Chinese Economics Thread

[duskseeker]

American style suburban lifestyle is not necessarily the ideal that Chinese should aspire to. To each his own, I suppose. You may be a bit too harsh on the Chinese. Despite too much propaganda from the CCP and from the American establishment, China is in no way, shape or form, a major challenger to the American throne.

To topple the Americans is to topple Western civilization. The Chinese, much like the Japanese before them or the Soviets, are not up to this task. The CCP is probably more focused on improving the livelihoods of the Chinese peoples so as to avoid popular unrest. Such a social contract which requires that popular unrest can be bought off for improving livelihoods is not expected or accepted in countries where government has to fear the people. Such contracts can only work in countries where the people live in fear of the government. Such a country, like the former Soviet Union, can never topple the United States, which would mean toppling Western civilization.

This is the hard reality which you, or many members here and many people outside the confines of this forum, may find hard to accept but the sooner you do accept it, the earlier you will find comfort in knowing what the future holds on a macroscale.

This smells like copium and a person who cannot see the world where white people cannot control the world. Man, you must think people across the world are largely stupid. Do you see western civilization in danger? Nothing threatens it more than people across the world wanting their part of the world and not having to tow the line with western ideals. The sooner you do accept it, the earlier you will find comfort in knowing what the future holds on a macroscale.

 

[duskseeker]

I disagree. Why do you believe so?

Soviet Union could never outcompete the United States. Vladimir Putin admitted as much. Japan could not. Except for population, which the United States can/has easily countered thanks to its undisputed leadership of the entire Western civilization and sometimes, selectively handpicking the brightest of talents from third world territories, there is no enduring advantage China enjoys over the United States.

If we believe in false theories, like @Hendrik_2000 does, or hold on to false expectations, we will only hurt ourselves in the process.

China will continue to be laggards for decades to come. You are free to argue otherwise. I am all ears. There is no scope for perverse ideas like racism in this debate, I think.

Hey if bombing third world countries setting their educational attainment for decades then picking out a few "handpicked" individuals to learn from an "western" education system is an advantage then I want something what you're smoking. Besides the bombings, there have been plenty of instances where if not diplomatic pressure, economic pressure is applied to sell out technology to the west. Do you really think a small nation in south east Asia or the Mideast cannot innovate? They have before and will continue to do so, and what happened after that? Well, they get the same accusations of IP Theft and sanctions to buy out the tech. This was very prevalent in the 90s.

 

[badoc]

Who care about Indian. What kind of move ? I don't see any move anywhere? Please enlighten me . Huawei is stuck right now their handphone business is decimated. China still import semiconductor worth 300 billion US$ from the west. What winning are you talking except in your head? Average household asset in US increase by $300.000 that is what count. Average American still live in big house in well manicured suburb that average Chinese in overcrowded city and overprice small apartment can only dream

Have patience.
China must tread carefully.
China is facing a gang of the world's current richest and most powerful determined to undermine and contain China.

China lost Boxer Rebellion 1.0.
Lesson learned and decades of preparation initiated.

China will win BOXER CHALLENGE 2.0.
The GANG better watch out, China is no longer armed only with their fists.
.

 

[Bellum_Romanum]

Who care about Indian. What kind of move ? I don't see any move anywhere? Please enlighten me . Huawei is stuck right now their handphone business is decimated. China still import semiconductor worth 300 billion US$ from the west. What winning are you talking except in your head? Average household asset in US increase by $300.000 that is what count. Average American still live in big house in well manicured suburb that average Chinese in overcrowded city and overprice small apartment can only dream

Come to America and see it for yourself dude to see wether that 300,000 is even there in reality. You're truly a lost cause.

