There's a move towards "lights out" semi-conductor manufacturing if they really can't get the bodies, and that's a lot of bodies TSMC employs about 50,000, they should just invest more and skip a generation, people are the major source of pollutants in a fab anyway. But it's nice to see they're not crazy or gung ho but are cutting their teeth on the mass market with the "simpler" (it's all relative!) stuff!
Trade War with China
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There's a move towards "lights out" semi-conductor manufacturing if they really can't get the bodies, and that's a lot of bodies TSMC employs about 50,000, they should just invest more and skip a generation, people are the major source of pollutants in a fab anyway. But it's nice to see they're not crazy or gung ho but are cutting their teeth on the mass market with the "simpler" (it's all relative!) stuff!
Jura The idiot
General
for me it's going to be interesting to see if and how 'rhetorics' changes, I mean stuff I used to repost like Apr 6, 2018
Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
Not really they can buy it from Mediatek which is comparable to Qualcomm's SOC. In short run ZTE will struggle but in the long run Qualcomm will loose large customer. Notice many more company are now in interested in Media tek chip. The difference between this chip is not that much.Via Tanahh
Chip designer Mediatek gets Taiwan nod to export goods to ZTE
Jess Macy Yu and Jeanny Kao
TAIPEI (Reuters) - Taiwanese chip designer Mediatek Inc has received an export permit from the government to sell components to ZTE Corp, a Chinese telecoms equipment maker subjected to restrictions in the United States.
The U.S. government last month banned American firms from selling to ZTE for seven years, saying the company had failed to comply with a settlement related to ZTE shipping U.S.-made goods to Iran in violation of U.S. sanctions.
Following the U.S. ban, Taiwan had instructed local firms wanting to ship goods to ZTE to apply for permission.
Mediatek confirmed to Reuters on Monday that it had received the export permit last week to ship products to ZTE.
An official with Taiwan's Bureau of Foreign Trade said the government had approved a permit for Mediatek, and that it had received applications from "several" other tech firms.
"We fully understand high-tech factories' characteristic of fast-paced shipments of goods, we won't create obstacles for the pace of their exports," the foreign trade official told Reuters, on condition of anonymity.
"Taiwan's government has its own control mechanisms, which is independent of the way the U.S. looks at it in a given situation," the official said. "The mechanism will consider America and other advanced countries' controls."
He said the permit that Taiwan had issued, or was looking to issue, would give domestic companies permission to proceed with exports to firms on the government's watch list.
He did not give names of the other companies that had applied for permission, but said chipmaker Nanya Technology Corp was not one of them.
Shipments to ZTE by Nanya Tech will be hurt in the short term given the government's procedure, local media has reported.
A Nanya Tech spokesperson was not immediately available for comment on Monday.
(Editing by Himani Sarkar)
Last edited:
Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
Via emperror. It was never good to depend on foreign sources. The Chinese company like ZTE is too lazy and complacent now they pay a big price . A rude awakeningis sometime needed to jolt them from their dependencies. TSMC eventhough theyhave fab in China they are vulnerable to threat from US because they derive most of their income from US.Plus they won't built the latest technology.But for china it is win win because they get to learn how to run FAB and develope cadre in semiconductor technology
Chip Sector’s Big Risk Isn't a Trade Spat
A paradigm shift in China could unseat existing manufacturers.
May 7, 2018, 10:33 AM GMT+8
A tit for tat between Beijing and Washington wouldn't be good for the Chipmaker to the Stars, its founder and outgoing chairman told the Financial Times.
"China does a lot of assembling of the final product, so the U.S.-China trade dispute may impact us also,” Morris Chang said.
I suspect Chang may have been dumbing down his analysis, because I'm sure he knows full well that the bigger risk to Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing Co. isn't some short-term disruption to end-product manufacturing.
Where the real risk lies is in having his clients lose orders to Chinese substitutes. Right now, there are few alternatives to the chips that Qualcomm Inc., Broadcom Corp. and Nvidia Corp. design, and TSMC is their primary supplier. But when new options do become available, there's a greater chance TSMC won't be contracted to make them.
Heavily Weighted
TSMC got most of its revenue from American clients in 2017
President Xi Jinping has committed China to technology independence, which includes learning how to manufacture the world's most advanced semiconductors at its own factories.
