Ukraine Military News, Reports, Data, etc.

sheogorath

Major
Registered Member
According to the Italian newspapers ho are now reporting the news of the heavier weapons list for Ukraine from Italian government, as SPGs, AFVs, SPAAG. IMO, machines and possibilities about: M109 yes. SIDAM25 yes. M113/VCC1 yes. IVECO LMV maybe. PzH2000 no. B1 Centauro no (for type of ammunition).

Who is going to maintain that stuff, provided it lasts long enough to make it in and out of battle?
 

anzha

Captain
Registered Member
Who is going to maintain that stuff, provided it lasts long enough to make it in and out of battle?

Czechia and Slovakia have volunteered to host the maintenance depots. So long as the equipment can be recovered and sent back, I'm not sure they'll have a problem.

Adding to the artillery being sent, the UK is sending 20 AS-90s and the Italians are sending at least some of their Panzerhaubitze 2ks. The number of artillery pieces and SPA being sent is getting to be VERY large. I think there's somewhere between 10 to 15 artillery battalions worth being sent/have been sent.

The Germans seem to be willing to send 100 tank transporters. Scholz may fret any second now though. Watch the logistics aspect: logistics trucks, etc. I think logistics will be far more important than anything. Whomever gets there with the fastest with the mostest wins, to use poor Americanism.

Raputitsa seems to be continuing at least for two more weeks based on the weather forecast. If the Ukrainians can move enough equipment east, shore up their flanks and then...a whole lot more becomes possible. Ukrainians really ought to be saying 'slava raputitsa!'

The inability of Russia to interdict from the West to Ukraine supplies has been more than shocking to me. But then, a lot of Russia's performance has been shocking to me. I should stop being shocked at some point. I hope.

At any rate, Russia's bluff, as far as willing to start a war with NATO over what NATO does in Ukraine, has been called. The West will provide the maintenance needed.
 

gelgoog

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
Good luck getting those logistics to work. They will have to carry fuel and shells too. No 155mm NATO shell stocks in Ukraine.
It is nice of NATO to be demilitarizing themselves I guess.
 

anzha

Captain
Registered Member
Good luck getting those logistics to work. They will have to carry fuel and shells too. No 155mm NATO shell stocks in Ukraine.
It is nice of NATO to be demilitarizing themselves I guess.

The Czech 155mm Zuzannas are already in use by the Ukrainian army. That means there are 155mm shells making it to the front.

The US has pledged 144,000 155mm shells. Others have pledged a fair amount, too.

We will to see how well the logistics work. I have a hunch, so long as the Russians are unable to disrupt the tail, the shells and equipment are going to make to the front just fine.
 

supersnoop

Major
Registered Member
Czechia and Slovakia have volunteered to host the maintenance depots. So long as the equipment can be recovered and sent back, I'm not sure they'll have a problem.

Adding to the artillery being sent, the UK is sending 20 AS-90s and the Italians are sending at least some of their Panzerhaubitze 2ks. The number of artillery pieces and SPA being sent is getting to be VERY large. I think there's somewhere between 10 to 15 artillery battalions worth being sent/have been sent.

The Germans seem to be willing to send 100 tank transporters. Scholz may fret any second now though. Watch the logistics aspect: logistics trucks, etc. I think logistics will be far more important than anything. Whomever gets there with the fastest with the mostest wins, to use poor Americanism.

Raputitsa seems to be continuing at least for two more weeks based on the weather forecast. If the Ukrainians can move enough equipment east, shore up their flanks and then...a whole lot more becomes possible. Ukrainians really ought to be saying 'slava raputitsa!'

The inability of Russia to interdict from the West to Ukraine supplies has been more than shocking to me. But then, a lot of Russia's performance has been shocking to me. I should stop being shocked at some point. I hope.

At any rate, Russia's bluff, as far as willing to start a war with NATO over what NATO does in Ukraine, has been called. The West will provide the maintenance needed.

This is not so simple as “hosting some maintenance depots” in Slovakia, we are talking about half a dozen different kinds of transmissions, wheels, tires, shock absorbers, even more pedestrian stuff like hydraulic fluid. Then there is other stuff like dozens of machine gun bolts, qualified technicians, etc.

NATO has nice computer systems with NSN numbers for all kinds of equipment down to Velcro flags, so there are probably “special advisors” to help with that, but the difficulty is most NATO log clerks are probably most familiar with their own national items.

