I had a look at an 80's book I have and it mentions the HEAT-Fin Stabilised round you wrote about. According to this source, the round can penetrate 460mm of armour.
This seems excessive to me.
Artillery regiment questions
- Thread starter xyin
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I had a look at an 80's book I have and it mentions the HEAT-Fin Stabilised round you wrote about. According to this source, the round can penetrate 460mm of armour.
This seems excessive to me.
well, they used the finnish name of the grenade as a bitchy option in formal gun training by shouting to load pyrstövakavoitupyöriväjohtorenkainenontelokranaatti
...and even for a fin, thats a bit of word twisting as we were supposed to repeat all commands that we heard
...and even for a fin, thats a bit of word twisting as we were supposed to repeat all commands that we heard
well, they used the finnish name of the grenade as a bitchy option in formal gun training by shouting to load pyrstövakavoitupyöriväjohtorenkainenontelokranaatti
...and even for a fin, thats a bit of word twisting as we were supposed to repeat all commands that we heard
You have to be kidding me
oddityes of finnish language...
Hi all
thanx for your all discusstions.The north-region and the A-class Inf.Reg.of divisions have a 122mm-level Howitzer Battalion. Rest of them are unknowen.
IMO P.L.A. doesn't pay enough attention for upgrading their Artilleriy of the nomal infantry Division. Some Amor and mechanized units are getting Typ-89 122 SPGs.Marine and paratroops are equipped with D-30. And I guess Type 83 122mm Howitzer is the most widely in this caliber for the rest normal inf.div.
regards
Yin
thanx for your all discusstions.The north-region and the A-class Inf.Reg.of divisions have a 122mm-level Howitzer Battalion. Rest of them are unknowen.
IMO P.L.A. doesn't pay enough attention for upgrading their Artilleriy of the nomal infantry Division. Some Amor and mechanized units are getting Typ-89 122 SPGs.Marine and paratroops are equipped with D-30. And I guess Type 83 122mm Howitzer is the most widely in this caliber for the rest normal inf.div.
regards
Yin
The D30 and PKMS GPMG are Soviet designs that China could have copied and deployed on large scale, but I suspect it was due to domestic politics that the local inferior designs won (Type 83 and Type 67).
The 122 Howitzers can fire a cluster round (top-attack, western technology supplied in the 80s) for AT defense.
The 130mm cannons are normally in "reserve arty" (corps and up). They are replaced by the long 152 (W86? which shares the same mount) and new 155mm designs. There are however reports of special garison regiments & divisions using 130mm Ty59 in place of 85/100mm AT guns. I can only speculate that the weapons were issued before the Ty86 100mm smoothbore/Sabot gun was developed, and a 130mm flat trajectory HEAT round certainly had better chance of stopping T72s than old solid AP.
The 122 Howitzers can fire a cluster round (top-attack, western technology supplied in the 80s) for AT defense.
The 130mm cannons are normally in "reserve arty" (corps and up). They are replaced by the long 152 (W86? which shares the same mount) and new 155mm designs. There are however reports of special garison regiments & divisions using 130mm Ty59 in place of 85/100mm AT guns. I can only speculate that the weapons were issued before the Ty86 100mm smoothbore/Sabot gun was developed, and a 130mm flat trajectory HEAT round certainly had better chance of stopping T72s than old solid AP.
szbd
Junior Member
guys, I have some little information to share with you.
I have a friend who was an artilary officer in 38th army. He didn't graduate from artilary academy but army officer academy (so called Chinese west point), so he was not actually an artilary commander, but a staff in the artilary battalion of an infantry regiment. Later his division transfered to armed police and he got promoted and transfered to sort of MP unit in Beijing Garrison. He is a native Beijinger.
The last conversation between us was 5 years ago, so the information is quite old.