The Wall Street Journal reported last week that government-backed China Integrated Circuit Industry Investment Fund Co. is set to unveil a 300 billion yuan ($47 billion) war chest, the latest big check to be written for the country’s chip sector.
In addition to the risk that Chinese chip designs will get better comes the possibility they’ll start forcing U.S. clients to outsource to Chinese foundries. There are currently more than 20 fabs being developed in China due to various government incentives, TSMC warned in its 2017 annual report.
To counter this, TSMC is plowing ahead with a new fab in China after maintaining for years one wasn't necessary. The Hsinchu, Taiwan-based firm has proven over the past three decades that being close to neither client nor assembly line is crucial to its business model. Were that the case, it would have fabs in both California and Shenzhen.
Investment Boost
TSMC has doubled its China assets over the past two years
Source: TSMC annual reports
Note: TSMC China (est: 2003) operates an older 8-inch fab in Shanghai. TSMC Nanjing (est: 2016) runs a newer 12-inch factory.
But the paradigm is shifting, and TSMC is learning to adjust.
"It is a new challenge," Chang said of the trade spat. "And it is something that I have not had to face in the past."
This from a man who experienced a Japan-U.S. trade war in his previous role at Texas Instruments Inc., and watched China lob missiles over his head in a bid to cow Taiwan's fledgling democracy just as TSMC was hitting its stride.
TSMC managed to break free of rivals United Microelectronics Corp. and IBM Corp. by the early 2000s, and more recently, has managed to best Samsung Electronics Co. But a band of hungry Chinese contenders fueled by bucket loads of cash is the real challenge, and something Chang didn’t have to face in the past.
This column does not necessarily reflect the opinion of the editorial board or Bloomberg LP and its owners.
Chip Sector’s Big Risk Isn't a Trade Spat
A paradigm shift in China could unseat existing manufacturers.
May 7, 2018, 10:33 AM GMT+8
A tit for tat between Beijing and Washington wouldn't be good for the Chipmaker to the Stars, its founder and outgoing chairman told the Financial Times.
"China does a lot of assembling of the final product, so the U.S.-China trade dispute may impact us also,” Morris Chang said.
I suspect Chang may have been dumbing down his analysis, because I'm sure he knows full well that the bigger risk to Taiwan Semiconductor Manufacturing Co. isn't some short-term disruption to end-product manufacturing.
Where the real risk lies is in having his clients lose orders to Chinese substitutes. Right now, there are few alternatives to the chips that Qualcomm Inc., Broadcom Corp. and Nvidia Corp. design, and TSMC is their primary supplier. But when new options do become available, there's a greater chance TSMC won't be contracted to make them.
Heavily Weighted
TSMC got most of its revenue from American clients in 2017
President Xi Jinping has committed China to technology independence, which includes learning how to manufacture the world's most advanced semiconductors at its own factories.
The Wall Street Journal reported last week that government-backed China Integrated Circuit Industry Investment Fund Co. is set to unveil a 300 billion yuan ($47 billion) war chest, the latest big check to be written for the country’s chip sector.
In addition to the risk that Chinese chip designs will get better comes the possibility they’ll start forcing U.S. clients to outsource to Chinese foundries. There are currently more than 20 fabs being developed in China due to various government incentives, TSMC warned in its 2017 annual report.
To counter this, TSMC is plowing ahead with a new fab in China after maintaining for years one wasn't necessary. The Hsinchu, Taiwan-based firm has proven over the past three decades that being close to neither client nor assembly line is crucial to its business model. Were that the case, it would have fabs in both California and Shenzhen.
Investment Boost
TSMC has doubled its China assets over the past two years
Source: TSMC annual reports
Note: TSMC China (est: 2003) operates an older 8-inch fab in Shanghai. TSMC Nanjing (est: 2016) runs a newer 12-inch factory.
But the paradigm is shifting, and TSMC is learning to adjust.
"It is a new challenge," Chang said of the trade spat. "And it is something that I have not had to face in the past."
This from a man who experienced a Japan-U.S. trade war in his previous role at Texas Instruments Inc., and watched China lob missiles over his head in a bid to cow Taiwan's fledgling democracy just as TSMC was hitting its stride.