Honestly the sheer number of items continuing to be sent is IMO more indicative of equipment being destroyed/abandoned.
 

anzha

Captain
Registered Member
This is not so simple as “hosting some maintenance depots” in Slovakia, we are talking about half a dozen different kinds of transmissions, wheels, tires, shock absorbers, even more pedestrian stuff like hydraulic fluid. Then there is other stuff like dozens of machine gun bolts, qualified technicians, etc.

Yup. Totally agree. If only NATO was moving troops into the area.
Honestly the sheer number of items continuing to be sent is IMO more indicative of equipment being destroyed/abandoned.

That's true, I am sure. The equipment also is meant to address areas where the Russians probably have superiority.

In doctrine, Russia has always claimed they would use massed artillery. We are starting to see that. However, if the Ukrainians can counter that advantage, assuming the advantage still exists, then Russia is going to have a harder time pulling off the restated goal of taking all of the Donbas and the southern coast to Transnistria.

Additionally, I also suspect NATO and Ukraine are getting ready the step after the next Russian onslaught. Watch for logistics trucks, etc. The tank transporters are an indication. Watch for fuel trucks and other noncombat vehicle donations.
 

supersnoop

Major
Registered Member
Yup. Totally agree. If only NATO was moving troops into the area.


That's true, I am sure. The equipment also is meant to address areas where the Russians probably have superiority.

In doctrine, Russia has always claimed they would use massed artillery. We are starting to see that. However, if the Ukrainians can counter that advantage, assuming the advantage still exists, then Russia is going to have a harder time pulling off the restated goal of taking all of the Donbas and the southern coast to Transnistria.

Additionally, I also suspect NATO and Ukraine are getting ready the step after the next Russian onslaught. Watch for logistics trucks, etc. The tank transporters are an indication. Watch for fuel trucks and other noncombat vehicle donations.

After seeing your response, I feel like NATO is executing the escalation of the resistance the same way the US did in Afghanistan against the USSR.

The old Soviet stuff is not enough for the Ukrainians, the same way the PRC weapons were not enough for the Mujahideen to mount counter offensives. So now the weapons quality is being elevated in the same way.

I think it is a clear sign there will be no intervention, the sheer cost of this war to the West is not low. The west is hoping for Ukrainian full victory, but I think at this point they are planning on a divided country which strategically is somewhat of a victory for western interests.
 

Abominable

Major
Registered Member
That's true, I am sure. The equipment also is meant to address areas where the Russians probably have superiority.
If that was true Ukraine wouldn't be receiving thousands of every type of man portable anti tank platform developed in the west.

What's being provided to Ukraine seems to be determined more by what NATO are prepared to send rather than what Ukraine actually needs.
 

anzha

Captain
Registered Member
After seeing your response, I feel like NATO is executing the escalation of the resistance the same way the US did in Afghanistan against the USSR.

Not far off. A bit of an overused metaphor, but NATO is boiling the frog.
I think it is a clear sign there will be no intervention, the sheer cost of this war to the West is not low. The west is hoping for Ukrainian full victory, but I think at this point they are planning on a divided country which strategically is somewhat of a victory for western interests.

I...don't want to project too much into what is planned for Ukraine based on what we are seeing. The future is extremely open atm as for what is likely.

That said, this war is not cheap for the West, in absolute or relative terms. It is FAR more expensive in relative terms for the Russians.

If that was true Ukraine wouldn't be receiving thousands of every type of man portable anti tank platform developed in the west.

What's being provided to Ukraine seems to be determined more by what NATO are prepared to send rather than what Ukraine actually needs.

Let's not forget the supplies are not coming in a vacuum. At first, everyone was unsure how Russia would respond. Everyone was unsure if Ukraine would be able to hold on at all. There was no information as far as how effective logistics interdiction by the Russians would be.

Why send expensive equipment unless you know it can be moved to where it was needed without being blown up? Or if it provokes Russia into a war? OR if the Ukrainians are going to fold before the weapons can be deployed?

Javelins and NLAWs are far, far cheaper than AS-90s, Caesars and M-777s and if the Russians blew them up, well, lesson learned relatively cheaply.

Also, as others have pointed out, repairing equipment. How do you repair nonsoviet equipment in Ukraine? If not in Ukraine? Then where?

Those questions have been answered. The equipment being shipped has changed as a result.
 
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