ZTQ-15 and PRC Light Tanks

berserk

Junior Member
Registered Member
What an asinine statement. No disrespect to Russian tanks, but the T-90S is approaching 20 years out of date and you are seriously delusional if you believe that the PLA doesn't have better tanks in service. It's not all about the gun and armor that decides which tank is better, but yes the ZTZ-99A is almost certainly superior to that of T-90S also. FCS, battle management system, thermals sights, etc. are also better, simply because the T-90S is, as I said, beginning to show its age. Other non-tank equipment in PLA arsenal that will also are HJ-12 ATGMs, numerous types of UCAVs, barrages of 300/370mm rockets from PHL-03/16, salvos from AFT-10 missile carriers, etc. And that is even if your tanks can get sent to the front without running into mechanical failures. Remember when your team got disqualified from the 2017 Tank Biathlon because not one, but both of your T-90S tanks just suddenly broke down?

And yes of course the T-90S would win, at least on paper, in a head-on fight with a ZTQ-15 if you pretend that they are shooting at each other in completely flat terrain. But chances are that they will be facing ZTQ-15s in mountainous areas (the terrain that the ZTQ was designed to fight in), in which the hydro-pneumatic suspension and more advanced targeting systems would give it a significant or possibly even decisive advantage over the T-90S, especially when these areas are far from ideal for Soviet/Russian MBTs in general. You can go ask the Azeris (particularly their 4th Army Corps) how their T-90S tanks performed in a similar environment, and they were mostly facing ATGMs and RPGs, with occasional artillery strikes.

In any case, your T-90Ss are nowhere close to being as powerful as you portray them to be, or at least not anymore. And regarding that T-72 upgrade you keep stating as being equivalent to our best tanks, it just looks like one of those upgrade packages that the guys at UVZ scams you with if you are too poor to buy their T-90s or even T-72B3s. Even if you manage to complete the upgrade of 1000 T-72M1s to that standard within this decade, I doubt that they would surpass capabilities of even the ZTZ-96A, since its base armor is unchanged from the T-72M1 which was already bad for the 1990s.
more delusions lol.
indian 1000 T 72 being upgraded has already got an upgrade before.
Indian upgraded T 72M1 called Ajeya mk1 has armour inserts.
It's not same as T 72M1. Old T 72M1 base armour without ERA provide between 400-450mm protection against APFSDS.
glacis provide 100 mm less protection against APFSDS.
, so no you are wrong. With new upgrade which includes new gun, FCS, ammo, etc. it's more than capable of taking out VT 4 easy.
I have already shown despite having a welded turret.
turret geometry and ERA placement are quite poor in VT 4. In fact most Chinese tank , Which is well known.
 
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dawn_strike

New Member
Registered Member
LOL Upgraded T-72s being equal to ZTZ-99 not even talking 99A. The best T-72 upgrade is roughly comparable Type 96A! Everything is roughly equivalent but India doesn't have the best T-72 and will start upgrading lol meanwhile PLA has had Type 96A for about a decade with over 2 thousand in service. So again India will take years BEFORE it can begin to catch up to PLA's circa year 2010 level.

Edit I'm pretty sure Type 96A has superior frontal protection to the T-72 and both are equally dead when it comes to side shots. Roughly equal sensors and fire control, gun, ammo, engine output. Latest T-72 upgrade still won't feature a true hunter killer system and India's upgrade would be questionable. Puhlease Berserk. >2000 Type 96A against ongoing upgrades to T-72 pffffffffft. This is why Indian chauvinists have nothing left but to say "T-72 and T-90 is much much much better than your Type xyz because it is and I say so!" LOL and we're the hypocrites and fanboys :D
The best T72 upgrade should be T72B3M, the one we saw in Ukarine Wars and the Tank Biathlon. This one is indeed superior to 96A.
Personally I would say T90MS is one of the best 3rd/3.5 Gen. MBT, with generally no severe deficiency. But T90S is a different story though...
 

