Aircraft Carriers II (Closed to posting)

Re: Does india really need aircraft carriers

Apong said:

I am not sure but maybe it is two operational carriers at one time while the third at dockyard for maintenance/servicing/repair/construction/upgrade. IAC-2 is still not in picture, but Viraat is likely to be in service till 2018-2020, by the time Viraat retires IAC-1 can enter active service with the namesake of Vikrant II the second in its class in the mean time and IAC-2 should take shape which may replace the Vikramaditya in the future.

IAC-2 till now is not named, it can be named as Viraat II or might bear a new name.

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It will be intereting to see if the do name the IAC-2 Viraat.

And yes...having three carriers will mean they can keep two available most all of the time and that very well could be what their doctrine. call for.

Re: PLAN Carrier Operations..News, Videos & Photos

Just to want to compare the layout of the two carriers (Chinese carrier and INS Vikramaditya). Not inciting anything.





It seems the Indian navy and its Russian contractor had a harder time to optimize the deck for aircraft carrier use.

I borrowed Jeff's carrier schematics. Hope you dont mind.

I've always wondered, does USN ships get their internet access from satellites? How fast are the surfing speeds?

Re: PLAN Carrier Operations..News, Videos & Photos

Vini_Vidi_Vici said:

I have noticed. I remember seeing videos of SU-33 landing on the Admiral Kuznetsov, the deck looked really narrow. I was surprised that they never crashed into the bridges before. Hats off and solute to the Soviet pilots.

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Wasn't Admiral Gorshkov supposed to be a helicopter carrier with lots of Bazalt missiles? I have seen conceptions of the carrier, having its missiles in the bow region completely stripped and converted into part of the deck. But even so, it would be akward to launch and land fighter jets like Mig-29. The deck would simply be too short, or just enough to pull it off. The pilots would have to be super careful.

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Carrier OPs are always a little dicey, its really not as bad as you might suppose, but it does require a lot of finesse to bring the aircraft aboard the carrier, especially in poor weather. Departing on the ramp isn't as big a concern unless you lose an engine, thats the real operational benefit to the CAT, you depart the ship with a full head of steam at a reduced AOA, with more fuel and ordnance. On the F-18, you Cat off the carrier with both hands off the stick and on the "towel rack", in order to reduce the opportunity for a PIO. Oh and all pilots are "super carefull most of the time", it takes a little "somethin special" to be a fighter pilot, especially if you start and finish on a carrier deck. The carrier and the aircraft are designed as a package and function well together, it is normally best to design Navy aircraft and Air Force Aircraft differently to optimize each for its intended.

Re: PLAN Carrier Operations..News, Videos & Photos

Vini_Vidi_Vici said:

The deck would simply be too short, or just enough to pull it off.

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The take-off run and landing run available quite the same, but on the Indian carrier there is less space to the left and to the right for mistakes. The Chinese carrier is safer in this manner, like modern US carriers are safer than their predecessors because they have less aircraft on less crowded decks.

Re: PLAN Carrier Operations..News, Videos & Photos

Intrepid said:

The take-off run and landing run available quite the same, but on the Indian carrier there is less space to the left and to the right for mistakes. The Chinese carrier is safer in this manner, like modern US carriers are safer than their predecessors because they have less aircraft on less crowded decks.

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Agree, the US carrier decks are huge compare to other national counterparts. If my memory serves me correctly, they landed a C-130 on it once? How did they get it off? the runway is definitely not long enough for takeoff and catapults cannot move something that heavy. Even if it could, the air-frame on the C-130 wouldn't be able to stand the stress.

Re: PLAN Carrier Operations..News, Videos & Photos

Vini_Vidi_Vici said:

If my memory serves me correctly, they landed a C-130 on it once? How did they get it off? the runway is definitely not long enough for takeoff and catapults cannot move something that heavy. Even if it could, the air-frame on the C-130 wouldn't be able to stand the stress.

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Short article about that event, not linked for the first time in this thread:

Lockheed's Ted Limmer, who checked out fighter pilot Flatley in the C-130, stayed on for some of the initial touch-and-go and full-stop landings. "The last landing I participated in, we touched down about 150 feet from the end, stopped in 270 feet more and launched from that position, using what was left of the deck. We still had a couple hundred feet left when we lifted off. Admiral Brown was flabbergasted."

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Vini_Vidi_Vici said:

I've always wondered, does USN ships get their internet access from satellites? How fast are the surfing speeds?

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Yes and I don't know. But I do know while at sea the internet is blocked out at times and at other times not available.

Jeff at one time the US Navy used (for piston engines ) AV Gas which is highly volitale.
Jp 5 is still the standard aboard USN ships

bd popeye said:

Yes and I don't know. But I do know while at sea the internet is blocked out at times and at other times not available.

Jeff at one time the US Navy used (for piston engines ) AV Gas which is highly volitale.
Jp 5 is still the standard aboard USN ships

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Yes...as I indicated in my above post...that was my bad and just a poor choice of words.

As I said, if there is an accident where a Zuni rocket goes off accidentally, or a handler leaves equipment in the wrong place so that the aux unit cannot be positioned properly for an aircraft, or some other event...a deck load of JP-5, bombs, rockets, missiles, and ammo will just ruin your entire day.

Re: PLAN Carrier Operations..News, Videos & Photos

Just watched a youtube video, a copy of the original record. It showed the C-130 took off under its own power. That was quite astounding.