052/052B Class Destroyers
- Thread starter tphuang
- Start date
re: PLAN Type 052 Class Destroyer
I think 055 (or something along the 10-12k ton CG) is a real project.
But that write up is obviuosly bs... 1024 missiles is ridiculous. Not to mention 155mm gun when 130mm just came out. Not to mention the name of the site itself. doesnt' lend it much credibility, too fanboy.
I think 055 (or something along the 10-12k ton CG) is a real project.
But that write up is obviuosly bs... 1024 missiles is ridiculous. Not to mention 155mm gun when 130mm just came out. Not to mention the name of the site itself. doesnt' lend it much credibility, too fanboy.
steve_rolfe
Junior Member
re: PLAN Type 052 Class Destroyer
That isnt actually the site where i saw the discussuions on the type 055...............but i have seen that fanboy image of the ship on several places on the web. I have also seen images that show the 055 to be a sort of cross between an enlarged type 45 mixed with a 054d, again i believe more fanboy creations.
But i do believe that such a ship the type 055 is in the Chinese plans in the not too distant future, anyway iam sure members here will be alerted to this fact, if and when unusual shape modules start appearing at Chinese shipyards.
That isnt actually the site where i saw the discussuions on the type 055...............but i have seen that fanboy image of the ship on several places on the web. I have also seen images that show the 055 to be a sort of cross between an enlarged type 45 mixed with a 054d, again i believe more fanboy creations.
But i do believe that such a ship the type 055 is in the Chinese plans in the not too distant future, anyway iam sure members here will be alerted to this fact, if and when unusual shape modules start appearing at Chinese shipyards.
steve_rolfe
Junior Member
re: PLAN Type 052 Class Destroyer
This is the quesstimated spec for the Type 055 ship, as i found on a French naval forum.
The spec is from a French engineer..........take or leave this info as you like, but some of it may be realised.......anyway it gives us time here to think of the possibilities, while we wait for more news and photos on the TYPE 052D construction:-
Possible Type 055 Spec
--------------------------
• Displacement 12 000t
• COGAG propulsion, with an improved version of Chinese turbine QC-280
• The APARs double beds, H/LJG-346A, which power the 052D today, will be used again on Type 055
• Metric radar, Type 517B will be replaced by another type of radar unknown
• Double hangar
• ⩾ speed 30 knots
• Its combat system, fleet type, can directly control any weapons other vessels under its responsibility and is oriented network-centric, which is able to send and receive information via the terrestrial, naval, sub- marine and space to other combat units.
• Hardware anti-air is composed of HHQ-9 extensively modified and hot-launch, the medium-range missiles (H/AJK-16?), HQ-10 and the same CIWS gun installed on the aircraft carrier 16 Liaoning a cannon tubes 11 x 30mm with a rate greater than 10,000 strokes / minute.
• The main gun caliber 130mm H/PJ-38
• Hardware anti-submarine missiles with anti-submarine and new WHH0004
• Supersonic anti-ship missile with a strong ECCM capability, performance "than fully YJ-83 and YJ-62" and "compatible with the universal VLS"
• All electronic equipment is highly integrated, the external appearance of the vessel is again simplified
• Capacity ECM / ECCM increased which helps protect the whole fleet
• Simplification of command levels, number of combat positions decreased
• It is possible that the construction is started in 2013.
Article was written Oct of last year.
This is the quesstimated spec for the Type 055 ship, as i found on a French naval forum.
The spec is from a French engineer..........take or leave this info as you like, but some of it may be realised.......anyway it gives us time here to think of the possibilities, while we wait for more news and photos on the TYPE 052D construction:-
Possible Type 055 Spec
--------------------------
• Displacement 12 000t
• COGAG propulsion, with an improved version of Chinese turbine QC-280
• The APARs double beds, H/LJG-346A, which power the 052D today, will be used again on Type 055
• Metric radar, Type 517B will be replaced by another type of radar unknown
• Double hangar
• ⩾ speed 30 knots
• Its combat system, fleet type, can directly control any weapons other vessels under its responsibility and is oriented network-centric, which is able to send and receive information via the terrestrial, naval, sub- marine and space to other combat units.
• Hardware anti-air is composed of HHQ-9 extensively modified and hot-launch, the medium-range missiles (H/AJK-16?), HQ-10 and the same CIWS gun installed on the aircraft carrier 16 Liaoning a cannon tubes 11 x 30mm with a rate greater than 10,000 strokes / minute.
• The main gun caliber 130mm H/PJ-38
• Hardware anti-submarine missiles with anti-submarine and new WHH0004
• Supersonic anti-ship missile with a strong ECCM capability, performance "than fully YJ-83 and YJ-62" and "compatible with the universal VLS"
• All electronic equipment is highly integrated, the external appearance of the vessel is again simplified
• Capacity ECM / ECCM increased which helps protect the whole fleet
• Simplification of command levels, number of combat positions decreased
• It is possible that the construction is started in 2013.
