China demographics thread.

[Randomuser]

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Not totally related but it seems Israel's birthrates gonna be drooping soon as well.

 

[manqiangrexue]

1. Punitive measures can work with the right propaganda, just look at the US. the CPC should (imho) spread a bit of doom and gloom, leading to slight panic among the public, before they start deploying them.

This tells people to abandon the country. Time to jump ship. The number of people who will say, "I'll have kids to save the country," vs the number of people who will say, "We better get out of here before it all collapses" are going to skew towards exacerbating the problem rather than fixing it. And all the people leaving will be the people with the means to leave, the upper ecleons.

As for your point about breeding stupid people, that has yet to be proven.

Smart people get their ways no matter what the law is. So if you can't affect them but you end up scaring stupid people into breeding, then what has happened? You've bred stupid people.

The US used to have such laws (marriage being a requirement for work or promotion, my evidence is anecdotal at best so plz correct me if I'm wrong), but they still became a superpower in the early 1900s.

Correlation is not causation. America does a billion things; you can't pick one and say this led to its power. Also, America is currently at the height of its power (not comparatively but absolutely) and it does not have those laws.

2. I think you might be misunderstanding what I wrote. The problem here is not the number of people inhabiting the country. That's kinda fine as it is now and can be left for much later. The real problem is that with the TFR being as low as it is now, the majority of chinese population might quickly become elderly. I think we all know that an average elder is conservative and stubborn/inflexible. When such traits are applied to the majority of chinese citizens, it could lead to severe, unintended consequences. We can see examples of such consequences in Japan (my previous post) and Europe (Brexit and others). When coupled with the large number of elderly being a huge drag on the economy and on the younger ones, this could invalidate all the hardwork that's been previously done (again, look at Japan).

I understood exactly what you wrote. Technology cannot be invalidated. There is no comparison with Japan; they are a small defeated country that is militarily occupied and they never developed into anything that even resembled a comprehensive challenge to the US. The cushion of time that China has before it needs to react to the low TFR as an existentialist threat is long and we have things that we need to do and are poised to do in the span of this time cushion. Do not waste it prematurely overreacting.

While I understand that China is currently in the midst of a race with the west, one must not sacrifice his future to win it.

And I'm saying that the future can only be bright after winning the race. The only danger is losing the race to address a problem that would never have been that serious at all and will partially self-resolve after winning.

 

[Quan8410]

Religion is the solution to everything. Make Christianity the state religion. You will see that all countries with higher birth rates are those with high religiosity. Side effect of religion is that science and technology improves because people have something besides money to motivate them. (i.e work in lower paying science jobs instead of useless finance jobs). Chinese people worship money instead of a God. Worshipping money (working long hours etc) is associated with sacrificing family. US has higher fertility rates than Europe because US is more religious.

Another example is Israel. They have very high birth rates. Jews have contributed more to science than Chinese have despite being <1% of China's population. Ask yourself why

To hell with Christanity. Confucianism is a better choice, an actual Chinese products and an effective tool for rulling for thounsands of years. Christanity means you are slave for the people in Vatican. You cannot even worship your ancestors, and your history will be eliminated.

 

[Quan8410]

Christianity has nothing to do with the Vatican. You're referring to Catholics. In what way does being Protestant lead to history being eliminated? Does embracing communism lead to your history being eliminated? Why did Mao's Great Leap Backward destroy so many Chinese artifacts and desecrate the graves of our ancestors?

Mao's Great leap forward doesn't destroy anything, learn your history. If you refer to Cultural Revolution, it destroyed a lot of backwards customs, superstitions but not destroy the history. Some artifacts had been destroyed but not all. At least Mao united China. Did Jesus did anything with China so we can worship him? Mind you, Christanity or Protestants means God above everything and that is not Chinese culture. Please don't try import harmful stuff from the West, who are Christian but relied on immigrants to save their birth rates and who stole Chinese artifacts for themselves (just need to visit London museum to open your eyes). Even China's communism is different from Soviet Union, hence "China characteristics".

 

[coolgod]

"Just hatched", first two posts in China's demographics thread.
"Christ is king", "Joos are the smartest", "Mao destroyed Chinese culture".



Don't feed the troll, wait for him to get sent on vacation eventually.

 

[manqiangrexue]

Communism is imported from the West. Marx was Jewish.

I agree. There's no need stick to it or worship it; China should aways make our own system.

Why can't we have Christianity with Chinese characteristics?

Because religion is stupid. All of them. It is a bunch of adults who can't cope with the real world lying to themselves that as long as they follow some rules or do as they're told, they will be rewarded in heaven. Personal responsibility in a world where there are no assurances is the ultimate truth.

 

[tokenanalyst]

It seems that you basically have to strip females of their rights. They can't get education, good jobs, any rights, any bargaining power etc. Basically force them to be breeding machines like you see in these dystopian novels or shows. Again that's just not gonna happen unless you're completely desperate. For starters letting 50% of the population not being in a labour force is considered uncompetitive. Especially a country like China which has females working in some of the most complex STEM projects.

Maybe governments should pay for daycare facilities closer to jobs sites or force companies to pay for it.

 

[manqiangrexue]

Chinese materialism and worship of money is stupid.

