Why Chinese Mothers are Superior...

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solarz

Brigadier
At any rate, in my opinion she is also doing the chinese community a huge disfavor albeit unintentionally. Lord knows people already like to negatively stereotype Asians in general this one with all the national attention just add fuel to the fire for the bigots and racists all over.

Bigots and racists will be around no matter what. There's no reason not to express an opinion because of those kinds of people.

On the contrary, I think this piece helps by giving the typical North American parent a bit of insight into how Asian kids are raised. If some people decide to emphasize on the negative aspect of this in order to reinforce their own prejudices, then that's their problem.
 

Blitzo

Lieutenant General
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Heh, this is one of the greatest ironies of Chinese parenting: the kids are regulated from kindergarten to high school, yet upon high school graduation, many of them go off alone to attend universities hundreds of miles away from home, where they proceed to act like the typical Western teenager.

So no, suicide due to scholastic pressure isn't that much of an issue. ;)

Rofl I wonder is that a good thing? :p
 

kwaigonegin

Colonel
Bigots and racists will be around no matter what. There's no reason not to express an opinion because of those kinds of people.

On the contrary, I think this piece helps by giving the typical North American parent a bit of insight into how Asian kids are raised. If some people decide to emphasize on the negative aspect of this in order to reinforce their own prejudices, then that's their problem.

What you said basically just reinforced what I said.. this Amy person is doing a huge disservice because now every non-Asian is going to think Asians in general are like her kids which is far from the truth.
The way the article was was written and presented already has a negative spin to it. That may or may not be true BUT no doubt people will look at this piece in a negative light.
In other words asian parents = over protective, over bearing sadistic torturers and asian children = unhappy over achieving robotic social retards but good in playing the piano or the flute..
 

solarz

Brigadier
What you said basically just reinforced what I said.. this Amy person is doing a huge disservice because now every non-Asian is going to think Asians in general are like her kids which is far from the truth.
The way the article was was written and presented already has a negative spin to it. That may or may not be true BUT no doubt people will look at this piece in a negative light.
In other words asian parents = over protective, over bearing sadistic torturers and asian children = unhappy over achieving robotic social retards but good in playing the piano or the flute..

As opposed to before? People who hold stereotypes will hold them regardless.
 

AssassinsMace

Lieutenant General
The woman is an egotistical monster. Why do I want to her about how she raised her kids? And let the anti-Chinese Wall Street Journal embellish the headline of why Chinese mothers are superior. I wouldn't put it past this woman motivated by self-hatred to throw this bomb just so she can make money. That being said her critics are in no position to judge. We've already had a Chinese girl in Nashville kidnapped by authorities who judged they had the right to take her away from her Chinese citizen parents saying they were unfit based on stereotypes of Chinese and not how the parents were raising her. Years later a higher court returned her to the biological parents but apparently the damage was already done where she would identify herself as Mexican because her foster parents vilified Chinese culture to her. Is that superior parenting skills enough to kidnap a child from her foreign citizen parents? Or maybe that's different because she's Chinese. And how do Western kids turn out? Like kids don't commit suicide in the West? What's your excuse? Maybe that's different because they commit suicide for good reasons.
 
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advill

Junior Member
The word "Superior" is ambiguous. It is more correct to say that most Chinese mothers who acknowledged or experienced the hardships of life know the value of education, and have instilled in their children its importance in order to get ahead. The recent media reported that these students have done very well in Maths & Science. Its not only the Chinese, but the other Confucianist Societies (S.Korea, Japan, Taiwan, Overseas Chinese etc.) accept this fact. However, as observed, the problem can be "rote" learning, and there is a growing realisation that creative thinking is definitely important.
 

KYli

Brigadier
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Amy Chua Is a Wimp
By DAVID BROOKS
Published: January 17, 2011


Sometime early last week, a large slice of educated America decided that Amy Chua is a menace to society. Chua, as you probably know, is the Yale professor who has written a bracing critique of what she considers the weak, cuddling American parenting style.
Josh Haner/The New York Times


Chua didn’t let her own girls go out on play dates or sleepovers. She didn’t let them watch TV or play video games or take part in garbage activities like crafts. Once, one of her daughters came in second to a Korean kid in a math competition, so Chua made the girl do 2,000 math problems a night until she regained her supremacy. Once, her daughters gave her birthday cards of insufficient quality. Chua rejected them and demanded new cards. Once, she threatened to burn all of one of her daughter’s stuffed animals unless she played a piece of music perfectly.

As a result, Chua’s daughters get straight As and have won a series of musical competitions.

In her book, “Battle Hymn of the Tiger Mother,” Chua delivers a broadside against American parenting even as she mocks herself for her own extreme “Chinese” style. She says American parents lack authority and produce entitled children who aren’t forced to live up to their abilities.