TSMC managed to break free of rivals United Microelectronics Corp. and IBM Corp. by the early 2000s, and more recently, has managed to best Samsung Electronics Co. But a band of hungry Chinese contenders fueled by bucket loads of cash is the real challenge, and something Chang didn’t have to face in the past.
This column does not necessarily reflect the opinion of the editorial board or Bloomberg LP and its owners.
Last edited:
Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
I like the conclusion of this gathering
When asked whether the United States and allies around the globe would ever form a united front in challenging China’s economic policies, Chas Freeman told Asia Times simply, “it’s too late.”
“America is here to stay as a great power,” Freeman said in his opening keynote speech, adding, “China is back as one.” If leaders in Washington want to ensure he is right about the former, those gathered in Silicon Valley said, they have accept the latter. They also have to focus on investing in their own country’s future, not sabotaging China’s.
In Silicon Valley, a gathering urges Washington to rethink view of China
Prominent scholars and Chinese-American figures at Committee of 100 conference say misperceptions are driving hostility towards China
By MAY 7, 2018 12:42 PM (UTC+8)
From left, Asia Times columnist George Koo, economist Yukon Huang, China scholar Susan Shirk and former US ambassador Chas Freeman. Photo: Committee of 100
At a time when reports of a “looming tech war” dominate news of US-China relations, Silicon Valley is ground zero. The Committee of 100, an organization that has worked for more than a quarter century to further US-China ties, invited experts and business leaders to America’s tech capital to tackle the tough questions facing the bilateral relationship, and the attendees had a clear message for Washington.
The Trump administration, along with a growing number of lawmakers in Washington, have a misguided view of China and its economic relations with the United States, speakers at the event agreed. Some, including Chas Freeman, a senior fellow at Brown University’s Watson Institute, suggested that Washington’s efforts are more of a desperate attempt to bring China’s rise to a halt. That is especially true with regard to recent sanctions placed on Chinese technology firms.
Must-reads from across Asia - directly to your inbox
“This is what the multi-year ban on transactions with ZTE is about,” according to Freeman, whose experience with China stretches back as far as when he was the chief interpreter on former President Richard Nixon’s historic visit to China.
There was, however, a palpable confidence among the attendees, both American and Chinese, that China’s rise was unstoppable. Any effort by the US to disrupt trading relationships across the globe would hurt America more.
“China is by far the largest market for industrial components,” Freeman noted. “We may be in the process of writing off that market, without much, if any, discussion of the long-term implications of doing so for our own economic prosperity.”
Despite the almost daily deluge of headlines in the United States sounding the alarm that China will “take the lead” in the field of artificial intelligence, Li Fei-Fei, a leader in the field, cautioned against erecting walls in fields of scientific research.
Li, who is currently leading the AI and machine learning research and development efforts at Google Cloud, implored that policy-makers and industry leaders frame the question of innovation in a different light.
“I want to ask anyone in the audience: Do you remember which company in the early 20th century owned modern physics? Which country owned modern physics?” Li asked. “100 years later, modern physics made our life better as a whole species… It’s not a company or a country.”
Head of AI/ML R&D at Google Cloud, Li Fei-Fei, speaks with Yahoo Co-founder Jerry Yang. Photo: Committee of 100
Echoing that emphasis on global cooperation, China scholar David Lampton, also speaking at the conference, touched on China’s push to connect economies through infrastructure investment.
Lampton, who is currently Director of Chinese studies at the Johns Hopkins School of Advanced International Studies, pushed back on criticism of China’s Belt and Road Initiative, which aims to boost connectivity from Asia to Europe, touching Russia and the Middle East along the way.
The initiative is not just some master plan in Beijing he said, drawing from his research for an upcoming book on the initiative, rather it is also driven by entrepreneurship seen in provinces throughout China. “BRI is not a plan. It is a vision,” according to Lampton, who recieved a lifetime achievement award for his work on China at the event.
Huiyao Wang, founder of Beijing-based think tank Center for China & Globalization, stressed that BRI is not a China project, rather, you can think of China as the “angel investor,” borrowing Silicon Valley venture capital vernacular.
Criticisms of the initiative stem from the inherent geopolitical implications of economic change, not a nefarious self-interest in Beijing, Lampton said. North-South connectivity in Asia, for instance, will push activity towards China. If even a fraction of a proposed Kunming-Singapore high-speed railway is completed, he said, “It will transform Southeast Asia.” If fully completed, it would be longer than the first transcontinental railway in the United States.
