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Air Force Brat said:

Probably not, but there's a major trade dispute with Boeing? So they might buy Eurofighter or Rafale just to make a point.

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Air Force Brat said:

Probably not, but there's a major trade dispute with Boeing? So they might buy Eurofighter or Rafale just to make a point.

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Ottawa ditched plan to buy newer fleet of Boeing Super Hornets after US imposed 80% import tariff on Canadian Bombardier jets

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will purchase a fleet of 30-year-old F/A-18 Hornet fighter jets from Australia amid an escalating trade dispute with the US.

Plans to buy a newer fleet of 18 Boeing Super Hornets were ditched

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and Canada will instead spend about $500m on the fleet of vintage RAAF planes.

Ottawa announced last year it wanted to buy the Super Hornets as a stopgap measure while it runs a competition for 88 jets to replace its ageing 77 CF-18s fighters, but it scrapped those plans and made clear the company had little chance of winning a much larger contract unless it dropped the trade challenge against the Canadian aircraft manufacturer.

The announcement marks a new low in relations between Canada’s Liberal government and Boeing and casts into doubt the future of defence cooperation with the US aerospace company, which says it supports more than 17,500 jobs in Canada.

But Boeing has indicated it is unlikely to back down on the trade challenge and the issue has become a political problem for the Canadian prime minister, Justin Trudeau. Andrew Scheer, leader of the official opposition Conservative party, on Tuesday mocked him for buying old jets.

“If the prime minister is so keen on buying fixer-uppers, will he come over, because I have an old minivan I would love to show him,” Scheer said to laughter in the House of Commons.

Jonathan Vance, chief of the defence staff of the Canadian Armed Forces, told

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the Australian jets would be an adequate stopgap measure until its next-generation fighter fleet was delivered in about 2025.

The used Australian jets will be flown to Canada in 2018.

The Canadian air force has long preferred a US jet, according to sources. Canada is part of the consortium that helped develop Lockheed Martin’s F-35 stealth fighter and the previous Conservative government announced in 2010 it would buy 65 of the planes.

It later backtracked and during the 2015 election campaign Trudeau vowed not to buy the fighter on the grounds it was too expensive. After he took power, the government softened its tone.

But Trudeau is not a fan of the F-35 and the Boeing spat means officials are prepared to look at rivals such as the Eurofighter Typhoon and Dassault Aviation SA’s Rafale jet, say the sources, who asked to remain anonymous given the sensitivity of the situation.

If Canada went for the Typhoon or the Rafale, it would have to decide whether to use US weapons or buy European armaments systems and integrate them with those used by US forces.

One defence expert noted that Britain, Germany and Italy intend to operate both the F-35 and the Eurofighter, evidence that Canada could buy the European jet and still operate with US air force F-35s.

Although Canada will extend the lifespan of some CF-18s to 2025 to cover the introduction of the new fighters, Canadian Global Affairs Institute defence analyst David Perry on Wednesday predicted Ottawa would keep the old planes in service for longer than planned and drag out the competition.

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Jura said:

according to The Guardian Canada to buy fleet of 30-year-old fighter jets from Australia in snub to US

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Air Force Brat said:

,,, that's why the German Air Force is making their preference for the F-35 known in public!

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Jura said:

in the meantime in Germany “The indicated view of the inspector of the air force that the F-35 Lightning II is an especially suitable successor to the Tornado system is not the position of the federal government,” Deputy Defence Minister Ralf Brauksiepe wrote in the letter.
Germany favors Eurofighter as it seeks to replace Tornado
December 11, 2017

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Air Force Brat said:

There ya go Bub! further proof the Air Force Brat has his finger on the pulse of human nature and history, and further proof you ought to recognize my expertise on the F-35,,,, I would NOT LIE to you to advance my position, and no the F-35 is NOT a perfect airplane,,, its just a damn sight better than anything else if we've got to operate in the toxic airspace that the Russians and Chinese are hoping to proliferate and export,, but in all honesty, the Canadians are not worried about that,, they know who will roll downtown to the heavy lifting!

used F-18's are still a Boeing product, and proof positive that our boy Justin really isn't to serious about defending Canada, that job will revert back to the US as usual, and hell yes, close those contracts that allow Canada to reap the benefits of partnering on the F-35,,, they're NOT partners, they're mooching... Samo, Samo, with Turkey,,, if they want to buy Russian S-400s, let em buy the SU-35, or better yet the very expensive SU-57...

We have some real partners who would be happy to take a larger piece of the pie!

