Ok, now that you have poured your cup of anger upon poor Mr. Clancy once again, I would like to remind that lets keep things civil and avoid letting this get out of hands and turning to a flaming countrybashing event...
Tom Clancy's "The Bear and the Dragon"
- Thread starter Ender Wiggin
- Start date
Kampfwagen
Junior Member
The only Tom Clancy book I have ever really read was Rainbow Six. Back then I was pretty young then too. It was a good book for the most part except for some glaring mistakes. (A member of a hostage rescue team using an M60E3???)
As far as Clancy himself? About the only thing here other than what I read here was about how he should have served in vietnam but did not. (Then the author, for all seriousness, goes on to say how if he had the money Clancy did, then he would become a West African Despot.)
Personaly, I dont care about the authors of works (Music, Video Games, Novels, etc.) as long as they make good works.
As far as Clancy himself? About the only thing here other than what I read here was about how he should have served in vietnam but did not. (Then the author, for all seriousness, goes on to say how if he had the money Clancy did, then he would become a West African Despot.)
Personaly, I dont care about the authors of works (Music, Video Games, Novels, etc.) as long as they make good works.
The_Zergling
Junior Member
Kampfwagen said:
Similiar opinion here, however I'd think what tends to arouse anger and exasperation is that most of his scenarios are supposed to be based in modern time and supposedly plausible, which make it just a sophisticated method of military wanking.
You can get away with some total BS in novels that don't have any technological or historical parallel to the real world, but that's about as far as you can get before getting your ass handed to you for completely distorting real facts.
I was intending to get this book before I saw you guys posts. I will just then find a better place to spend my 7 bucks. I have been sort of a fan of Tom Clancy after I read some of his non-fictional books, such as his submarine book and F-22 book. Those books I think are of good quality and accurate to some extent. In particular, his submarine book has an interesting section discussng how the life is on boat, which I think is interesting. The only non-fictional book of his I ever read is "Read Storm Rising", which I think is pretty good, and I like his way of telling stories in that book, plain language, no emotional bushit, not much drama. That way he kinds of build his reputation to me.
Now since I found out he is a racist towards general asian people, there is no way I am buying his book.
Having said good bye to Tom Clancy, are there other authors in military-related topics worth reading? I do need some books to kill time on planes, please no romance novels.
Now since I found out he is a racist towards general asian people, there is no way I am buying his book.
Having said good bye to Tom Clancy, are there other authors in military-related topics worth reading? I do need some books to kill time on planes, please no romance novels.
Ender Wiggin
Junior Member
i was going to suggest Harry Turtledove books but they have slightly more detailed sex scenes and I geuss that counts as romance 
HT writes alternative history essentially "what if" kinda thing, his most famous ones is a series based on whether orders Lee's Battle orders 122 didnt fall into Union Hands allowing Lee to win key battles. Brittain and France at this point recognized Confederate independance and forced the US to recognize it as well. The book series continues onto WWI, the interwar years and now WWII.
He also has a few other books series, I liked "Days of Infamy" which is a realistic scenario where Japan actually seizes the Hawaiian islands with troops not just raiding it, a sequal is out now I think for it. Lots of cool fighter scenes.
Another book is his "World War" series which is partly scifi, where in 1942 4 foot tall eguana aliens from Tau Ceti system invade earth forcing German, Japan, USSR, USA, and GB to work together to stop them. Has a "Colonization" series as a sequal which covers the 60's and now has another sequal that covers 2004.
Though the Book Samurai! by Saburo Sakai is also good, its partly his memoirs partly an "historical novel" its about his experiances as a Japanese fighter pilot in WWII set as a novel rather then a journal. LOTS of cool fighter combat.
But ya, I'm pretty sure Clancy's only good books were Red Storm Rising and Hunt for the Red October.
HT writes alternative history essentially "what if" kinda thing, his most famous ones is a series based on whether orders Lee's Battle orders 122 didnt fall into Union Hands allowing Lee to win key battles. Brittain and France at this point recognized Confederate independance and forced the US to recognize it as well. The book series continues onto WWI, the interwar years and now WWII.
He also has a few other books series, I liked "Days of Infamy" which is a realistic scenario where Japan actually seizes the Hawaiian islands with troops not just raiding it, a sequal is out now I think for it. Lots of cool fighter scenes.
