The AI upscaling on this is atrocious.
J-20 5th Gen Fighter Thread VIII
- Thread starter Blitzo
- Start date
I'm not actually sure if there is upscaling on this one or if it is just a regular smartphone camera taken at a very very long distance.
There is substantial loss of detail and blur consistent with just a low pixel count image, which conveys authenticity more than anything, to me
Vanilla J-20s are unlikely to be compatible with WS-15 at this stage, so it will depend on how long it takes them to build more WS-15 (and WS-19 if we consider it an equal to WS-15) equipped 5th + eventually 6th gen aircraft than they have vanilla J-20+WS-10 equipped J-20A/S.
But imo then that question is a bit too triumphalist.
Better to first ask how many WS-15 equipped J-20A/S they can build per year, and how smooth will introduction be, and verifying they can sustain WS-15 production at scale without issues.
Yes. In fact, I think the expectation should be to still see some/many new J-20As off the line using WS-10C2, instead of every new one equipped with WS-15.
Without ws-15, comparison with good old f-22 was very much up in the air.
Raptor had huge combat energy state advantage, defensive and offensive. And, almost certainly, huge power advantage as well(engines designed to a spec). Yes, it is almost certainly not even nearly as networked as J-20; time matters(Motorola RAZR v3 v Huawei mate p30, hah). But it's networked enough between each other for of-ca.
Old radar, new radar - as long as it generates fire solution in time, prima facie it is inconsequential.
I.e. in pure air superiority contest, f-22 is likely still the top dog. It only starts falling below j-20(a) (likely) if we add mission complications where situation complexity outweighs this raw performance.
Which likely still makes J-20A ws-10c superior air superiority unit overall, but it's hard to judge. Performance is performance.
With WS-15 all these points are likely turning moot. Though unlikely to a degree where f-22 will turn uncompetitive in a direct fight.
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even with the new engines, are you confident that the J-20A is stealthier and has superior kinematic performance? Stealth coating effectiveness is largely gatekept, but from the shape alone, one can reasonably conclude that the F-22 is likely stealthier from the front and rear (I think Wang Haifeng or Yang Wei also said in a video posted on this forum that the J-20 is less stealthy from the rear). As for kinematics, the J-20 is likely at parity for supercruise performance, but without TVC, it's likely still not supermaneuverable like the F-22 or Su-57
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I am not. Moreover, there are signs that neither J-20(A) nor Su-57(M) were even designed for same "high and fast" requirements as ATF: ultimately there's way less vertical stabilizer surface area on either. I am not an aerodynamic guy or engineer by any stretch, but my gut explanation is that these huge surfaces on F-22(YF-23, all other ATF participants, Mig 1.44) were there for a reason.
But knowing that J-20(A) can now likely operate in same generall region (i.e. have meaningful mid mach supercruise/acceleration/energy retention during high altitude maneuvering, provide designed level of power specified by electronics rather than "how much eingine guys could scrap") provides enough basis to expect electronics to give a certain edge. Larger newer radar and more bands(EOTS), higher bandwidth interlinking with more units and way more thorough processing, more complete 720deg sensor feed(EODAS) - all these amount to something?
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I'm pretty sure it's the opposite; ATF was designed for extreme maneuverability which is also partly why F-22 was chosen over the YF-23 which was closer to the high and fast requirement. Huge surfaces( and more surfaces) on F-22 was also due to high maneuverability requirements same with TVC.
Then I think the invincible stealth fighter in your mind would be some kind of stealth dogfighter?
Come on, even the F-22 has been locked on by F/A-18 or Rafale in close combat before.
Could you realize that the design criteria for the maneuverability of air superiority fighter jets should be aimed at launching medium-range air-to-air missiles rather than engaging in close-range tail-chasing dogfights?