World News Thread & Breaking News!!

Status
Not open for further replies.

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
The plane struck the sea barrier just in front of the run way. Also part of the tail seemed to have broke off. Maybe the two deceased were in the tail section?
I read a thread about this last night on an aviation forum. Actual 777 pilots talking in there. It came down hard in a high nose up AOA and did hit right after the sea barrier rif-raf. The tail did break off. They believed that the two dead were stewardesses sitting at that bulkhead where it separated.

The pilots there talked about a known issue with some Korean crews. Apparently the co-pilots are almost completely incapable of taking the controls from the pilot even in the most severe of circumstances. They cited several examples and believe this could have been similar. Cultural issues not being addressed appropriately in the training and certification.

Apparently there were known issues with the runway too, that they were landing on and either this was not covered adequately by the pilots in their pre-flight, or the tower did not communicate effectively as they were coming in...maybe both. But the issue was known and published and should have been part of the landing plan. Either way, those folks believed the crew recognized the issue late and tried a late fly around, but had lost too much speed and energy and thus hit the ground at a steep AOA which broke off the tail.

It is fortunate that the entire aircraft did not disintegrate killing all or most of the passengers and crew.
 

plawolf

Lieutenant General
Asiana, the airline owning the plane has confirmed that the two dead were a pair of teenage Chinese girls who were seated at the back of the plane.
 

Air Force Brat

Brigadier
Super Moderator
I read a thread about this last night on an aviation forum. Actual 777 pilots talking in there. It came down hard in a high nose up AOA and did hit right after the sea barrier rif-raf. The tail did break off. They believed that the two dead were stewardesses sitting at that bulkhead where it separated.

The pilots there talked about a known issue with some Korean crews. Apparently the co-pilots are almost completely incapable of taking the controls from the pilot even in the most severe of circumstances. They cited several examples and believe this could have been similar. Cultural issues not being addressed appropriately in the training and certification.

Apparently there were known issues with the runway too, that they were landing on and either this was not covered adequately by the pilots in their pre-flight, or the tower did not communicate effectively as they were coming in...maybe both. But the issue was known and published and should have been part of the landing plan. Either way, those folks believed the crew recognized the issue late and tried a late fly around, but had lost too much speed and energy and thus hit the ground at a steep AOA which broke off the tail.

It is fortunate that the entire aircraft did not disintegrate killing all or most of the passengers and crew.

Actually this is more of an airmanship issue, it is now customary that shortly after lift-off to punch the little green button and let "George" fly the airplane until approach or short final. The ELS was out, that is no biggie on a CAVU day, this whole incident occurred because the PIC failed to maintain flying speed/altitude and flared the aircraft short of the runway. This points to a system failure in the training regiman the pilots don't get enough stick-time to really have command of the aircraft in these low and slow situations, a lack of awareness of deteriorating airspeed, and the slow spool up of the turbine engine in general, all contributed to a failure of the pilot in command to "fly the airplane".

Joe can't say, "hey lets take her up and do some slow flight and approach to landing stalls", the corporate chain of command relegates all flight training to the simulator, no one goes up and "plays" with the airplane and that is absolutely essential to maintaining the kind of airmanship necessary to "put the airplane where you want it". The F/O taking the airplane is simply NOT DONE in any culture, ya don't want to tick-off the OLD MAN, and he will be P--- O--, Royally in fact, so you might hint, but with cockpit voice recorders, black boxes, their is simply too much data collection, IE SPYING, on the flight crew, they are locked into "failure mode", if you call it wrong, or even if you call it right and tick off the wrong people, you are history. Only the absolute minimum time is spent in the airplane during training, and if I'm not mistaken, most "Check Rides" are now conducted in the simulator......bad JU-JU, all the way around, pilots need to be in command of their aircraft, and half the recording garbage needs to be ash-canned, that KRAP causes people paralysis when its time to say, "F/O has the aircraft, Sir!". or Maam??? don't even get me started on that............brat
 

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!



1297438863926_ORIGINAL.jpg


quebec-train.jpg


National Post said:
LAC-MEGANTIC, Que. — About 40 people are considered missing after the spectacular blaze and explosions that razed much of Lac-Megantic, increasing the likelihood that the number of fatalities could soar from the current official death toll of five.

“I can tell you that we have met a lot of people….and what I can tell you is that about 40 people are considered missing,” Quebec provincial police Lt. Michel Brunet told a news conference.

“We have to be careful with that number because it could go up or down.”

It is the first time police have gone public with an estimate since the derailment of a train carrying crude oil triggered Saturday morning’s fatal events.
 

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!



r


Reuters said:
(Reuters) - Asiana Airlines Inc said the pilot in charge of landing the Boeing 777 that crash-landed at San Francisco's airport on Saturday was training for the long-range plane and that it was his first flight to the airport with the jet.

"It was Lee Kang-kook's maiden flight to the airport with the jet... He was in training. Even a veteran gets training (for a new jet)," a spokeswoman for Asiana Airlines said on Monday.

The plane was travelling "significantly below" its intended speed and its crew tried to abort the landing just seconds before it hit the seawall in front of the runway, the U.S. National Transportation Safety Board said on Sunday.

This pilot had over 9,000 flying hours, a lot of it with 747s, but was new to the 777. The instructor pilot in the co-pilot's seat had 12,000 hours flying, and over 3,000 hours with 777s.
 

Equation

Lieutenant General
Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!



r




This pilot had over 9,000 flying hours, a lot of it with 747s, but was new to the 777. The instructor pilot in the co-pilot's seat had 12,000 hours flying, and over 3,000 hours with 777s.


That's weird I would've assume the pilot would not have a difficulty flying the Boeing 777 since the 747 is a lot bigger plane.:confused:
 

no_name

Colonel
The 777 can also do auto land right? Read it on another forum that the sink rate of the plane during the landing was about 1500ft/min.

So they tried (or tried to abort) to land it like it's gonna land on an AC. The gears collapsed like it was designed to, I think they could have avoided the two fatalities if they did not pull the plane up and hit the tail on the ground - it's probably too late to make any differences.
 

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
That's weird I would've assume the pilot would not have a difficulty flying the Boeing 777 since the 747 is a lot bigger plane.:confused:
Some folks talking on an aviation forum indicated that the runway they were coning in on was having some work done on it. Apparently the notice had been posted in the appropriate places so pilots, during their pre-flight into SFO could have accounted for it.

For whatver reason, they were coming in on that runway and by the time they realized it and tried to abort, it was too late...and for whatever reason, they were already too low as well.

I am sure the investigation discover find all of the details and report on them.

Sad thing...and especially for the two who were killed and their families and friends. But they were also unbelievably blessed that a whole lot more were not killed. Everyone on board could have easily been lost.
 

T-U-P

The Punisher
Staff member
Super Moderator
Registered Member
Is it considered normal for pilots to do visual landings in good weather with these large commercial jets? I've always thought that pilots usually use the ILS for landing unless theres horrible weather.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top