Growing hostility towards China seen among the American public, and reflected in policies and rhetoric coming out of Washington, is driven in part by misperceptions of the two countries’ economic relations, said economist Yukon Huang, former country director for China at the World Bank.
“Tensions and insecurities are overblown,” Huang said. “That’s part of the reason we see US-China trade and investment tensions as a major risk in the world.”
While discussions at the conference often veered toward criticism of the Trump administration, Susan Shirk, chair of University of California San Diego’s 21st Century China Center, said that apprehension surrounding China’s rise is a much more broad-based phenomenon. “What we see is a really strong backlash against China,” Shirk said. In a recent meeting with regulators from Japan, Canada, Germany, France, South Korea, she saw a common thread.
“What really struck me, and horrified me, is that in all these countries there are moves afoot to tighten up restrictions on Chinese investment in high-tech sectors… This is not just about Donald Trump and his ignorant and nationalist views about economic relations… it’s not just about Congress. It’s not just about America. It’s about a reaction, a backlash, against China’s practices in every advanced industrial country.”
When asked whether the United States and allies around the globe would ever form a united front in challenging China’s economic policies, Chas Freeman told Asia Times simply, “it’s too late.”
“That is to say that sufficient damage is going to be done to our relationships with Europeans and others that we will not be able to form a common front,” he said.
“America is here to stay as a great power,” Freeman said in his opening keynote speech, adding, “China is back as one.” If leaders in Washington want to ensure he is right about the former, those gathered in Silicon Valley said, they have accept the latter. They also have to focus on investing in their own country’s future, not sabotaging China’s.
When asked whether the United States and allies around the globe would ever form a united front in challenging China’s economic policies, Chas Freeman told Asia Times simply, “it’s too late.”
“America is here to stay as a great power,” Freeman said in his opening keynote speech, adding, “China is back as one.” If leaders in Washington want to ensure he is right about the former, those gathered in Silicon Valley said, they have accept the latter. They also have to focus on investing in their own country’s future, not sabotaging China’s.
In Silicon Valley, a gathering urges Washington to rethink view of China
Prominent scholars and Chinese-American figures at Committee of 100 conference say misperceptions are driving hostility towards China
By MAY 7, 2018 12:42 PM (UTC+8)
From left, Asia Times columnist George Koo, economist Yukon Huang, China scholar Susan Shirk and former US ambassador Chas Freeman. Photo: Committee of 100
At a time when reports of a “looming tech war” dominate news of US-China relations, Silicon Valley is ground zero. The Committee of 100, an organization that has worked for more than a quarter century to further US-China ties, invited experts and business leaders to America’s tech capital to tackle the tough questions facing the bilateral relationship, and the attendees had a clear message for Washington.
The Trump administration, along with a growing number of lawmakers in Washington, have a misguided view of China and its economic relations with the United States, speakers at the event agreed. Some, including Chas Freeman, a senior fellow at Brown University’s Watson Institute, suggested that Washington’s efforts are more of a desperate attempt to bring China’s rise to a halt. That is especially true with regard to recent sanctions placed on Chinese technology firms.
Must-reads from across Asia - directly to your inbox
“This is what the multi-year ban on transactions with ZTE is about,” according to Freeman, whose experience with China stretches back as far as when he was the chief interpreter on former President Richard Nixon’s historic visit to China.
There was, however, a palpable confidence among the attendees, both American and Chinese, that China’s rise was unstoppable. Any effort by the US to disrupt trading relationships across the globe would hurt America more.
“China is by far the largest market for industrial components,” Freeman noted. “We may be in the process of writing off that market, without much, if any, discussion of the long-term implications of doing so for our own economic prosperity.”
Despite the almost daily deluge of headlines in the United States sounding the alarm that China will “take the lead” in the field of artificial intelligence, Li Fei-Fei, a leader in the field, cautioned against erecting walls in fields of scientific research.
Li, who is currently leading the AI and machine learning research and development efforts at Google Cloud, implored that policy-makers and industry leaders frame the question of innovation in a different light.
