Ukrainian War Developments

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Abominable

Major
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What is that white blur on the front of the tank approaching on the road? Is that a Z?

Also i would not call this horrific in any way. Those guys didnt suffer. Now what is horrific are the torture of POW's in videos i've seen about 95% exclusively created at the hands of the AFU and it's friends. Horrific is what humans are willing to do to other living humans, prolonging their incredible suffering for as long as possible. That's horrific. This video? That's just what war is about. People getting turned into roast beef and slices of salami.
Wow.

There was a spotter on that tank and some of those Ukrainians were clearly wearing armbands. If it isn't a Russian tank that's some poor IFF.
 

Jingle Bells

Junior Member
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I am not sure all those countries are in same boat. EU decline may give incentives to Europhiles Russians to take jobs back in Russia there are several millions of them. Samsung used to store alot of appliances and electronics in big warehouse in Russia to dispatch rest of Europe. the point is more countries will trust Russia for storing products and wealth seeing they not randomly seize physical products on outside direction. it is Europe hysteria that is damaging it.
Well, I know you don't agree with me on this. Most of my Russian friends (except for the ultra liberal ones, who will believe the Slavic-version of the "one world, one planet" anyways, so not much point convincing them), do not believe in "Europe hysteria" (this name is self-explanatory).

But reality is some thing else. EU is Russia's largest trading partner, accounting for nearly 40% of Russia import and export. In fact you could say that Russia's current economic structure is shaped by the EU, through years of being Russia's largest trading partner.

listing Samsung out is a bad anecdotal example. South Korea the entire country, account for only some 4% of all Russian exports and less than 4% of all Russian imports.

Like I said. You need to look at numbers and data, in a wholistic view.

Russia do yearly exercises. Russia used to send tremendous cargo flights when Syrian war was at peak. at that time avoiding Turkish airspace. so long distance from multiple bases flying through several countries.
Russia delivered S-400 through 72 cargo air flights to Turkey. this give you idea how intensely they use airpower.
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I was talking about infrastructure investments and buildup.

by not following globalization Russia is only nation that can make alot of aviation products 100% domestically. they were the first to fully vaccinate soldiers / Rostec that ensure training and deployments of equipment for this campaign. this Belarus was in additional axis that was never trailed on this scale. they also developed AESA radar satellite by same company that produce tactical missiles so the skill set in an organization are very diverse. Countries who are weak in fundamental science make dysfunctional policies to attract best and brightest and make the residem in an expensive city with high salary before there brain can function on innovation.
That's nothing to boast about. This is because Russia pretty much inherited Soviet aviation industry. And the Soviet Aviation industry was one of the largest and most advanced in the world, AND was entirely domestic. Russia should have at least been able to keep domestic independence, out of all things.

However, if you look at the market share of Russian aviation industry products in the whole world as well as Russia's domestic market, you will see how much has the Russians dwindled and declined.

No doubt Russian inherited an ocean of USSR know-hows, industrial capacity and talents, so Russian aviation industry is supposed to be good. But they are no where near as good as they should have been.

In fact, if Russian aviation industry is able to expand (as a result of huge boost in demand and/or market share) into other countries, which results in other countries providing Russian patented components to Russia, that would be somewhat a success. We are not seeing that. What's worse is that, we are seeing examples of Russian's foreign supply chain compromised and having to contract inward to domestic supply chains, in the case of Ukraine.

Russian monotowns (monogorod, моногород) was the example of what I was talking about in my last reply, concerning the Soviet model/landscape of their unique planned economy. This model attracts suits them pretty well. And if Russia could step up their build up of the underlining infrastructure of connectivity (5G), than Russia would be in a very good place in this upcoming trend of de-globalization, decentralization of our megastructure of civilization. However, like I said, they need a lot of investments. If Russians did not need to start this war, they could leverage European money to do these infrastructure building, which is why I said previously that if I were in Ukraine's shoes, I would certainly choose to side with Russia (once Ukraine consolidated their strategic alliance with Russia, they can safely play the middleman to further strengthen EU--Russo-block relations). In this case, this Russo-block would have all the advantages, which will be recognized by EU, China and rest of the world as having a huge investment potential. Of course, this will be to the horror of the Anglo-American Maritime Empire.