dawn_strike

New Member
Registered Member
more delusions lol.
indian 1000 T 72 being upgraded has already got an upgrade before.
Indian upgraded T 72M1 called Ajeya mk1 has armour inserts.
It's not same as T 72M1. Old T 72M1 base armour without ERA provide between 400-450mm protection against APFSDS.
glacis provide 100 mm less protection against APFSDS.
, so no you are wrong. With new upgrade which includes new gun, FCS, ammo, etc. it's more than capable of taking out VT 4 easy.
I have already shown despite having a welded turret.
turret geometry and ERA placement are quite poor in VT 4. In fact most Chinese tank , Which is well known.
You may say this when IAF actually starts using 3BM59/60;)
 

ougoah

Brigadier
Registered Member
1000 Indian T-72 have been upgraded from useless to slightly less useless... still not comparable to T-72B3M. Even that one is roughly equal to Type 96A of which China already has over 2000 of and for over a decade. So again the facts are India is about attempt to match where PLA's tank force was 10 years ago with upgrades that are not even B3M levels :p... and even then it'll be less than half of PLA's Type 96A force now. Delusions? No this are facts and reality. Delusions is calling all Chinese tanks to have "well know" poor ERA placement like a moron and Jai Hind fanboy.

Indian T-90S is basically similar level and slightly superior to T-72B3M. Relatively small numbers in service too compared to ZTZ-99 and Type 99A. Should we talk gunships and drones next? India's army tank force would be lucky to overwhelm Pakistan's on its absolute best of days. Quit talking like India's some hot shit.

Even if VT-4 has "well known" poor ERA placement, it still absolutely flogs India's Russian imports and we will never see India find itself in a position to learn this.
 

ougoah

Brigadier
Registered Member
Didn't Pakistan Army test T-90MS pretty recently during their acquisition tenders? T-84 Oplot came last overall and VT-4 beat the T-90MS in more areas. The T-90MS is miles ahead of the T-90S.
 

berserk

Junior Member
Registered Member
The amount of delusion among Chinese and there fanboys is amusing to say the least. india has already ordered 1000 elbit TIFCS.

T-72CIA with TIFCS Upgrade.jpg
T-72CIA's TIFCS vectronics (1).jpg

ELBIT Systems TISAS to TIFCS Upgrade for T-72CIA.jpg
Frontal ERA placement on Indian T 72 is again superior to even T 72B3 and B3M in Russian service.

Whole turret is covered.
IA T-72M1 with ERA Mk.2 tiles.jpg
DRDO-developed ERA Mk.2 panels for T-72.jpg

both T 72 and T 90 engine have been indigenised.
Indigenous V46-6 for T 72
EbvlPo4WkAIcHJb.jpeg

New APU is coming for the tank.

army has already issued an RFI for a new ammo with greater DOP from 600mm to 800mm. this will require new gun with higher chamber pressure and new autoloader. but everything is propaganda for Chinese and there fanboys.
 

berserk

Junior Member
Registered Member
Didn't Pakistan Army test T-90MS pretty recently during their acquisition tenders? T-84 Oplot came last overall and VT-4 beat the T-90MS in more areas. The T-90MS is miles ahead of the T-90S.
Pakistan was looking for T 90 till last moment ha ha!. VT 4 is superior to oplot M only in your dream.
VT 4 deal has nothing to do with actual tank capability on ground, in real combat oplot will eat it alive.
 

ZeEa5KPul

Colonel
Registered Member
The real question is why India hasn't deployed the mighty Arjunk. Is it to give China a sporting chance?

I've noticed something in the endlessly disgusting Indian psyche that perhaps our friend @berserk can explain: the exaggerated pride in others' accomplishments, especially white others. There has to be more to it than Indian arms "industry" being wholly incapable of manufacturing so much as a slingshot properly. When China was incapable of manufacturing military turbofans, I never saw Chinese people boasting of how good Russian engines were - China just did the hard work and replaced the imported engines when it was ready.
more delusions lol.
Word to the wise, "delusion" isn't an accusation you should ever make.
 
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