The initial production badge of the J-15 will probably use the AL-31 engines as its more reliable then the WS-10A. Unless there is a major breakthrough in the reliability of the W-10A engines before production begins. For carrier ops the reliability of engines and other parts are paramount as any failures could endanger not only the life of the pilot but also the deck crew and perhabs even the ship itself. And you can't make a emergency landing on the high seas. Not only that, its also a nightmare for the maintenance crew in the hangar deck that have to constantly check and repair those engines. That's hard enough on a airbase but it might be a luxury that you cannot afford on a carrier.
China Flanker Thread II
- Thread starter sumdud
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cloyce
Junior Member
Production version of J-15, will definitely use WS-10A
cloyce
Junior Member
Equation
Lieutenant General
Actually China will have the J-31 to go along with the current J-15. China came a long way to establish a very good and credible aviation program to design and produce their own aircraft's with basically no one to teach them.
Engineer
Major
Those AL-31F that J-15s use right now are not specially made to operate in salty air for long duration. As such, it is doubtful we will see AL-31F in service with J-15 at all.
The J-15 and J-31 are going to make an excellent mixed wing for the Chinese Navy. Both are new builds, capable of multiple missions, and will lend long-term capabilities to a growing PLAN air arm, and may end up flying on multiple PLAN carriers.
The Mig-29K is a significant improvement over the SU-33 for the Russians. These aircraft allow a larger air wing on their carrier and greater flexibility for missions with numerous A2G precision guided weapons the SU-33 lacked. Now, after they add more aircraft types, particularly if their new build carriers ever come to fruition, they will have an even more diverse air wing.
But that is already a forgone conclusion for the PLAN.
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Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
I don't know how reliable is this article . Maybe some one can translate it better. But seem like they have problem with component suppliers as I suspect . That is what held back the production of WS 10A and J11 B
俄称歼11B首次装备海航 发动机生产跟不上
2012年09月18日 09:31 环球网
资料图：网上流传的歼11B战斗机三视图 资料图：网上流传的歼11B战斗机三视图
【环球网综合报道】据俄罗斯“潜望镜2”网站9月14日报道，中国航空工业消息人士日前在接受《汉和亚洲防务》杂志采访时透露，中国首批海军版歼-11B/BS歼击机已于2011年装备解放军海军航空兵第8师，而且全部配备国产太行发动机。与此同时，解放军空军第37师去年也装备了一批同型号歼击机。
据中国航空工业消息人士透露，这是解放军海军航空兵装备的首批歼-11B/BS歼击机。今后歼-11B/BS歼击机将全部配备国产太行发动机。目前只有正在服役的首批歼-11B才使用俄罗斯AL-31F发动机。当前中国在歼-11B装备方面的最大困难就是航空发动机及其部件的供应跟不上歼击机的生产节奏。根据目前的生产计划，歼-11B/BS歼击机每年最大生厂量为24架，只够装备一个团，因此中国海军和空军正在就新型歼-11B/BS战斗机的分配问题展开激烈争论。根据汉和掌握的消息，目前中国空军和海军在歼-11B/BS歼击机分配方面采取平分原则，即每年各装备8到12架。这意味着，解放军空军和海军航空兵至少需要两年时间才能换装一个团，之后还将逐步改编为旅。
中国航空工业消息人士指出，歼-11B歼击机安装机械扫描雷达，将来计划在歼-11/16/15上安装有源相控阵雷达。中国已经用了8年多的时间研制机载有源相控阵雷达，其造价不高，性能先进，而且雷达重量甚至低于俄罗斯产品。目前歼-10B歼击机使用的无源相控阵雷达，这也证实了汉和有关中国歼-10B机载雷达是俄制相控阵雷达仿制品的推测，而且这些观察已经得到了其他渠道的确认。不久前北京博物馆开设了机载无线电电子设备展厅，非常清楚地表明歼-10B配备无源相控阵雷达。据悉，除了国产太行发动机之外，中国歼-11B还安装了国产新型航电设备和座舱显示器。(编译：林海)
相关报道：
Russia said the F-11B equipment HNA engine production can not keep up for the first time
2012 09 18 09:31 Global Network
Figure: F-11B fighter view the spread of the Internet Data Figure: F-11B fighter circulated on the Internet three views
[World Wide Web Roundup According to Russia's "periscope" website reported on September 14, China's aviation industry sources recently revealed in an interview with the Chinese and Asian Defense magazine, the first batch of Chinese naval version F--11B/BS fighter 8 Division of the equipment of the PLA Naval Air Force in 2011, and all equipped with domestic Taihang engine. At the same time, the 37th Division of the People's Liberation Army Air Force also equipped with a number of fighter aircraft of the same model.
