US F/A-XX and F-X 6th Gen Aircraft News Thread

[SlothmanAllen]

USAF NGAD is at $2.7 Billion in the FY25 budget proposal. Ramp up to a downselect should be soon based on funding patterns.

Speculation and Rumors here! I've been told Boeing did a more radical design and Lockheed did an evolutionary one. Since I don't trust Boeing with bolting something in place properly, I'd lean to Lockheed, but that would create a monopoly in the industrial base. I'd almost guess we'd see a split decision with 2/3 going to Lockheed for NGAD and they would call the Boeing Boondoggle something else like a Penetrating Counter Air or some such.

The USN decision for FA-XX complicates the industrial base decisions.

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I'd love to have seen what Northrop could have done with NGAD, but I believe they are still in the FA-XX competition?

Production is going to be tough if they are building F-35, NGAD, FA-XX, B-21, RQ-180 (?) or RQ-180 successor, V-280, CCA, OBSS and whatever else is cooking (F-15 and F-16 production still might be trucking along lol). late 2020's/early 2030's are going to be one of the biggest periods of Air Force / Navy air asset modernization since the Cold War.

 

[anzha]

I'd love to have seen what Northrop could have done with NGAD, but I believe they are still in the FA-XX competition?

They are. I'll be intrigued. I would minimally expect a split decision between USN and USAF awards.

Production is going to be tough if they are building F-35, NGAD, FA-XX, B-21, RQ-180 (?) or RQ-180 successor, V-280, CCA, OBSS and whatever else is cooking (F-15 and F-16 production still might be trucking along lol). late 2020's/early 2030's are going to be one of the biggest periods of Air Force / Navy air asset modernization since the Cold War.

This is what happens when you kick cans down the road. Kick too many and things are going to piled into a stinking heap.

Industry policy is going to be really important. It's been neglected for far, far too long in the US MIC. Ok, well, the entire US economy.

 

[anzha]

Welp, looks like the USAF is delaying its bird. We've all heard it. Scuttlebutt is that Boeing was probably going to be selected. I'm speculating Boeing's issues are part of the reason for the delay. That said, another POV has popped up. A next generation light fighter.

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The more things change, the more they stay the same. smh.

 

[Michaelsinodef]

Welp, looks like the USAF is delaying its bird. We've all heard it. Scuttlebutt is that Boeing was probably going to be selected. I'm speculating Boeing's issues are part of the reason for the delay. That said, another POV has popped up. A next generation light fighter.

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The more things change, the more they stay the same. smh.

If they go with the light fighter.

Bet it's more gonna be like a '5.5' or just at best, a better F35 lol.

Oh, and also lots of problems lol.

 

[anzha]

If they go with the light fighter.

I have a feeling they were on the cusp of awarding the contract and then backed away due to Boeing. Boeing was sure acting like they had the contract in hand:

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Bet it's more gonna be like a '5.5' or just at best, a better F35 lol.

10 years ago there was talk of the F-35D. This would have been more like the B internally, but rather than a lift fan, it would drive a giant generator for a pewpew (laser) and use the ADVENT-style engine to keep a similar range to the F-35A.

So, entirely possible as they sort of wth they want to do with the NGAD or whatever.

Oh, and also lots of problems lol.

Something has gone awry with project management and contracting in the US defense industries, that's for sure.

 

[anzha]

So, some interesting bits. Kendall is walking back the idea NGAD was ready (or had) down selected:

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also, the idea may be to make the light fighter cheaper than the F-35:

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I guess ceding the west pac is on the USAF's mind. smh.

 

[TK3600]

Let me guess: F-35 equivalent but slimmed down bomb bay, focus on air to air agility, combined cycle engine. Early variant dont have engine ready, but airframe accomodate it retroactively.

Basically 5th gen, but has a small gimmick like the engine. It will be sold as 6th gen.

 

[SlothmanAllen]

I don't see how you can make a light fighter cheaper than the F-35 while also delivering sixth generations capability. At best, I think you could build a new dual engine air frame with "sixth generation features" (whatever that means) that utilizes already in production radar, engines, avionics, etc. Basically no new equipment outside of the airframe unless it is absolutely necessary.

 

[Heresy]

I don't see how you can make a light fighter cheaper than the F-35 while also delivering sixth generations capability. At best, I think you could build a new dual engine air frame with "sixth generation features" (whatever that means) that utilizes already in production radar, engines, avionics, etc. Basically no new equipment outside of the airframe unless it is absolutely necessary.

Sounds like MVP. Agile is fine for software, but actually using it to design a fighter is just...crazy.

 

[Atomicfrog]

I don't see how you can make a light fighter cheaper than the F-35 while also delivering sixth generations capability. At best, I think you could build a new dual engine air frame with "sixth generation features" (whatever that means) that utilizes already in production radar, engines, avionics, etc. Basically no new equipment outside of the airframe unless it is absolutely necessary.

A light fighter offering something better than F-16 in range, stealth and keeping the air to air agility could be interesting for Europe, but it was supposed to be the F-35a thing... IT will end at about the same price anyway. The price of the F-16 Block 60 is around $60 million, F-35 average flyaway cost of the Air Force's F-35A variant is $82.5 million in 2024. (supposedly...)

With all the development cost, only way to make this happen is that they declare the F-35a is a piece of crap.

And foremost, a long range fighter is way more important, F-35 is short legged, F-22 is becoming an undead and F-15x cannot replace a stealth fighter.