Z-10 thread

[TerraN_EmpirE]

Anyone with an idea what's this?? In some forums it is suggested to be the new Z-XX combat helicopter??!!

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As far as I know "Iron Eagle", he is a well known CG-artist, who usually creates quite realistic artworks.

View attachment 45579

Reminds me of the Karem ATR36 concept

The technology is current, so it could well be China's interpretation of a high-speed helicopter gunship. But damn, the wingspan.

It looks like a Tiltrotor so the wings would be needed, The Nacelles interest me as it seems like an Osprey /AW609 style nacelle rather then the V280 style. Gunship Tiltrotors is are not a new idea just never put into reality.

Hi can it be like an osprey kind of helicopter
Thank you

It certainly seems that the artist thinks so.
but the PLA has never had a tiltrotor bigger then a medium sized drone. Models and concepts but it took the Osprey a decade to iron out the kinks, and the US has been working on titlrotors since the 1950's.
To date only the US Boeing and Bell and Leonardo out of Italia have working tiltrotors near any state of production that are large enough to carry people.
Leonardo gaining theirs from the AW609 joint venture with Bell. that's not to say others haven't tried.
The Russians had the Mil Mi30 back in the 70's but had a lot of problems that kept delaying it into the 1980's and early 1990's when the Russian economy went bust. The Germans were looking into it as far back as 1944 but it was the last days of the war and German industry was broken under allied bombing then another in the 50's but that never went past prototype.

All of which makes me think that since they already have a working Chopper now this is the way to keep going.

exactly right..... T-129 is not really Turkish .... the engine is American/British and the design is from Italy ... so good luck with that PAA

The Design rights were bought out by Turkey for the Chopper, and The Turks have reportedly been looking more and more to build there own. The T129 helicopter as is today uses 2 LHTEC T800 engines a joint from Rolls Royce and Honeywell, They also have looked to that engine for there TAI T625 utility chopper which is supposed to first fly this September. Back in June TAI reportedly opened a new arm Tusas Engine Industries TEI who was set out to build a new helicopter engine first as a joint with GE, but then there seems to have been some fighting as GE wanted to control it and Turkey reportedly is working on new engines on there own. suposedly the T625 would eventually use a Turkish engine called the TS1400, The T625 was designed to have a high degree of commonality with the T129 meaning that if the TS1400 materializes then it should also be suitable for the T129, but that's long game.
Short game Z10 might seem the better option except that Pakistan's environment and the engines of the Z10 are not friendly playmates. Hot and High conditions are noted in both Afganistan and Pakistan as well as India and highlands of China. It's also present in Turkey. Such conditions place tight restrictions of performance as the Power plant is robbed of power by hot thin air. its the Reason why the PLA relies on Sikorsky S70C2 and Mi17 choppers in the highlands.

 

[Franklin]

The WZ-10 turboshaft engine has been testing on the Z-20 for more than four years now. Could it be that the latest batches of Z-10's have already been installed with them. We have seen a change in the sensor package of the Z-10 in recent years. That was the original sensor package that was considered too heavy for the WZ-9 engines.

 

[by78]

This Z-10 pilot appears to be wearing a new type of Helmet-mounted Display. Or is this a HMD at all? The size of the clear visor and its distance from pilot's face suggests that it serves as a projector surface.

Zoom in a bit...

The old HMD:

 

[Insignius]

Nice.
Really gives me hope that the J-20 also gets mated with a HMD of this style soon.

 

[Sunbud]

Same HMD, different view. The HMDs featured in the movie Sky Hunters, do we have any knowledge of their existence (below).


Sky Hunters helmets. Featured in J11 for the light coloured ones and J10 for the darker image.

 

[duncanidaho]

How reliable is this source?