The furious denunciations began flooding my in-box a week ago. Chua plays into America’s fear of national decline. Here’s a Chinese parent working really hard (and, by the way, there are a billion more of her) and her kids are going to crush ours. Furthermore (and this Chua doesn’t appreciate), she is not really rebelling against American-style parenting; she is the logical extension of the prevailing elite practices. She does everything over-pressuring upper-middle-class parents are doing. She’s just hard core.

Her critics echoed the familiar themes. Her kids can’t possibly be happy or truly creative. They’ll grow up skilled and compliant but without the audacity to be great. She’s destroying their love for music. There’s a reason Asian-American women between the ages of 15 and 24 have such high suicide rates.

I have the opposite problem with Chua. I believe she’s coddling her children. She’s protecting them from the most intellectually demanding activities because she doesn’t understand what’s cognitively difficult and what isn’t.

Practicing a piece of music for four hours requires focused attention, but it is nowhere near as cognitively demanding as a sleepover with 14-year-old girls. Managing status rivalries, negotiating group dynamics, understanding social norms, navigating the distinction between self and group — these and other social tests impose cognitive demands that blow away any intense tutoring session or a class at Yale.

Yet mastering these arduous skills is at the very essence of achievement. Most people work in groups. We do this because groups are much more efficient at solving problems than individuals (swimmers are often motivated to have their best times as part of relay teams, not in individual events). Moreover, the performance of a group does not correlate well with the average I.Q. of the group or even with the I.Q.’s of the smartest members.

Researchers at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology and Carnegie Mellon have found that groups have a high collective intelligence when members of a group are good at reading each others’ emotions — when they take turns speaking, when the inputs from each member are managed fluidly, when they detect each others’ inclinations and strengths.

Participating in a well-functioning group is really hard. It requires the ability to trust people outside your kinship circle, read intonations and moods, understand how the psychological pieces each person brings to the room can and cannot fit together.

This skill set is not taught formally, but it is imparted through arduous experiences. These are exactly the kinds of difficult experiences Chua shelters her children from by making them rush home to hit the homework table.

Chua would do better to see the classroom as a cognitive break from the truly arduous tests of childhood. Where do they learn how to manage people? Where do they learn to construct and manipulate metaphors? Where do they learn to perceive details of a scene the way a hunter reads a landscape? Where do they learn how to detect their own shortcomings? Where do they learn how to put themselves in others’ minds and anticipate others’ reactions?

These and a million other skills are imparted by the informal maturity process and are not developed if formal learning monopolizes a child’s time.

So I’m not against the way Chua pushes her daughters. And I loved her book as a courageous and thought-provoking read. It’s also more supple than her critics let on. I just wish she wasn’t so soft and indulgent. I wish she recognized that in some important ways the school cafeteria is more intellectually demanding than the library. And I hope her daughters grow up to write their own books, and maybe learn the skills to better anticipate how theirs will be received.
 

advill

Junior Member
Pushing a Child & Rigid Learning have their limitations. Better to develop "the Love for Learning" in children by letting them explore and be creative. Autocratic parents could probably have bright kids but not necessarily innovative, well behaved or caring ones.
 

solarz

Brigadier
Practicing a piece of music for four hours requires focused attention, but it is nowhere near as cognitively demanding as a sleepover with 14-year-old girls. Managing status rivalries, negotiating group dynamics, understanding social norms, navigating the distinction between self and group — these and other social tests impose cognitive demands that blow away any intense tutoring session or a class at Yale.

That's just bull. It takes a lot more work to become an accomplished musician (or accomplished *anything*) than to learn to socialize.

The author of this article is being quite liberal with facts when he tries to suggest that "growing up" is more difficult than perfecting a skill. For one thing, the two are not mutually exclusive, as any olympic athlete can tell you.

No one seems to be claiming that Tara Lipinski or Shawn Johnson are socially inept, when I can pretty much guarantee that those two have an even more grueling training regimen than the Chua girls.
 

AssassinsMace

Lieutenant General
Pushing a Child & Rigid Learning have their limitations. Better to develop "the Love for Learning" in children by letting them explore and be creative. Autocratic parents could probably have bright kids but not necessarily innovative, well behaved or caring ones.

Who's method creates innovative well behaved or caring ones? Like I mentioned before it's pretty hypocritical to point of suicide among children when there's suicides by children in the countries that criticize her techniques. Again is it different because those kids have a good reason to commit suicide? So who has it right? Is this like how the US supports good dictators while China supports bad dictators. Let's examine failure by who has children that go on shooting sprees killing their classmates. Shall we point out more cultural differences?
 
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