at least tag me.

Terrible points. Absolute nonsense. First of all, winners write the narrative. No matter what your ideology is, it's right and it's attractive if you are the winner and wrong and disgusting if you are the loser. Everything depends on power. Power can be your ideology; nobody cares because everyone just wants to be on the winning side. You're talking about attracting people with ideology like you think that picking sides is like choosing the theme of your cruise ship for a vacation. No, this is survival. People pick which side like they pick which warship to board because they believe that that ship will have the best chance of survival on the hostile seas and you're over here talking about decorating the tables and painting the walls with butterfly patterns LOL.

Soft power only works when you don't have the hard power to threaten the standing hegemon. You think anybody would be praising Cuba if Cuba was the same size as the US and challenging it on every front? Do you think Japan could be a master of soft power if it wasn't on an American leash?

Strength is the ultimate key; it is the universal answer. It is the only way that any power has ever come to reign in history. That you don't see that and you have some fantasy about charming the world is like a child's Disney story at a serious international meeting.

I don't think anybody is worried about our "nationalism;" they are worried about your fantasies about going to India trying to give your territory away to them in hopes that next year, fresh off their victory, they don't demand more. That is what concerns people.

If you don't have the financial or military power now, then grow it until you do. Until you do, you will not have a following. If you need a following to grow your power, then throw in the towel because you don't deserve to be a superpower. Horse goes before the cart. You're just embarrassing yourself here trying to put things ass-backwards.

free_6ix9ine · Jun 9, 2020

manqiangrexue said:
If you're replying to me, then quote me or at least tag me.

Terrible points. Absolute nonsense. First of all, winners write the narrative. No matter what your ideology is, it's right and it's attractive if you are the winner and wrong and disgusting if you are the loser. Everything depends on power. Power can be your ideology; nobody cares because everyone just wants to be on the winning side. You're talking about attracting people with ideology like you think that picking sides is like choosing the theme of your cruise ship for a vacation. No, this is survival. People pick which side like they pick which warship to board because they believe that that ship will have the best chance of survival on the hostile seas and you're over here talking about decorating the tables and painting the walls with butterfly patterns LOL.

Soft power only works when you don't have the hard power to threaten the standing hegemon. You think anybody would be praising Cuba if Cuba was the same size as the US and challenging it on every front? Do you think Japan could be a master of soft power if it wasn't on an American leash?

Strength is the ultimate key; it is the universal answer. It is the only way that any power has ever come to reign in history. That you don't see that and you have some fantasy about charming the world is like a child's Disney story at a serious international meeting.

I don't think anybody is worried about out nationalism; they are worried about you talking about going to India trying to negotiate your territory away to them in hopes that next year, fresh off their victory, they don't demand more. That is what concerns people.

If you don't have the financial or military power now, then grow it until you do. Until you do, you will not have a following. If you need a following to grow your power, then throw in the towel because you don't deserve to be a superpower. Horse goes before the cart. You're just embarrassing yourself here trying to put things ass-backwards.

So if that's true that we can grow without a following, then why is China bothering with BRI? Why bother with RECEP? Your not making sense here dude. Growth comes before strength. To gain growth you need other countries to be on your side or at least not hate you.

manqiangrexue · Jun 9, 2020

free_6ix9ine said:
So if that's true that we can grow without a following, then why is China bothering with BRI? Why bother with RECEP? Your not making sense here dude. Growth comes before strength. To gain growth you need other countries to be on your side or at least not hate you.

If I'm not making sense, then go check how many people agree with my posts against how many people agree with yours. When you enter a highway and see everyone else driving in the opposite direction, what does it mean?

BRI and RECEP are trade partnerships. You're talking about winning political alliances, no? Those are way different. China is already the largest trading country in the world with massive economic relationships will all countries friendly and hostile. China grew and continues to grow NOT because it has all the political support of its trading partners but because it can separate economics from politics when it's best for Chinese growth. I said that China will not win these political alliances until it is stronger than the US. You are confusing what you are talking about and not making sense, "dude".

solarz · Jun 9, 2020

manqiangrexue said:
I don't think anybody is worried about out nationalism; they are worried about you talking about going to India trying to negotiate your territory away to them in hopes that next year, fresh off their victory, they don't demand more. That is what concerns people.

Well to be fair, adiru's got as much chance of negotiating away China's territories as I have of waking up in Jeff Bezos' mansion with Dilraba Dilmurat asking me what I'd like for breakfast!

free_6ix9ine · Jun 9, 2020

manqiangrexue said:
If I'm not making sense, then go check how many people agree with my posts against how many people agree with yours. When you enter a highway and see everyone else driving in the opposite direction, what does it mean?

BRI and RECEP are trade partnerships. You're talking about winning political alliances, no? Those are way different. China is already the largest trading country in the world with massive economic relationships will all countries friendly and hostile. China grew and continues to grow NOT because it has all the political support of its trading partners but because it can separate economics from politics when its best for China. I said that China will not win these political alliances until it is stronger than the US. You are confusing what you are talking about.

Ok so if China can seperate politics from trade, why is UK banning Huawei 5G, why did Australia ban Huawei 5G, why is TSMC dropping hisilicon, why is China banning Australian iron ore, why is India boycotting Chinese products, why are manufactures moving to vietnam?

Dude I don't care what people think and most people outside of Sino defence would agree with me.

We are losing on trade because we are losing on the political alliance side. And jingoism is not the approach that will help.

China need a new geopolitical Doctrine ?

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