According to sources of China's aviation industry, which is the People's Liberation Army Naval Air Force equipment first batch the F--11B/BS fighter. In the future fighter F -11B/BS will all with domestic Taihang engine. The first batch of F-11B was only in service with the Russian AL-31F engine. Equipment in the F-11B greatest difficulty is the aero-engine and its parts supply can not keep up the pace of production of the fighter. F -11B/BS fighter based on the current production plan, the annual maximum amount of raw plant 24, only enough to equip a regiment, so the Chinese navy and air force is a fierce debate on the allocation of the the new J -11B/BS fighter. According to Han and grasp the message, the Chinese Air Force and Navy in the distribution of F -11B/BS fighter take bisection principle, each equipped with 8-12 year. This means that the People's Liberation Army Air Force and naval aviation needs at least two years in order to dress up a group, and then will gradually adapted for the journey.
China Aviation Industry sources pointed out that the F-11B fighter install mechanical scanning radar, future plans active phased array radar installed on F -11/16/15. China has spent 8 years developing airborne active phased array radar, its cost is not high, state-of-the-art performance, and the radar weight even lower than the Russian product. F-10B fighter using passive phased array radar, which also confirmed the Han and the Chinese J-10B airborne radar is a Russian-made imitation of the phased array radar speculation, and these observations have been confirmed by other channels . Beijing Museum recently opened airborne radio electronic equipment showroom, very clear that the F-10B is equipped with passive phased array radar. It is reported that, in addition to the domestic Taihang engine, F-11B also installed domestic new avionics and cockpit displays. (Compile: woodlands)
俄称歼11B首次装备海航 发动机生产跟不上
2012年09月18日 09:31 环球网
资料图：网上流传的歼11B战斗机三视图 资料图：网上流传的歼11B战斗机三视图
【环球网综合报道】据俄罗斯“潜望镜2”网站9月14日报道，中国航空工业消息人士日前在接受《汉和亚洲防务》杂志采访时透露，中国首批海军版歼-11B/BS歼击机已于2011年装备解放军海军航空兵第8师，而且全部配备国产太行发动机。与此同时，解放军空军第37师去年也装备了一批同型号歼击机。
据中国航空工业消息人士透露，这是解放军海军航空兵装备的首批歼-11B/BS歼击机。今后歼-11B/BS歼击机将全部配备国产太行发动机。目前只有正在服役的首批歼-11B才使用俄罗斯AL-31F发动机。当前中国在歼-11B装备方面的最大困难就是航空发动机及其部件的供应跟不上歼击机的生产节奏。根据目前的生产计划，歼-11B/BS歼击机每年最大生厂量为24架，只够装备一个团，因此中国海军和空军正在就新型歼-11B/BS战斗机的分配问题展开激烈争论。根据汉和掌握的消息，目前中国空军和海军在歼-11B/BS歼击机分配方面采取平分原则，即每年各装备8到12架。这意味着，解放军空军和海军航空兵至少需要两年时间才能换装一个团，之后还将逐步改编为旅。
中国航空工业消息人士指出，歼-11B歼击机安装机械扫描雷达，将来计划在歼-11/16/15上安装有源相控阵雷达。中国已经用了8年多的时间研制机载有源相控阵雷达，其造价不高，性能先进，而且雷达重量甚至低于俄罗斯产品。目前歼-10B歼击机使用的无源相控阵雷达，这也证实了汉和有关中国歼-10B机载雷达是俄制相控阵雷达仿制品的推测，而且这些观察已经得到了其他渠道的确认。不久前北京博物馆开设了机载无线电电子设备展厅，非常清楚地表明歼-10B配备无源相控阵雷达。据悉，除了国产太行发动机之外，中国歼-11B还安装了国产新型航电设备和座舱显示器。(编译：林海)
相关报道：
Russia said the F-11B equipment HNA engine production can not keep up for the first time
2012 09 18 09:31 Global Network
Figure: F-11B fighter view the spread of the Internet Data Figure: F-11B fighter circulated on the Internet three views
[World Wide Web Roundup According to Russia's "periscope" website reported on September 14, China's aviation industry sources recently revealed in an interview with the Chinese and Asian Defense magazine, the first batch of Chinese naval version F--11B/BS fighter 8 Division of the equipment of the PLA Naval Air Force in 2011, and all equipped with domestic Taihang engine. At the same time, the 37th Division of the People's Liberation Army Air Force also equipped with a number of fighter aircraft of the same model.