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Google translated:

The WZ-16 engine will be put into operation next year, which will increase the performance of the Wuzhi Z-10 helicopter. The WZ-16 engine will be produced next year. On May 11th, the reporter obtained the above news from China National Aero-engine Group Supplier Conference on Civil Turboprops 2018 in Zhuzhou, Hunan Province. According to the China Aviation Development Corporation staff, the turboshaft-16 engine will receive a production certificate (PC) next year and will be officially put into production. The WZ-16 is a mid-thrust turboshaft engine jointly developed by China Aviation and French Safran Helicopter Engine Company. Both parties share intellectual property rights. The vortex-axle-16 engine has advanced technology, adopts modular design, dual-channel digital electronic control, high reliability, light weight, low fuel consumption, and is the fourth-generation technology engine. The power is 1200 to 1500 kW, which exceeds the Canadian PT6C-67C turboshaft engine. According to the plan, the turboshaft-16 will be first equipped with the AC352 helicopter produced by China Aviation Helicopter Co., Ltd. It is widely believed that there is a very high probability that the WZ-16 will be equipped with Wu Zhi Z-10 in the future. When developing the Wu Zhi Z-10 in China, two PT6C-67C turboshaft engines were selected. Due to various reasons, they failed to do so. At present, Wu Zhi Z-10 uses a domestic turboshaft WZ-9 engine, which has a power of only about 1,000 kilowatts, and its performance is insufficient. After the successful development of the WZ-16, if it can be integrated into the Wu Zhi Z-10 project again, the performance of the Wu Zhi Z-10 can be increased.

 

[Hendrik_2000]

We haven't heard about WZ 16 Turboshaft engine for a while now. But according to this article it will receive production certification next year and will be put into production
Via Xinhui
涡轴-16发动机明年投产 ，令武直-10的性能成倍跃升！
红网时刻株洲5月11日讯(记者 聂千川)备受军迷关注的涡轴-16(代号：WZ-16)发动机将于明年生产下线。5月11日，记者从中国航空发动机集团(以下简称中国航发)在湖南株洲召开民用涡轴涡桨发动机2018年度供应商(国际)大会获得上述消息。

据中国航发工作人员透露，涡轴-16发动机将于明年取得生产合格证(PC)，并正式投产。涡轴-16是中国航发与法国赛峰直升机发动机公司合研的中等推力涡轴发动机，双方共享知识产权。涡轴-16型发动机技术先进，采模块化设计，双通道全数字式电子控制，高可靠性，重量轻，油耗低，是第四代技术水准的发动机。功率达到1200至1500千瓦，超过加拿大生产的PT6C-67C涡轴发动机。

根据计划，涡轴-16将首先装备中航直升机股份有限公司生产的AC352直升机上。坊间普遍认为，涡轴-16未来装备武直-10的可能性非常大。

我国在研制武直-10时，选用的是两台PT6C-67C涡轴发动机，由于多种原因，未能如愿。目前，武直-10使用的是国产涡轴-9型发动机，其功率仅为1000千瓦左右，性能存在不足。涡轴-16研制成功后，如果能再次整合到武直-10项目中，能令武直-10的性能成倍跃升，或能从中型武装直升机一跃成为与阿帕奇比肩的重型武装直升机。

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Google tr
The vortex-shaft-16 engine will be put into operation next year, which will double the performance of the Wuzhi-10. Rednet Times Zhuzhou May 11th (Reporter Nie Qianchuan)

The vortex-shaft-16 (codename: WZ-16) engine that has attracted much attention from military enthusiasts will be produced next year. On May 11th, the reporter obtained the above news from China National Aero-engine Group (hereinafter referred to as China Aviation)'s 2018 Supplier (International) Conference on Civil Turboprops in Zhuzhou, Hunan Province.

According to the China Aviation Development Corporation staff, the turboshaft-16 engine will receive a production certificate (PC) next year and will be officially put into production. The vortex-16 is a mid-thrust turboshaft engine jointly developed by China Aviation and French Safran Helicopter Engine Company. Both parties share intellectual property rights. The vortex-axle-16 engine has advanced technology, adopts modular design, dual-channel digital electronic control, high reliability, light weight, low fuel consumption, and is the fourth-generation technology engine.

The power is 1200 to 1500 kW, which exceeds the Canadian PT6C-67C turboshaft engine. According to the plan, the turboshaft-16 will be first equipped with the AC352 helicopter produced by China Aviation Helicopter Co., Ltd. It is widely believed that there is a very high probability that the vortex-16 will be equipped with WuZhong-10 in the future. When developing the WuZhong-10 in China, two PT6C-67C turboshaft engines were selected. Due to various reasons, they failed to do so.