As for investment into fundamental science, I will tell you that it's actually the opposite. fundamental science today is reliant more and more upon calculation power and experimental assets: both of which requires money.

USSR's biggest strength has always been painted by the West as their biggest weakness: the ability to plan economy and do deep level social-engineering. You should NOT look down upon the USSR. I dare to say that it was a pinnacle of human civilization. The West wishes in their wet dreams to be able to do things that the USSR has actually succeeded in doing very well. This is why they paint economic planning and social engineering as Taboo. (This is a laughably Nietzschean phenomenon: they lust after these so much that they made them taboos.)

these are battle proven systems from desert heat to extreme cold of arctic. i doubt any one will replicate it and that technological gap will increase once modernization and training implemented on fundamentally sound platforms.
I don't mean to say battle proven in the physical sense, because that's already done decades ago. I am saying whether this is "future proof", in other words, whether this iteration is battle proven in the advanced information era of interconnectivity and AI.
 
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Jingle Bells

Junior Member
Registered Member
"Terrifying" is actually bad news here. This means that VKS is only scaring them, but no really wiping them out.
It's much better if they don't even survive to have experienced the fear.

It's much better if I heard news of, for example, some like this:
Ukrainian soldiers from Kiev and Lviv arriving at the Donbass front reenforcing the position, saying to jornalists: we haven't experienced or seen much fighting yet, can't wait to see some fighting. Oh, by the way, we are the 6th wave of reinforcements to these positions, these positions are mainly manned by us now.
 

Jingle Bells

Junior Member
Registered Member
"Ukraine’s ombudswoman for human rights said she had recorded horrific acts of sexual violence by Russian troops in Bucha
and elsewhere, including a case in which women and girls were kept in a basement for 25 days, the New York Times reported.
Nine of those victims are now pregnant, according to the ombudswoman, Lyudmyla Denisova."

I would submit that the unwanted pregnancies may be prima facie evidence of rape.

Given the zeal with which many men here strive to deny any evidence of Russian war crimes, however, I expect some
men would like to believe that these Ukrainian women and girls, pretending to show their gratitude to their 'liberators',
seduced helpless innocent Russian soldiers and enjoyed sexual intercourse with them many times every day for 25 days.
Then the impregnated Ukrainian women and girls suddenly 'cried rape' in appealing for Western aid.

I have heard similar rationalizations of Soviet soldiers' mass rapes when they 'liberated' eastern and central Europe.
Okey, you know what, this is some I can't just ignore.

Violence and aggression against civilians is NOT tolerable regardless of which side inflicted it. All victims in this conflict do NOT deserve to be victimized, that include all civilians in Ukraine (including Donbass region), as well as POWs. This is clear.

People might ignore you because of your crazy emotional attitude, but what you are pointing out shouldn't be ignored, even if the evidence might be shaky. This is because it is not an accusation (accusations are meaningless now), but rather a warning to both sides that they should watch out and make sure civilians not be harmed, as much as possible.

I don't care if you see me as a chauvinist pig, I will stand with you on this one, closely next to you. You will just have to bear with me for standing so close to you.
 

RottenPanzer

Junior Member
Registered Member
Likely, its too blurry to make out. The Ukraine side is trying to play this as a friendly fire, but if the tank has a Z mark on it, then it means they use captured enemy tanks. The friendly fire narrative seems to have more credence, because there's aftermath photos take and uploaded by the Ukrainian side on the ground.
Don't think it's a friendly fire
In the video it was shown that one of the tank crew was coming out of the tank and trying to identify if they were friend or enemy
 
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