Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
Apparently the no of the crippled train is D3115 and D310 is the derailed train. The accident is rear ended not head on. Another train is hit by Lightning
All is not what it seems within China's High Speed Rail development.
- Thread starter bladerunner
- Start date
Seems like lightning is a major weakness for Chinese trains. A couple of accidents on the Beijing-Shanghai line also resulted from lightning based malfunctioning.
Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
You cannot design electronic drive or component to completely mitigate the effect of lightning Coup Plane downed by lightning happened all the time
People should not quick to condemn as crappy design . It is tremendous force of nature. A direct hit will result in temperature reaching 3000 deg easily will melt any fuse
Lightning can occur with both positive and negative polarity. An average bolt of negative lightning carries an electric current of 30,000 amperes ("amps") — 30 "kiloamps" (kA), and transfers fifteen coulombs of electric charge and 500 megajoules of energy. Large bolts of lightning can carry up to 120 kA and 350 coulombs.[15] An average bolt of positive lightning carries an electric current of about 300 kA — about 10 times that of negative lightning. [16]
The average peak power output of a single lightning stroke is about one trillion watts — one "terawatt" (1012 W), and the stroke lasts for about 30 millionths of a second — 30 "microseconds".[18]
People should not quick to condemn as crappy design . It is tremendous force of nature. A direct hit will result in temperature reaching 3000 deg easily will melt any fuse
Lightning can occur with both positive and negative polarity. An average bolt of negative lightning carries an electric current of 30,000 amperes ("amps") — 30 "kiloamps" (kA), and transfers fifteen coulombs of electric charge and 500 megajoules of energy. Large bolts of lightning can carry up to 120 kA and 350 coulombs.[15] An average bolt of positive lightning carries an electric current of about 300 kA — about 10 times that of negative lightning. [16]
The average peak power output of a single lightning stroke is about one trillion watts — one "terawatt" (1012 W), and the stroke lasts for about 30 millionths of a second — 30 "microseconds".[18]
Last edited:
bladerunner
Banned Idiot
As Zoom said Systems should have detected the track ahead was occupied by another train and stopped the other train. Surely there must be something in place which alerts the driver of the second train. If it couldnt stop it in time then for some reason the second train must have been dangerously close in the first place.
Futhermore I remember reading that on the Shanghai Peking line, it was proposed to have a train leaving every 15 minutes.and assuming that was a simalar practice on other lines there should have been a reasonable gap between trains right? certainly enough time to stop.
FRom a marketing point of view that only leaves Japan who can claim that theres never been a accident on their HSR in all the years of operation.
Last edited:
Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
The train that involved in accident is not high speed train with max speed of 150 mile /hr is far from being high speed. You probably doesn't have time to stop the train if it happened within minute or two. It take time and distance to slow a moving train unless you have a kind of radar in front the train which I don't know of any train in the world that has this feature BTW the train probably built in 80's so more like likely built using Japanese of European technology.
The dispatcher should know when trains will go into collusion let wait and see the investigation. My guess is they don't have time to react
The dispatcher should know when trains will go into collusion let wait and see the investigation. My guess is they don't have time to react
Last edited:
bladerunner
Banned Idiot
unnecessary
Last edited:
zoom
Junior Member
It doesn't necessary need radar,there are many systems being used all over the world ,some using GPS/Glonass.Europe has had one in place for over 100 years and the UK is continually improving theirs which was first implemented in 1956.see here >
I'll try find what system China uses but we need to learn more about the accident before we can start looking at the reasons it occured.However,the technology has existed for decades and can over-ride the driver.Trains of the future won't even have drivers.
I'll try find what system China uses but we need to learn more about the accident before we can start looking at the reasons it occured.However,the technology has existed for decades and can over-ride the driver.Trains of the future won't even have drivers.
kwaigonegin
Colonel
I wonder if China has an equivalent of organisations like the National Lightning Safety Institute (NLSI) in the US. MY guess would be no but they need to with their massive infrastructure buildup in the past decade.
Mr T
Senior Member
I've never heard of a derailment this bad caused by lightning so I don't have anything to compare the situation with. I suppose it will take time to find out if this was reasonably preventable.
As for the government changing how things are done, you're asking for an entire culture change. Sure, the Standing Committee or Politburo could say that public works projects have to be done "properly", but a lot of officials will think no one will know if they cut corners. But if they get it done on time then they'll be able to take immediate credit. If it's late, they'll be criticised. No one remembers to give you a reward in 20 years' time if everything's still working properly.
It's not like lightning pushes the carraiges off the rails or anything -- it would intefere with the electronics or something along that idea and subsequently cause the collision. Lightning could screw up anything on a massive scale if said thing was not thoroughly lightning proof, I think, so the collision on "this scale" not having been caused by lightning before doesn't really mean much.
Of course that is if the collision was caused by lightning.
I don't expect miracles, but at least they'll try harder to prevent similar accidents happening again.