Are you including the Far East fleet in the European Russian navy?
Aircraft Carriers II (Closed to posting)
- Thread starter Jeff Head
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asif iqbal
Lieutenant General
French use a 4+ 6 ratio (SSBN/SSN) and the UK 4 + 7, French have different mission requirements and commitments to UK so the 6 x SSN work for them with regards to the logistics and maintainance so I would not see it any different to the UK in terms of capability by a single SSN
And we should compare like for like, the Rubis Class vs Trafalgar Class and the Barracuda Class vs Astute this is the real comparison and with that regard there is not much between them
Another thing to note is that he French SSBN fleet is more modern than the UK with all 4 x Triomphant Class in service the last one 4 years ago UK is still to decide how many SSBN replace the 4 Vamguard Class come post 2020 it could be just 3 units in which case they might as well not bother with a replacement programme
As far as the Queen Elizabeth is concerned it has a mission requirement in two forms one is air superiority and the second is littoral combat missions
No question Royal Marines will take use of the QE for littoral missions but that is for air transport, the QE has no well deck and no ship to shore connectors it doesn't carry landing craft it does not provide amphibious capability that is not one of the missions
So to be clear the QE will "contribute" to a amphibious mission not conduct it
A new protocol to off load Royal Marine equipment has not been developed and changes to the design have not been carried out as per a study carried out a few years ago
So QE doesn't meet a fully fledged carrier with cats and traps requirements and doesn't fit for amphibious missions like US Marines it lies somewhere in between for air superiority and littoral missions
It's like me buying a Mercedes S- Class and not spending another 1% for a sat nav and end up spending time lost and wasting fuel in the long term it's going to cost me more
A few changes and I mean small changes would greatly enhance the QE that isn't being done so we have a compromise, if you think RAF base in Cyprus alone is cost around $200 million a year alone and can't be moved like a carrier it's not a very wise decision
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asif iqbal
Lieutenant General
Correct me if I am wrong but there is not replacement programme for Albion Class and HMS Ocean, with two flat deck carriers I find it hard to justify for LHD and LPD let's wait and see
If it's true then UK losses it's amphibious capability and come post 2020 the UK LPD and LHD fleet will pretty old and nearing the end of the life
So by the time both QE are in service and trained up there might not be a RN amphibious force
HMS Astute
Junior Member
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The Albion class are new. Commissioned in 2003 and 2005 respectively. It will be another decade before they seriously start a replacement program.
IMHO, it is premature at this point to say that the UK does not plan to replace them, unless, outside of my knowledge, the UK has officially made such a statement.
HMS Astute
Junior Member
TerraN_EmpirE
Tyrant King
Translation: "We got Screwed on this one, Thought we could have our cake and eat it to... Oh well Moving on will just try and build our own. It's going to take a long time though."
But there will be the compensation payments for not fulfilling the contracts otherwise the French economy will be hit hard, by Russia and by other countries that cease to trust France.
TerraN_EmpirE
Tyrant King
France is stuck between the rock and the hard place. but chances are they feel they can survive the fall out.
When the prospects for the Russian Mistral build was still in place, the Russians openly admitted that doing this deal saved them ten years of research and development in getting to the point where they could do it themselves.
We'll see if that was an accurate assessment...and even if they now proceed at all with a true LHD, or go another route.
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