Another book is his "World War" series which is partly scifi, where in 1942 4 foot tall eguana aliens from Tau Ceti system invade earth forcing German, Japan, USSR, USA, and GB to work together to stop them. Has a "Colonization" series as a sequal which covers the 60's and now has another sequal that covers 2004.
Though the Book Samurai! by Saburo Sakai is also good, its partly his memoirs partly an "historical novel" its about his experiances as a Japanese fighter pilot in WWII set as a novel rather then a journal. LOTS of cool fighter combat.
But ya, I'm pretty sure Clancy's only good books were Red Storm Rising and Hunt for the Red October.
well philip K dick wrote a book about 'what if' history, about nazis winning the WWII, but i cannot recall its english name....
But if you like this sort of 'thriller' type of books, I would suggest Frederick Forsyth's books. His the top notch of these 'genre' and Maybe he has a 'western' views like clancy, but he knows how to write them
...David Mansons Shadow Over Babylon was also good one...
BUT if you want to read something better, try Robert Holdstocks, Robin Hobbs or Stephen R. Donaldson's fantasy (as i expect that ALL of you have allready read all of Tolkiens work...) Or some good Soviet scifi...
But if you like this sort of 'thriller' type of books, I would suggest Frederick Forsyth's books. His the top notch of these 'genre' and Maybe he has a 'western' views like clancy, but he knows how to write them
...David Mansons Shadow Over Babylon was also good one...
BUT if you want to read something better, try Robert Holdstocks, Robin Hobbs or Stephen R. Donaldson's fantasy (as i expect that ALL of you have allready read all of Tolkiens work...) Or some good Soviet scifi...
Ender Wiggin
Junior Member
the Soviets had scifi?
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Portrait of Dorian Grey was a good book, and the Ender's Game series are probably my favorite books, especially Ender's Game itself, and so is anything by Edgar Allen Poe or Ray Bradbury, but those aren't military(except ender's game) .
If you wanna read good military books I would reccomend non-fiction. The Boxer Rebellion was a good book, but I forget who it was by. D-Day by Stephen Ambrose was good, liked that. In Flanders Fields sucked. Queen Victoria's Little Wars was a good one. Also the What If Series is good, sort of like Turtledove but not as long. They are a collection of essays by major historians on things like "what if the nazis had repulsed D-Day." (It would have sucked for them because Berlin would have gotten nuked and the Soviets would have ruled their entire country and all of western Europe right up to the present day.)
Ender, are Turtledove's books any good? I was gonna read the one with the aliens.
Portrait of Dorian Grey was a good book, and the Ender's Game series are probably my favorite books, especially Ender's Game itself, and so is anything by Edgar Allen Poe or Ray Bradbury, but those aren't military(except ender's game) .
If you wanna read good military books I would reccomend non-fiction. The Boxer Rebellion was a good book, but I forget who it was by. D-Day by Stephen Ambrose was good, liked that. In Flanders Fields sucked. Queen Victoria's Little Wars was a good one. Also the What If Series is good, sort of like Turtledove but not as long. They are a collection of essays by major historians on things like "what if the nazis had repulsed D-Day." (It would have sucked for them because Berlin would have gotten nuked and the Soviets would have ruled their entire country and all of western Europe right up to the present day.)
Ender, are Turtledove's books any good? I was gonna read the one with the aliens.
Ender Wiggin
Junior Member
read, like, Harry Turtledove is one of those writers that perplex me.
like the actual "writing" eg: dialogue arent very good, however the "story" plot, story development, fight scenes etc are good.
Essentially the books are the thought provoking/interesting kind of books.
Like the WW series could've been 2 maybe three books, not 4. Any book with more then one book always seems to spend the first chapter repeating everything and then gets onto the good stuff, theyre addictive even if they're not literary works of art. :/
like the actual "writing" eg: dialogue arent very good, however the "story" plot, story development, fight scenes etc are good.
Essentially the books are the thought provoking/interesting kind of books.
Like the WW series could've been 2 maybe three books, not 4. Any book with more then one book always seems to spend the first chapter repeating everything and then gets onto the good stuff, theyre addictive even if they're not literary works of art. :/