At present, Wu Zhi-10 uses a domestic turboshaft-9 engine, which has a power of only about 1,000 kilowatts, and its performance is insufficient. After the successful development of the vortex- 16 , if it can be integrated into the Wuzhi-10 project again, the performance of the WuZhong-10 can be doubled, or it can become a heavy-armed helicopter commensurate with Apache from a medium-sized armed helicopter.

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[Totoro]

Perhaps wz-10 will need a variant of it, possibly even to be called something other than wz-16, and manufacturer will claim it has nothing to do with wz-16 but that it's an independent development. That way it wouldn't be dual use civilian tech and various legal obstacles could be avoided. In any regard, it will probably be several more years before Z-10 are seen with a new engine.

 

[Hendrik_2000]

Perhaps wz-10 will need a variant of it, possibly even to be called something other than wz-16, and manufacturer will claim it has nothing to do with wz-16 but that it's an independent development. That way it wouldn't be dual use civilian tech and various legal obstacles could be avoided. In any regard, it will probably be several more years before Z-10 are seen with a new engine.

I don't know what are you trying to say There is civilian version of WZ16 it is called Ardiden 3C and manufacture by Safran. The Chinese counter part is WZ16 which is separate development with IP owned by the Chinese company So if foreign buyer want to buy civilian helicopter they can choose Ardiden engine
This engine will first powered AC352(Z15) whose production is held back by the availability of domestic engine. It first flew in Dec 2016 and has been testing since
PLAN has urgent requirement for Mid powered Heli in the class of 9 ton for the fregate and corvette ship
Z20 is just too big and won't fit the smaller vessel even for type 52 notice the extension of type 52D recently

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China’s AC352 completes first flight with WZ16 engine
20 December 2016, Harbin
The first flight of the Avicopter AC352, powered with WZ16 engine, took place today in Harbin. The AC352 is a new seven-ton, twin-engine, multi-purpose rotorcraft jointly developed by Avicopter and Airbus Helicopters. The WZ16 met all the performance targets set for this maiden flight. Known in the west as the Ardiden 3C, the engine has been jointly developed by Safran Helicopter Engines, CAPI and Dongan, parts of the new Aero Engine Corporation of China (AECC) consortium, in a partnership for both development and production.

Avicopter
The WZ16 is a new-generation turboshaft in the 1,500 to 2,000 shp power class. It features a remarkably compact modular architecture, a best in class power to weight ratio with a low cost-of-ownership. Compared to the competition, it offers a 10 % lower fuel consumption.

"Such milestone achieved is the result of closer cooperation between both sides. Building on this, in the future, we will continue our cooperation toward the goal of engine certification at an early date" said Mr Qin Yuchun, President of AECC Dongan."

Commented Safran Helicopter Engines EVP Programs, Cyrille Poetsch, "this flight both secures the AC352 development schedule and marks a major milestone in our partnership with China's aerospace industry. Through this program Safran demonstrates its ability to successfully conduct new-generation engine design as part of an international partnership. This is also a significant step for Avicopter. Since its establishment in 1956, it has grown to become a major rotorcraft manufacturer. We are proud to be aboard their new-generation AC352 and wish them a happy 60th anniversary".

WZ16 will be the first helicopter engine to be certified in parallel, both in China by CAAC (Civil Aviation Administration of China) and in Europe under Ardiden 3C designation, by EASA (European Aviation Safety Agency) under the Ardiden 3C designation. The EASA certification for the Ardiden 3C is expected by end of 2017, and the CAAC certification for the WZ16 in 2018.

With over 500 engines in operation, China represents a strategic market for Safran Helicopter Engines. One of every two Chinese-registered helicopters is equipped with a Safran engine or a licensed product. This level of business is the result of 40 years of cooperation with industry in China.

 

[Totoro]

Ardiden 3c and wz16 are more or less the same engine. And they are both meant for civilian market. AC352 is a civilian helicopter which will be sold commercially in China (and some other countries) and will fly with wz16 engines. Customers from Europe/US and some other countries can not buy AC352 (maybe second hand they can?), as they have to go through Airbus Helicopters and buy their variant, EC175 with ardiden engine.

What i meant to say is that we're likely to see a separate military use variant of WZ16. Different in, if nothing else, then at least in name.