But I do agree those trade tariffs with our allies are kinda stooped,,, looks like more Obama Nation alienation going on,,,, Trump really ought to lighten up a little and get together with the Canadians and get this figured out!

I can definitely see Canada buying the Eurofighter first, or even the Rafale, they're both still good airplanes in todays environment, but they will so reach a point of obsolescence very shortly due to much better Air Defenses,,, that's why the German Air Force is making their preference for the F-35 known in public!

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PiSigma said:

Justin is a dumbass. He rather sacrifice the air force and protect his friends in bombardier than doing the right thing. Companies like bombardier should be allowed to go bankrupt.

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Air Force Brat said:

Boeing doesn't want the competition, I understand that, and if Canada is unloading them at below cost just to prop them up, you're absolutely right! but Canada is a very close ally, the problem is, they don't see the threat, they feel insulated from the Soviets,,, er Russians, by that vast Arctic Wilderness!,,,

and yes Justin, like Komrad Obama does have a problem,,, socialist's all think Capitalists are the bad guys??

America is still one of the few places in the world where somebody at the bottom of the heap, can be smart and work hard and crawl out of poverty and succeed.. It ain't easy, but nobody here is starving, even those lazy SOB's who refuse to work...

but anyway, shame Justin doesn't care enough about Freedom to pay his fair share?? Not sure how he got elected, but he did?? Lots of people don't realize that Freedom isn't Free, somebody somewhere is paying for it today, and may sacrifice his or her life,, my Dad risked his life everytime he went to work,, he didn't want thanks or praise, just wanted the do nothings to get out of his way and let him serve his country!

those who sit around home waiting to collect a check??? they shouldn't really have a say in how the sweat equity of the working man is spent,,, and we know that story all to well here in the US,,, it's disgraceful.

My Dad and Mom saved, my Grandpa told my Dad, "Jr., when I die, I want you to take that 6,000 dollars you'll get from my life insurance, and buy a farm, and make a home for your wife and kids.... we bought a farm in Tennessee, sold that and moved here to Central Obamastan, with beautiful "black loam", and raised hogs, beef cattle, corn and soybeans,,, my DAD worked hard every day on the farm, until about a week before he died of Multiple Myeloma, complicated by "Acute Leukemia",, I helped him every chance I got, I shelled corn, cut soybeans, and put up hay to feed the cattle, fixed fence, dug up water hydrants that were leaking.. I've worked hard too, and I try to instill those values of work, as well as love and charity for those truly in need, the unborn, infants, small children, teenagers, women and men in that order, I also have tried to be there for the elderly and those who are dying... I've given away my last 200 bucks at Christmas to help a young guy with his family...

because I've done without myself, but there was always somebody there willing to help, and the Lord has provided un-expected windfalls at times when I was desparate..

There are a lot of good people in Canada, people who still consider the US to be us, just like I consider the Canadians to be us! We the people!

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Canada should scuttle its problem-plagued shipbuilding program and instead launch a series of fixed-cost competitions to ensure it quickly obtains icebreakers, supply ships and frigates, a new report argues.

The study, published Thursday by the University of British Columbia, warns that the federal government’s efforts to build new ships are years behind schedule and billions of dollars over budget. The report’s author, Prof. Michael Byers, recommends dumping the current process and relaunching an expedited procurement that would save money by using only fixed-price competitions and off-the-shelf ship designs.

As an example, Byers pointed to the last month’s fixed-cost proposal from an Italian-French shipbuilding consortium to construct 15 new frigates at Halifax’s Irving Shipyard, which the shipbuilders said would save the government $30 billion. The Liberal government rejected that proposal, arguing it would have unfairly circumvented the established national shipbuilding strategy.

“Not seizing upon the significant cost savings made available by Fincantieri and Naval Group is both irrational and irresponsible,” Byers writes in the report. “$30 billion is a staggering amount of money — more, indeed, than the original budget for the entire National Shipbuilding Procurement Strategy.”

Byers, an expert on Canadian foreign and defence policy and international law and author of the book Who Owns The Arctic?, suggests the government could also have other firms submit competitive bids for the frigate replacement, dubbed the Canadian Surface Combatant, as long as they were at a fixed price and used off-the-shelf designs.

He also recommends launching a fixed-price competition to immediately convert a second container ship into a supply vessel, similar to the conversion Quebec shipbuilding firm Davie undertook over the last 18 months for the Royal Canadian Navy. That would mean the end of the Joint Support Ship program, which was to provide the navy with two supply vessels but which is still years from the actual beginning construction on the ships.