According to sources of China's aviation industry, which is the People's Liberation Army Naval Air Force equipment first batch the F--11B/BS fighter. In the future fighter F -11B/BS will all with domestic Taihang engine. The first batch of F-11B was only in service with the Russian AL-31F engine. Equipment in the F-11B greatest difficulty is the aero-engine and its parts supply can not keep up the pace of production of the fighter. F -11B/BS fighter based on the current production plan, the annual maximum amount of raw plant 24, only enough to equip a regiment, so the Chinese navy and air force is a fierce debate on the allocation of the the new J -11B/BS fighter. According to Han and grasp the message, the Chinese Air Force and Navy in the distribution of F -11B/BS fighter take bisection principle, each equipped with 8-12 year. This means that the People's Liberation Army Air Force and naval aviation needs at least two years in order to dress up a group, and then will gradually adapted for the journey.
China Aviation Industry sources pointed out that the F-11B fighter install mechanical scanning radar, future plans active phased array radar installed on F -11/16/15. China has spent 8 years developing airborne active phased array radar, its cost is not high, state-of-the-art performance, and the radar weight even lower than the Russian product. F-10B fighter using passive phased array radar, which also confirmed the Han and the Chinese J-10B airborne radar is a Russian-made imitation of the phased array radar speculation, and these observations have been confirmed by other channels . Beijing Museum recently opened airborne radio electronic equipment showroom, very clear that the F-10B is equipped with passive phased array radar. It is reported that, in addition to the domestic Taihang engine, F-11B also installed domestic new avionics and cockpit displays. (Compile: woodlands)
MiG-29
Banned Idiot
27.11.2012
VSUE GTERPC Salut concluded a contract with Chinese Air Force for supply of spare parts for aircraft engines. In the course of the International Airshow China-2012 talks on mutually beneficial cooperation between VSUE GTERPC Salut and representatives of Chinese Air Force, foreign trade companies and plants repairing aircraft engines of type АL-31F have been held.
As a result VSUE GTERPC Salut concluded a contract for supply of spare parts for aircraft engine repair in 2013 with Chinese foreign trade company Tianli.
During the show mockups of AL-31FN-М1afterburning turbofan vectored-thrust engine, AI-222-25 engine for trainer aircraft Yak-130, small-scale engine MD-120 and models of low pressure compressor 1-st stage for АI-222-25 engine were exhibited.
The engine is intended to power SU-27 aircraft and its modifi¬cation (SU-27SM, SU-33, SU-34 and others). The engine is fully interchangeable with serial AL-31F engine.
Design modular
Maximum thrust, kgf 13500
DESIGN DISTINCTION FROM SERIAL AL-31F ENGINE: •Modernized LPC with increased air consumption;
•New materials of rotor parts;
•Digital full-authority engine regulator instead of analog one;
•Turbine starter with increased power and higher-altitude startup capability (option);
•All-round deflection jet nozzle with thrust vector control (option).
the article writers did not know Russian Su-33 can be upgraded with Al-31 series 42
however to be fair with the article
The first phase of the AL-31F upgrading program was completed in 2006. The engine thrust at special power setting had then been increased to up to 13 500 kgf and the assigned life extended to 2 000 hours. The AL-31F M1 engine (Series 42) is installed on Su-27SM and Su-27SM2 aircraft operated by the Russian Air Force. consider that Su-27SM and Su-27SM2 look like your regular Su-27 of the Russian air force
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Liming is pushing its goal to stabilize WS-10 engine annual production of 120 units.
By the way, a report said that Russia wanted to repay a debts of 4-500 million Swiss Franks, owed by the former Soviet Union, with Ka helicopters. China declined. Then the sale of Su-35's stories came up. Russians wanted $85 million a piece. Of Course, China said: "No!" Currently, the asking price is $65 million.
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MiG-29
Banned Idiot
The J-31 will take time to mature, perhaps 7-14 years, plus today`s aerospace industry requieres international efforts.
At the same time with the full-rate production in Moscow, Klimov JSC in St. Petersburg continues to refine the RD-33MK and RD-93. According to Klimov, the company’s jet engine priorities are the development of the modified RD-93MA with the thrust enhanced to 9,300 kgf for a foreign customer and the development of the upgraded RD-33MKM with a thrust of 9,500 kgf for the MiG corporation.
To be honest China will soldier for at least 10 years with J-15/Su-33 and i do not know who is that customer it could be india but it could also China.
If China it might be for J-31, if that is the case the J-31 could use RD-33 for several years
But i do not think J-15/Su-33 will fly in the next 5 years along side the J-31 from the chinese carrier
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