His division was motorized, so had barely any SP artilaries. His battalion had type 86 100mm anti tank gun, type 63 130mm rocket launcher and AA guns i don't remember the type, should be dual 37mm. They also had small AA missiles. His division's artilary regiment had type 81 122mm rocket launcher, type 86 122mm gun (that is D30, so it's not only equipted in airbone and marine corps) and type 83 152mm SP artilary. He said most of the artilary officers in his division took rotation to be trained in the type 83 SP battalion. He said riding in that thing is much more comfortable than in a type 59 tank.
One interesting thing is his battalion got a type of SP non recoil gun for testing, to replace type 86 anti tank gun. This thing can be remotely loaded and fired but got poor evaluation from his battalion (probably also from other units) and seems never went into service.
Information from other sources (internet and magazines):
Type 59-1 130mm is still widely equippted in army corps' artilary brigades. As an example, the Nanjing military regione named an artilary company as "magic artilary company in straight front line", the same company got first class honor in 79's war with Vietnam for destroying 4 152mm guns with 24 rounds. This company was equipted with type 59-1 in 79 and now still the same.
Now China is going for all SP artilaries. The first step is to equipt armoured and mechanized units. The main types are type 83 152mm, type 89 122mm, type 90 122mm MRLS (wheeled), type 89 122mm MRLS (tracked) and new wheeled 100mm and 105mm antitank guns.
I have a friend who was an artilary officer in 38th army. He didn't graduate from artilary academy but army officer academy (so called Chinese west point), so he was not actually an artilary commander, but a staff in the artilary battalion of an infantry regiment. Later his division transfered to armed police and he got promoted and transfered to sort of MP unit in Beijing Garrison. He is a native Beijinger.
The last conversation between us was 5 years ago, so the information is quite old.
His division was motorized, so had barely any SP artilaries. His battalion had type 86 100mm anti tank gun, type 63 130mm rocket launcher and AA guns i don't remember the type, should be dual 37mm. They also had small AA missiles. His division's artilary regiment had type 81 122mm rocket launcher, type 86 122mm gun (that is D30, so it's not only equipted in airbone and marine corps) and type 83 152mm SP artilary. He said most of the artilary officers in his division took rotation to be trained in the type 83 SP battalion. He said riding in that thing is much more comfortable than in a type 59 tank.
One interesting thing is his battalion got a type of SP non recoil gun for testing, to replace type 86 anti tank gun. This thing can be remotely loaded and fired but got poor evaluation from his battalion (probably also from other units) and seems never went into service.
Information from other sources (internet and magazines):
Type 59-1 130mm is still widely equippted in army corps' artilary brigades. As an example, the Nanjing military regione named an artilary company as "magic artilary company in straight front line", the same company got first class honor in 79's war with Vietnam for destroying 4 152mm guns with 24 rounds. This company was equipted with type 59-1 in 79 and now still the same.
Now China is going for all SP artilaries. The first step is to equipt armoured and mechanized units. The main types are type 83 152mm, type 89 122mm, type 90 122mm MRLS (wheeled), type 89 122mm MRLS (tracked) and new wheeled 100mm and 105mm antitank guns.
China is going for all SP artilleries? I don't believe that because I thought they want to save money by keeping some towed artilleries around. But then, the future war is highly mobile and towed artilleries aren't that much use anyways. Besides, they still have a few thousand type 59 tanks that can serve as mobile artilleries.
szbd
Junior Member
From what you are seeing China want to save money from military expense? The budget is rising double digit a year. One of the goals for Chinese miliary modernization is "mechanization", and we can see what happened to the units that are officially mechanized. And the number of those units (regement or brigade) is going up every few months.
The towed artilleries will only be in reserve artillery divisions. Those divisions are still important units though.
The towed artilleries will only be in reserve artillery divisions. Those divisions are still important units though.
The mechanized/armoured divisions will certainly be equipped with SP artilleries, but not the motorized divisions though.
The US has a high military budget (much higher than that of China's), but they still use towed artillery for fire support.