Article was written Oct of last year.
asif iqbal
Lieutenant General
re: PLAN Type 052 Class Destroyer
Agreed the hull base would be the same considering how fast Type 052D emerged after the launch of the last Type 052C
Now for the cruiser, well we will just have to wait and see what this shapes up to be if the Type 052D is anything to go by then we are talking about a ship will be a extremely sophisticated vessel indeed
We can't predict anything much but I would say a double hanger and 96 VLS system would be a pre-request, I do not think PLAN would go above a 96 cell VLS, that is probably the max design, no doubt the mighty South Korean Sejong the Great class destroyer has a huge 128 cell VLS but I do not think that is anything PLAN would consider
Agreed the hull base would be the same considering how fast Type 052D emerged after the launch of the last Type 052C
Now for the cruiser, well we will just have to wait and see what this shapes up to be if the Type 052D is anything to go by then we are talking about a ship will be a extremely sophisticated vessel indeed
We can't predict anything much but I would say a double hanger and 96 VLS system would be a pre-request, I do not think PLAN would go above a 96 cell VLS, that is probably the max design, no doubt the mighty South Korean Sejong the Great class destroyer has a huge 128 cell VLS but I do not think that is anything PLAN would consider
re: PLAN Type 052 Class Destroyer
As of now there are 3 Type 052C in service and another 3 in varius stages of outfitting and sea trials (1 on sea trial, 2 being outfitted). There are 2 Type 052D thats being outfitted right now in a total of possibly 6 thats planned. There are now 3 Type 054A that are being outfitted or on sea trials and another 4 on order. There are about 10 Type 056 that has been launched so far and more is being build. I expect that this year the PLAN will commission 1 Type 052C destroyer, 3 Type 054A frigates and 7 Type 056 corvettes. That plus numerous types and numbers of auxiliary ships and submarines. There is no let down of China's naval modernization. Perhabs the PLAN is going a bit to fast.
As of now there are 3 Type 052C in service and another 3 in varius stages of outfitting and sea trials (1 on sea trial, 2 being outfitted). There are 2 Type 052D thats being outfitted right now in a total of possibly 6 thats planned. There are now 3 Type 054A that are being outfitted or on sea trials and another 4 on order. There are about 10 Type 056 that has been launched so far and more is being build. I expect that this year the PLAN will commission 1 Type 052C destroyer, 3 Type 054A frigates and 7 Type 056 corvettes. That plus numerous types and numbers of auxiliary ships and submarines. There is no let down of China's naval modernization. Perhabs the PLAN is going a bit to fast.
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Mysterre
Banned Idiot
re: PLAN Type 052 Class Destroyer
This new 'destroyer' at 12,000 tons sounds more like a cruiser, and I have little doubt it will sport in the neighborhood of 128 VLS cells if that is its actual displacement. Otherwise it will end up undergunned like the Type 45. And I agree with the French guy's speculation that this kind of ship would have to be quadruple GT-powered in a COGAG arrangement.
What is your basis for concluding that PLAN is going too fast? It currently faces block obsolescence of its Jianghus and Ludas, which have already been around for far too long.
This new 'destroyer' at 12,000 tons sounds more like a cruiser, and I have little doubt it will sport in the neighborhood of 128 VLS cells if that is its actual displacement. Otherwise it will end up undergunned like the Type 45. And I agree with the French guy's speculation that this kind of ship would have to be quadruple GT-powered in a COGAG arrangement.
re: PLAN Type 052 Class Destroyer
Also need to be mentioned is that the PLAN fleet is increasingly linked to China's growing space assets as well.
I'm sure that the PLAN is working on a 10 ton cruiser/destroyer with 96 universal VLS launchers comparable to the Arleigh Burke class destroyers. Its not a matter of if but a matter of when it will come. But first they have to make the Type 052D work as this ship will lay the groundwork for the new classes of warships that China is going to build in the future.
I'm well aware of the old ships still in service in the PLAN today. But China in recent years has build and integrated so many new ships into her fleet that i feel it would be wise to take a breather and let the wave of modernization be digested before flooding the fleet with newer ships. And allow old technologies to mature and new technologies to be developed.
Also need to be mentioned is that the PLAN fleet is increasingly linked to China's growing space assets as well.
I'm sure that the PLAN is working on a 10 ton cruiser/destroyer with 96 universal VLS launchers comparable to the Arleigh Burke class destroyers. Its not a matter of if but a matter of when it will come. But first they have to make the Type 052D work as this ship will lay the groundwork for the new classes of warships that China is going to build in the future.