 

[Bellum_Romanum]

Who care about Indian. What kind of move ? I don't see any move anywhere? Please enlighten me . Huawei is stuck right now their handphone business is decimated. China still import semiconductor worth 300 billion US$ from the west. What winning are you talking except in your head? Average household asset in US increase by $300.000 that is what count. Average American still live in big house in well manicured suburb that average Chinese in overcrowded city and overprice small apartment can only dream

Who care about Indian. What kind of move ? I don't see any move anywhere? Please enlighten me . Huawei is stuck right now their handphone business is decimated. China still import semiconductor worth 300 billion US$ from the west. What winning are you talking except in your head? Average household asset in US increase by $300.000 that is what count. Average American still live in big house in well manicured suburb that average Chinese in overcrowded city and overprice small apartment can only dream

@Hendrik_2000 you need to understand that Chinese soldiers lives are not cannon fodders for the demands and wishes of people like you and I. Those Chinese soldiers serve and place their lives on the line each and every single day to protect and defend the lives of Chinese people in China not anywhere else unless commanded to do so by the party.

If you were this brave and gung-ho on fighting then why didn't you bring your brave self to China or even better serve in your own country of residence's Armed Forces to understand and realize the hardships and trepidations of what's like serving in the Armed Forces. I don't know if you have seen death up close from war or from a bullet because by your choice of nonsense you make it sound oh so easy for the Chinese government to send their sons and daughters into harms way just to please (a non-Chinese citizen) your inanity.

I get that your passionate about your love for China and Chinese people but for the love of all things good in the world, you need to reign your constant war mongering rhetoric buddy. War is hell and nothing ever comes good from war; it'll only bring death, destruction, mayhem, and above all unceasing hatred towards your fellow people. Seriously man with all due respect to your time and contributions on this forum, I find your warmongerings distasteful.

 

[Bellum_Romanum]

I disagree. Why do you believe so?

Soviet Union could never outcompete the United States. Vladimir Putin admitted as much. Japan could not. Except for population, which the United States can/has easily countered thanks to its undisputed leadership of the entire Western civilization and sometimes, selectively handpicking the brightest of talents from third world territories, there is no enduring advantage China enjoys over the United States.

If we believe in false theories, like @Hendrik_2000 does, or hold on to false expectations, we will only hurt ourselves in the process.

China will continue to be laggards for decades to come. You are free to argue otherwise. I am all ears. There is no scope for perverse ideas like racism in this debate, I think.

OMG here we go again dealing with another soothsayer that pretty much declares that China has just doesn't have any ounce of chance to displaced American awesomeness even though China has no such ambitions but nevertheless, another newbie arrogantly declaring and sounding like @sleepystudent without putting any evidence to support such fantastical declaration. It's like because you said so and therefore it shall be? Lol Anglo acting so smug with their God like pronouncements is hilarious.

And as for @Hendrik_2000 why don't you leave your comfort and practice what you preach, I bet you can't because you're rather comfortable sitting in your chair while typing furiously on how China is so cowardly and all the false bravado you pretend to excuse. Your tirade is just beyond pitiful dude. Keep crying.

 

[tygyg1111]

I am not talking about the morality of it since I know for a fact how evil or depraved the US or its allies can be. The question is why it still continues to lead despite all the mistakes it has made and despite it being a nation only 250 years old.

Middle East or South East Asia or Latin America, Africa are areas with a complete freehand enjoyed by the Americans. Except maybe the ASEAN countries sharing land border with China who may "give China some face", no other country in ASEAN can and would openly challenge the Americans. None of them are big enough, advanced enough, populous enough to do it. Same holds true for the Middle East, Latin America, Africa and Europe, I might add. Even though Europe as a continent consists of developed countries to a large extent with high human development indices, individual Euroepan countries are small and thus susceptible to American pressure, which might also be called bullying. There is no substitute for population in geopolitics. There is not a single instance of a small country, no matter how developed its human capital or institutions or economy or technological base might be, that can independently pursue policies with fear of repercussion from the Americans. None.

For China, the enduring advantage is only its population. In every other indicator, so far, it seems China not only lags but there is no possibility of China surpassing the Americans in decades to come. That being said, best wishes to the Chinese.

Not sure if you are Chinese, but if you are, it sounds like you have thoroughly been "done" by the western narrative, hook, line and sinker.

The US is at it's current (and rapidly declining position) because it rode on the inertia of 500 years of western development and technology. Before it was even it's own country, it's foundational tech level was more or less at that of Britain, the leading superpower of the time.