“I want to ask anyone in the audience: Do you remember which company in the early 20th century owned modern physics? Which country owned modern physics?” Li asked. “100 years later, modern physics made our life better as a whole species… It’s not a company or a country.”
Head of AI/ML R&D at Google Cloud, Li Fei-Fei, speaks with Yahoo Co-founder Jerry Yang. Photo: Committee of 100
Echoing that emphasis on global cooperation, China scholar David Lampton, also speaking at the conference, touched on China’s push to connect economies through infrastructure investment.
Lampton, who is currently Director of Chinese studies at the Johns Hopkins School of Advanced International Studies, pushed back on criticism of China’s Belt and Road Initiative, which aims to boost connectivity from Asia to Europe, touching Russia and the Middle East along the way.
The initiative is not just some master plan in Beijing he said, drawing from his research for an upcoming book on the initiative, rather it is also driven by entrepreneurship seen in provinces throughout China. “BRI is not a plan. It is a vision,” according to Lampton, who recieved a lifetime achievement award for his work on China at the event.
Huiyao Wang, founder of Beijing-based think tank Center for China & Globalization, stressed that BRI is not a China project, rather, you can think of China as the “angel investor,” borrowing Silicon Valley venture capital vernacular.
Criticisms of the initiative stem from the inherent geopolitical implications of economic change, not a nefarious self-interest in Beijing, Lampton said. North-South connectivity in Asia, for instance, will push activity towards China. If even a fraction of a proposed Kunming-Singapore high-speed railway is completed, he said, “It will transform Southeast Asia.” If fully completed, it would be longer than the first transcontinental railway in the United States.
Growing hostility towards China seen among the American public, and reflected in policies and rhetoric coming out of Washington, is driven in part by misperceptions of the two countries’ economic relations, said economist Yukon Huang, former country director for China at the World Bank.
“Tensions and insecurities are overblown,” Huang said. “That’s part of the reason we see US-China trade and investment tensions as a major risk in the world.”
While discussions at the conference often veered toward criticism of the Trump administration, Susan Shirk, chair of University of California San Diego’s 21st Century China Center, said that apprehension surrounding China’s rise is a much more broad-based phenomenon. “What we see is a really strong backlash against China,” Shirk said. In a recent meeting with regulators from Japan, Canada, Germany, France, South Korea, she saw a common thread.
“What really struck me, and horrified me, is that in all these countries there are moves afoot to tighten up restrictions on Chinese investment in high-tech sectors… This is not just about Donald Trump and his ignorant and nationalist views about economic relations… it’s not just about Congress. It’s not just about America. It’s about a reaction, a backlash, against China’s practices in every advanced industrial country.”
When asked whether the United States and allies around the globe would ever form a united front in challenging China’s economic policies, Chas Freeman told Asia Times simply, “it’s too late.”
“That is to say that sufficient damage is going to be done to our relationships with Europeans and others that we will not be able to form a common front,” he said.
“America is here to stay as a great power,” Freeman said in his opening keynote speech, adding, “China is back as one.” If leaders in Washington want to ensure he is right about the former, those gathered in Silicon Valley said, they have accept the latter. They also have to focus on investing in their own country’s future, not sabotaging China’s.
What's so exceptional about the USA that ensures its current title of great power? Many others have been run, governed, built up by more or less the same people using the same methods. Most of these others have succeeded and failed. Great powers come and go, thinking one is an exception to this rule almost guarantees one's eventual demise. Adaptation is a better policy than head -> sand. China is beginning to return to this level with a new strategy. The old ones have been tried and done for centuries with varied success all around the world. If anyone has a shot at staying as a great power, it is authoritarian PRC. I'm not saying it will be, just questioning the thinking behind such a statement.
hmmm... let's see
Permanent Seat on the UN Security Council
It's currency is the World's reserved currency
Largest national GDP
Ability to Project Power Globally
Control of enough Nukes to make the planet uninhabitable
Are the headlines.....
Were you asking a rhetorical question? or just been a troll?
There's little question the USA is at present, and in the foreseeable future, a great power, it would be real nice if it didn't abuse that power!