It has its uses and it made China rich, which we needed to be to develop technology. Greed is a powerful driving force pushing China's rise from poverty into a modern challenger for America. China should still be materialistic but realize that material wealth is just a tool to be used to create genetic wealth, which is the permanent passing and spreading of your genes so you have a legacy long after death.

What system do you propose then? How can we lift China's birth rate?

God damn. I've talked about it too many times. Combination of a cultural approach, blocking out Western individualism for Chinese ideals of duty to the family and country. Emphasizing the value of humans and passing on one's genes. Education in genetics may be useful since geneticists like myself so very much understand the importance of passing our bloodlines on rather than living in the moment and buying luxuries for oneself. Then there's financial support. After a certain number of babies, a family should have a government card that allows them free use of all public transport, public parks, recreational services, with finds injected each month for food, etc... And this should be even if they don't financially need it, just given as a thanks and reward. It should be like a triple A card to life. For work and school, big families should be given consideration. Given a similar level of skill/merit (I must emphasize this because we don't want to be flooding our schools and higher positions with stupid people who have lots of kids), preference for school placement should be given to children with siblings and workers with many kids. And of course, the family home should be goverment subsidized and they should be given dwellings sized based on family size.

One thing's for sure; you don't trade a smaller but down-to-earth population for a bigger one that worships bullshit in the sky. Religion is mental rot; never use it for anything.

Religion is the solution to everything.

Only if you start with sheeple and wish to continue to raise sheeple.

Make Christianity the state religion.

Barf. Of all the religions in the world, they are all stupid, but this one is evil as well.

You will see that all countries with higher birth rates are those with high religiosity.

No, birth rate correlates much stronger to development level. Poor countries high higher birth rates.

Side effect of religion is that science and technology improves because people have something besides money to motivate them. (i.e work in lower paying science jobs instead of useless finance jobs).

Uh NO. Religion makes people shun science. It makes people people lazy, thinking that just being devoted is enough as god will make everything ok, in the afterlife if not this life. See the Palestinians praying, when they should have been studying military engineering all along.

Chinese people worship money instead of a God.

Because only exists.

Worshipping money (working long hours etc) is associated with sacrificing family.

So they can worship family and the CCP. Worship things that are real. Don't worship lies.

US has higher fertility rates than Europe because US is more religious.

Most of America's fertility is in impoverished minorities, nothing to ever want to emulate.

Another example is Israel. They have very high birth rates. Jews have contributed more to science than Chinese have despite being <1% of China's population. Ask yourself why

Who said Jews have contributed more? What's the source? Chinese innovation is the only challenge to the US. Israel doesn't even register.

 

[manqiangrexue]

Greed decreases nationalism and patriotism.

But it is practical in the wealth that it brings to the country allowing for research and science. Nationalism will only go so far without resources.

Wealthy people are less likely to sacrifice for their country.

A wealthy person can contribute so much more to the technological rise of a country than a poor but patriotic one. That is why North Korea is stuck.

Your point about genetics is correct.

My point about everything is correct.

The economic and financial support just does not make a difference. We've already seen it tried in Europe and Asia.

Nobody has done what I said needs to be done.

The key problem is feminism. When women join the workplace and become more educated, they will have less children.

OK, but the solution is to help them balance, not to put them back barefoot in the kitchen.

Religion suppresses feminism.

But it brings about unparallelled stupidity. You can stop a headache by cutting off one's head but much better solutions are needed.

The key question you have to ask yourself is: how do we get rid of feminism in China?

With masculinity. My wife was a feminist bisexual who didn't want any kids, didn't want marriage and wanted to stay in the US for an easy lazy life filled with vacations. I told her I hate everything about her except her looks and genetics so I'm gonna have to make some changes to get this to work. Now, we have 2 kids, 1 one the way, another planned and are going back to China within 2 years. No more vacations, no more luxuries, she does not even ask; she makes 6 figures and saves it all for future family needs.

Train men to not be beta and feminism will disappear because all feminists are just women pissed off over the edge that they don't have a strong attractive man to lead them and build a loving family with.

 

[manqiangrexue]

This whole concept of dating for love needs to be destroyed. Dating is for marriage. Arranged marriages are better than love marriages. Our grandparents understood this and it's part of traditional Chinese culture.

Both arranged marriage and marriage by love can work. Mine is the latter and so is the one between my parents and my wife's parents. No need to shun one just because it doesn't personally suit you.

I am a true Chinese nationalist.

A true Chinese nationalist should never propose adopting a religion, the religon of the enemy and brainwashing Chinese people to be fools who ask no evidence but just fuck and squeeze out kids while praying to a cross.

If my happiness has to be sacrificed for the great rejuvenation of China, I am willing to do it. Are you?

My happiness never has to be sacrificed for this purpose because my happiness is in serving the country. Also, I have 2 kids, going on 4 and I don't even like kids. Am I willing to sacrifice for the country? What do you think?

Your policy proposals are not radical enough to truly solve the problem.

They've never been implemented. We can try and I think they will work. Even if it doesn't we look for other ways; but we never become Christians. With your proposal, we might as well set the whole country on fire and forget about it. Billions of mindless imbeciles worshipping white Jesus.