The Middle East, Africa, Asia, etc. did not develop key tech as early as the Europeans, and later were suppressed and crippled by the Europeans. Had any of these places had the tech to enable and the will to carry out a bloodthirsty expansion, suppression and colonisation of Europe, before Europe rose, we would see the scene you described in reverse.

I fundamentally disagree that the enduring advantage of China is population. That would make it no different to India, or Africa as a continent. However, the last 30 years saw the biggest ascension of a people and state in human history, and that was China. If I was to try to pinpoint China's most enduring advantage, it would be in the direction of China's culture and it's cultural, political, military, and economic history.

If you are Chinese, or Asian in general, I hope that one day you can learn a constructive, independent point of view of your own.

If not, and/or you are unwilling to, then the only words I have is you better learn to cope, because history is moving in a way opposite direction to the one you would like to believe.

 

[duskseeker]

I am not talking about the morality of it since I know for a fact how evil or depraved the US or its allies can be. The question is why it still continues to lead despite all the mistakes it has made and despite it being a nation only 250 years old.

Middle East or South East Asia or Latin America, Africa are areas with a complete freehand enjoyed by the Americans. Except maybe the ASEAN countries sharing land border with China who may "give China some face", no other country in ASEAN can and would openly challenge the Americans. None of them are big enough, advanced enough, populous enough to do it. Same holds true for the Middle East, Latin America, Africa and Europe, I might add. Even though Europe as a continent consists of developed countries to a large extent with high human development indices, individual Euroepan countries are small and thus susceptible to American pressure, which might also be called bullying. There is no substitute for population in geopolitics. There is not a single instance of a small country, no matter how developed its human capital or institutions or economy or technological base might be, that can independently pursue policies with fear of repercussion from the Americans. None.

For China, the enduring advantage is only its population. In every other indicator, so far, it seems China not only lags but there is no possibility of China surpassing the Americans in decades to come. That being said, best wishes to the Chinese.

Sorry dude I can only imagine you saying this while riding on a pony. The possibility of other civilizations surpassing America has just started. For instance China has been launching rockets every other week into space and it doesn't need a large population to do that. Hell they just launched a 6g test satellite last week. BTW most people who immigrate to the US and become successful are usually trust fund kids not born of talent but acquired through money. Just like my boy Elon Musk is, he didn't create Tesla, he bought them out. Now gallop off you majestic magical Prince or Princess or non binary royalty.

 

[Bellum_Romanum]

Not sure if you are Chinese, but if you are, it sounds like you have thoroughly been "done" by the western narrative, hook, line and sinker.

The US is at it's current (and rapidly declining position) because it rode on the inertia of 500 years of western development and technology. Before it was even it's own country, it's foundational tech level was more or less at that of Britain, the leading superpower of the time.

The Middle East, Africa, Asia, etc. did not develop key tech as early as the Europeans, and later were suppressed and crippled by the Europeans. Had any of these places had the tech to enable and the will to carry out a bloodthirsty expansion, suppression and colonisation of Europe, before Europe rose, we would see the scene you described in reverse.

I fundamentally disagree that the enduring advantage of China is population. That would make it no different to India, or Africa as a continent. However, the last 30 years saw the biggest ascension of a people and state in human history, and that was China. If I was to try to pinpoint China's most enduring advantage, it would be in the direction of China's culture and it's cultural, political, military, and economic history.

If you are Chinese, or Asian in general, I hope that one day you can learn a constructive, independent point of view of your own.

If not, and/or you are unwilling to, then the only words I have is you better learn to cope, because history is moving in a way opposite direction to the one you would like to believe.

More like he's @sleepystudent cleverly practicing self-restraint as not to expose himself for being the usual sleepystudent we all have come to know and loved lol...

 

[daifo]

Countries/Politicians/People motivated by Hate/Jealously/Emotions always end up screwing themselves up. China is just letting them seeth until they can no longer hold it and end up making more policy mistakes. China is trying to win without fighting. That is the true master of the art of war.