Hendrik_2000
Lieutenant General
Nothing stay permanent empire come and go British has saying the sun never set on the empire But but the sun do set on empire America has advantages , large and fertile land mass border by 2 ocean, relatively open society welcoming immigrant, enlighthening leadership. But she squander all those advantages with unending war and sticking their nose where they don't belong to detrimental of their own development. Little wonder when the standard living is declining for large majority of people. They then feel hopeless and demanding speedy change susceptible to snake oil salesmen
Now they are putting their money where their mouth is
China closing in on massive new chip fund in bid to dominate US semiconductor industry
Danny Crichton,TechCrunch 8 minutes ago
China’s government has made . And now, it appears to be putting its money where its messaging has been.
, China is close to finalizing a $47 billion investment fund that would finance semiconductor research and chip startup development. The fund, formally the China Integrated Circuit Industry Investment Fund Co., appears to be underwritten predominantly by government capital sources.
, with the size of the fund ranging widely. Just two weeks ago, that the fund would be $19 billion, . The exact number appears to be under intense negotiation among the Chinese leadership, and is also responsive to the increasingly tense trade negotiations with the United States.
If the $47 billion number pans out, , China’s leading engineering university, to spur the development of an indigenous semiconductor industry back in 2015.
China is highly dependent on foreign tech in its semiconductor industry, in order to power its fast-growing economy. The Chinese government has always been wary of that dependency, but its fears were heightened in recent weeks , a prominent Chinese telecom equipment manufacturer.
Chinese President Xi Jinping has gone on something of , visiting factories across the country and encouraging further investment in the country’s technology industry. , “National rejuvenation relies on the ‘hard work’ of the Chinese people, and the country's innovation capacity must be raised through independent efforts, President Xi Jinping said on Tuesday.”
While the numbers discussed are eye-popping, so are the costs of developing leading-edge semiconductor technology. As semiconductors have grown more complex, . Intel spent more than $13 billion on R&D expenses alone in 2017, , with Qualcomm, Broadcom, and Samsung each spending more than $3 billion.
While China may try to play catchup in the broad category of semiconductors, it is strategically placing its money on new areas like 5G wireless and artificial intelligence-focused chips where it might become a leading provider of technology. Concerns over 5G in particular have and its ability to compete in what is rare virgin territory in the telecom equipment space.
For American companies like and Qualcomm, who are used to holding de facto monopolies on entire swaths of the semiconductor market, the renewed competition from China is going to pressure them to push their tech forward faster.
Now they are putting their money where their mouth is
China closing in on massive new chip fund in bid to dominate US semiconductor industry
Danny Crichton,TechCrunch 8 minutes ago
China’s government has made . And now, it appears to be putting its money where its messaging has been.
, China is close to finalizing a $47 billion investment fund that would finance semiconductor research and chip startup development. The fund, formally the China Integrated Circuit Industry Investment Fund Co., appears to be underwritten predominantly by government capital sources.
, with the size of the fund ranging widely. Just two weeks ago, that the fund would be $19 billion, . The exact number appears to be under intense negotiation among the Chinese leadership, and is also responsive to the increasingly tense trade negotiations with the United States.
If the $47 billion number pans out, , China’s leading engineering university, to spur the development of an indigenous semiconductor industry back in 2015.
China is highly dependent on foreign tech in its semiconductor industry, in order to power its fast-growing economy. The Chinese government has always been wary of that dependency, but its fears were heightened in recent weeks , a prominent Chinese telecom equipment manufacturer.
Chinese President Xi Jinping has gone on something of , visiting factories across the country and encouraging further investment in the country’s technology industry. , “National rejuvenation relies on the ‘hard work’ of the Chinese people, and the country's innovation capacity must be raised through independent efforts, President Xi Jinping said on Tuesday.”
While the numbers discussed are eye-popping, so are the costs of developing leading-edge semiconductor technology. As semiconductors have grown more complex, . Intel spent more than $13 billion on R&D expenses alone in 2017, , with Qualcomm, Broadcom, and Samsung each spending more than $3 billion.
While China may try to play catchup in the broad category of semiconductors, it is strategically placing its money on new areas like 5G wireless and artificial intelligence-focused chips where it might become a leading provider of technology. Concerns over 5G in particular have and its ability to compete in what is rare virgin territory in the telecom equipment space.
For American companies like and Qualcomm, who are used to holding de facto monopolies on entire swaths of the semiconductor market, the renewed competition from China is going to pressure them to push their tech forward faster.
- This article originally appeared on .
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