The War in the Ukraine

Pmichael said:

There is no way for Russian to actually confirm anything like all those killed brigades.

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Well we do kinda know Russia is inflicting heavy damage from artillery. Because Western Medias interviewing Ukrainian soldiers basically say they getting pounded 24/7 from it and are taking heavy losses. Just like that on the Kherson, where one Ukrainian platoon commander said he took 5 casualties for every 1 on the other side.

Maikeru said:

Wow the amount of cope and seethe on here is something to behold! Yes, yes of course the Russians are just retreating to draw the Ukrainians out into the open so they can be, er, left completely alone to advance as far as they like. You know, the Russians could retreat all the way to Moscow and then develop a really, really big cauldron....Anyway, some updates:

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Knowing Russians I can only imagine that they pulled off from the area because they're preparing to send nukes in. But civilians are left there and not evacuated so it's crazy to even think of something like that.

This is turning into an embarrassment of Afghan Withdraw proportions or greater for Russia... I think I've seen enough to conclude.

tankphobia said:

So, my question now is, where did Ukraine pull this force from? They couldn't have achieved this deep thrust in two directions without committing at least 20k+ men into the offensive, we've all heard previously how hard the Russian artillery was hitting the Ukrainian positions and that their best troops are being turned into meat paste through long range suppression. To operate at this speed and ferocity does not seem like the conduct of a poorly trained TDF, but rather well drilled mechanized troops. It's actually interesting that Ukraine was able to pull such a force out of a magic hat even as their entire front is getting pounded by artillery daily for the last few months.

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Reservists + NATO "volunteers". Especially the latter whose quantities are unknown by the public so far. But seeing how many random English speaking mercs are on video...

Feels like USA actually learned the lessons of the Korean war and was able to apply it with some effectiveness in a modern setting.

Janiz said:

Knowing Russians I can only imagine that they pulled off from the area because they're preparing to send nukes in. But civilians are left there and not evacuated so it's crazy to even think of something like that.

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"Knowing Russians" there's 1 country that used nukes on a non nuclear country and it ain't Russia. It would be out of character for Russians to do that, but with the Gorby tribe putting Russia on a path of misguided imitation to the west, maybe Russia really will use a tactical nuke. Who knows.

tankphobia said:

Really please stop with these bot accusations. FYI you literally only post in this thread, and you made your account in 2014... This is SDF, not UDF/RDF. I think even the ardent pro Ukrainians here are being pretty reasonable rather than just throwing accusations of bots whenever their side is not having a good day on the front.

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What.

The ardent pro Ukrainians are being reasonable? Is this the same reasonability you had when you claimed the Russian company made a Chinese drone in Russia when they literally said the exact opposite?

siegecrossbow said:

This is turning into an embarrassment of Afghan Withdraw proportions or greater for Russia... I think I've seen enough to conclude.

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No shit. (not to be rude lol). I listened to Alex Mer. recent video. Apparently, the force deployed to reinforce the region is from either Moscow or the Central Military Distract (Some distance away from the Western Borders). Been saying that the Regular Army seems oddly MIA ever since they left Kiev and we heard that DPR units were defending Kherson a few days ago. I don’t know why Russia insist on fighting this with their left hand tied to their right foot.

gelgoog said:

Poland sent Ukraine 200x T-72M1 tanks and the Czechs, etc sent another 100x T-72M1 tanks. Then you have NATO "volunteers".

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I mean, that doesn't mean what you think it means?

I specifically asked:

How many NATO aircraft, ships, divisions, brigades, tanks, is Russia fighting against?

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So ok. At least 300 tanks (btw not manned or operated by NATO). What about the rest? Where are the F-35, the F-15, F-16, ships, submarines, divisions, brigades

I hope you aren't seriously insuating that some material support is enough for this to be called a NATO-Russia war. We have freedom of opinion so I guess you could also say that Russia is fighting alone against the intergalactic Western empire if that makes you feel better.

What happens in reality though is that this is a NATO-backed Ukraine - Russia war. If NATO had really entered a conventional war against Russia it would had mopped up Russian formations in the first week

tankphobia said:

So, my question now is, where did Ukraine pull this force from? They couldn't have achieved this deep thrust in two directions without committing at least 20k+ men into the offensive, we've all heard previously how hard the Russian artillery was hitting the Ukrainian positions and that their best troops are being turned into meat paste through long range suppression. To operate at this speed and ferocity does not seem like the conduct of a poorly trained TDF, but rather well drilled mechanized troops. It's actually interesting that Ukraine was able to pull such a force out of a magic hat even as their entire front is getting pounded by artillery daily for the last few months.

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It was probably the troops trained in Western Ukraine and in NATO (ie Britain and such) plus some elite formations and foreign volunteers. I'm pretty sure they just stuffed the Donbas with poorly trained and equipped TDF and regulars.

siegecrossbow said:

This is turning into an embarrassment of Afghan Withdraw proportions or greater for Russia... I think I've seen enough to conclude.

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This is not a withdrawal or a retreat. Merely a tactical repositioning before the final decisive push to Kiev and then to Warsaw. Heard it here first

Overbom said:

I mean, that doesn't mean what you think it means?

I specifically asked:

So ok. At least 300 tanks (btw not manned or operated by NATO). What about the rest? Where are the F-35, the F-15, F-16, ships, submarines, divisions, brigades

I hope you aren't seriously insuating that some material support is enough for this to be called a NATO-Russia war. We have freedom of opinion so I guess you could also say that Russia is fighting alone against the intergalactic Western empire if that makes you feel better.

What happens in reality though is that this is a NATO-backed Ukraine - Russia war. If NATO had really entered a conventional war against Russia it would had mopped up Russian formations in the first week

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NATO is not attacking on full scale because nuclear powers generally don't attack eachother with everything they got for a good reason.

What is your point? When China intervened in US vs Korea and US vs Vietnam, they were not using most of their modern tanks or airplanes either for plausible deniability and to avoid direct war. Would you characterise the Korean war as being just Chinese-backed Korea vs USA?

Funny how mopping up the enemy in 1 week was what Russians thought about Ukraine to begin with as well, and what US army thought about Afghanistan. Of course if NATO starts ww3, Russia will initially be on the back foot due to difference in numbers, but if that happened, it'll be the Russians fighting tooth and nail for their homeland with full mobilisation from ages 18-50. They'll also have China's latest weapons mixed among them ready to wreak havoc on NATO high value targets.

Going to open war with Russia simply isn't an option to NATO. Sending 1000s-10000s of volunteers with artillery support using lighter equipment is the most they can do.