I'm well aware of the old ships still in service in the PLAN today. But China in recent years has build and integrated so many new ships into her fleet that i feel it would be wise to take a breather and let the wave of modernization be digested before flooding the fleet with newer ships. And allow old technologies to mature and new technologies to be developed.
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re: PLAN Type 052 Class Destroyer
Why?
Becuase the PLAN has just produced several more of their now proven Type 052C design which have not even been completely outfitted or commissione yet, and particularly because they have just launched their first, much improved iteration on that design, the Type 052D which had not been outfitted or put to sea and includes new technology for the PLAN which has not even been to sea and tested in a real environment yet. I believe the PLAN is comfortable with their prospets with the Type 052D, they are building a second with 3-4 more at least in line. But I also I believe they will wait until they see how these new radars and new VLLS design work in reality...at sea...before they ever start on the larger cruiser sized project.
I expect such a design will actually have either 96 or 128 cells, like the Burke III may have and the Tocnderogas do have (as well as the Se Jong for the South Koreans, who have buikt three of them and may build three more). I expect it will carry two ASW helos, because that redundancy is impiortant if there was ever any serious at-sea conflict. I expect the VLS will be hot launched and be able to carry multiple missile types. As to whtether they will be up to the level of cooperative engagement (CE) the US now enjoys is yet to be seen. In addition, as to whether they have the multiple layers of network centric capabilities (ie. Space (sats), High atlitude maritime patrol aircraft, etc.) is also yet to be seen. Sounds like they several things the US is excelling in and holds a distinct advanatge in and threw them into the specs simply because they would like to have them. And maybe they will have them, but the US has been developing all of the infrastructure to make that possible for the last 20+ years and there are no shortcut to getting that all put together, working and in place so you truly can use that capability almost anywhere on earth.
Anyhow, my own estimate is that such a vessel, aiming at these capabilities will not be prudent or perhaps even possible for the PLAN until the late teens and maybe 2020 time frame. I expect to see them beginning construction on such a vessel then...6-7 years from now, not this year. But that is simply my own analysis for the reasons I just gave.
We shall see, for, as with all things...time will tell.
Well, my own personal feeling is that, while the PLAN, and particularly PLAN fans, want this type of vessel badly, and their may be some initial specifications out there for such a vessel in the future...and they may be very real at this stage, like the US CGX design...that something like this will not be coming out in the near furutre.
Why?
Becuase the PLAN has just produced several more of their now proven Type 052C design which have not even been completely outfitted or commissione yet, and particularly because they have just launched their first, much improved iteration on that design, the Type 052D which had not been outfitted or put to sea and includes new technology for the PLAN which has not even been to sea and tested in a real environment yet. I believe the PLAN is comfortable with their prospets with the Type 052D, they are building a second with 3-4 more at least in line. But I also I believe they will wait until they see how these new radars and new VLLS design work in reality...at sea...before they ever start on the larger cruiser sized project.
I expect such a design will actually have either 96 or 128 cells, like the Burke III may have and the Tocnderogas do have (as well as the Se Jong for the South Koreans, who have buikt three of them and may build three more). I expect it will carry two ASW helos, because that redundancy is impiortant if there was ever any serious at-sea conflict. I expect the VLS will be hot launched and be able to carry multiple missile types. As to whtether they will be up to the level of cooperative engagement (CE) the US now enjoys is yet to be seen. In addition, as to whether they have the multiple layers of network centric capabilities (ie. Space (sats), High atlitude maritime patrol aircraft, etc.) is also yet to be seen. Sounds like they several things the US is excelling in and holds a distinct advanatge in and threw them into the specs simply because they would like to have them. And maybe they will have them, but the US has been developing all of the infrastructure to make that possible for the last 20+ years and there are no shortcut to getting that all put together, working and in place so you truly can use that capability almost anywhere on earth.
Anyhow, my own estimate is that such a vessel, aiming at these capabilities will not be prudent or perhaps even possible for the PLAN until the late teens and maybe 2020 time frame. I expect to see them beginning construction on such a vessel then...6-7 years from now, not this year. But that is simply my own analysis for the reasons I just gave.
We shall see, for, as with all things...time will tell.
asif iqbal
Lieutenant General
re: PLAN Type 052 Class Destroyer
Yeah highly unlikely to see cruiser come on line this year or even in the next 3 years, my estimate is Type 052D get commissioned serves few years and post 2015 we see maybe construction of a Cruiser, which commissions few years later but really I would expect it to join the fleets end of this decade once new generation Chinese naval technology has matured, as refitting a cruiser is not something that can be done easily
Yeah highly unlikely to see cruiser come on line this year or even in the next 3 years, my estimate is Type 052D get commissioned serves few years and post 2015 we see maybe construction of a Cruiser, which commissions few years later but really I would expect it to join the fleets end of this decade once new generation Chinese naval technology has matured, as refitting a cruiser is not something that can be done easily
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