In addition, the report proposes shelving the plan to build a heavy polar icebreaker in Vancouver, recommending instead an expedited fixed-price competition for the conversion or construction of four to five medium icebreakers. With climate change reducing the severity of ice conditions in the north, Byers argues, the project to build a ship of the size and ice-breaking capacity of the planned polar icebreaker is excessive and overly expensive.

The report questions particular aspects of the national shipbuilding program. For one, Byers points to the federal government’s decision to allow “non-proven designs — namely BAE’s Type 26 frigate — into a competition that it had previously indicated were limited to ‘off the shelf’ designs.”

He also questions why the federal government awarded a $5 billion in-service support contract for the Joint Support Ships to French defence giant Thales in August, at least two years before the construction contract for the same vessels is likely to be signed with Seaspan shipyards in Vancouver. “Apart from putting the cart before the proverbial horse, this sequencing failure prematurely limited the government’s flexibility,” Byers writes. “If the government decides to change its plans concerning the support ships, it will now have to renegotiate or cancel the contract with Thales — at some unnecessary cost to taxpayers.”

The report is a follow-up to a 2014 examination of the national shipbuilding program, which warned about problems and a lack of oversight on the multi-billion-dollar strategy.

Federal officials have said that the national shipbuilding program is proceeding as planned, pointing out that bids are in for the Canadian Surface Combatant and one coast guard ship has now been launched.

But the government also says it can’t provide parliament with a schedule for the delivery of the navy’s new supply ships or the coast guard’s Polar-class icebreaker because it deems such information secret. The schedule “is subject to commercial confidence restrictions and cannot be shared,” the government has said. That has prompted concern from parliamentarians such as Todd Doherty, Conservative critic for oceans, fishieries and the coast guard, that both programs have fallen significantly behind schedule.

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3 Frigates, a sub, a Maritime Coastal Defence Vessel and replenishment vessel ASTERIX working together

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Jura said:

Saturday at 5:58 PMno posts here so Canada opts out of Super Hornet buy

... and the rest is behind paywall at Jane's

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Boeing has yet to decide whether to compete for a contract worth $12-14.5 billion to replace Canada’s tactical fighter fleet. The airframer once had the deal in its pocket before Ottawa terminated plans to buy the F/A-18E/F Super Hornet after Boeing filed a trade complaint against Bombardier last May.

In a possible sign that the company could forego submitting a bid, Boeing chose to skip a one-day information session for potential bidders on 22 January that was hosted by Canadian agency managing the Future Fighter Capability acquisition programme.

Boeing confirmed the absence and says it remains convinced that the Super Hornet is the best option for the Royal Canadian Air Force, although the airframer has not decided whether to offer the aircraft yet.

“We continue to believe that the Super Hornet is the low-risk, low-cost approach that has all the advanced capabilities the Royal Canadian Air Force needs now and well into the future,” Boeing says.

“We will evaluate our participation in Canada’s Future Fighter Capability Project (FFCP) after the Government of Canada outlines the FFCP procurement approach, requirements and evaluation criteria,” Boeing adds.

US government officials attended the information session hosted by Public Services and Procurement Canada (PSPC), the Canadian government’s acquisition arm, Boeing says.

Boeing may face a deadline in two weeks to make a decision. Attendance at the information session was not mandatory, but PSPC has requested that all potential bidders respond by 9 February to an invitation to join a Suppliers List. Only companies that respond to the invitation will be informed and allowed to participate in all future steps of the FFCP acquisition process, the PSPC says.

The indecision by Boeing reflects a staggering turn-around in the company’s fortunes in Ottawa since last year. In his victorious 2015 election campaign, now-prime minister Justin Trudeau promised to cancel the previous government’s plans to buy the Lockheed Martin F-35A without first staging a competition. A year later, the Trudeau government announced plans to acquire 24 new F/A-18E/Fs as an interim replacement for the CF-18, until a competition selected a permanent solution after 2020.

But those plans changed last May after Boeing filed an anti-dumping and countervailing duty complaint against Canadian aircraft manufacturer Bombardier over an April 16 sale to Delta Air Lines of 75 CS100s. The US Commerce Department agreed with Boeing’s position and set a nearly 300% tariff on CSeries imports to the USA. The final outcome of the case now depends on a vote by the US International Trade Commission on 25 January, which will decide whether the Delta order caused financial harm to Boeing and, if so, ratify the tariff.

Meanwhile, the Trudeau government scrapped the plan to buy Super Hornets last summer. The RCAF instead plans to buy retired F/A-18s from the Royal Australian Air Force as an interim CF-18 replacement.

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