The War in the Ukraine

Broccoli

Senior Member
More "fake" footage. Russia has to withdraw from there

Interesting how Ukrainian air force manages doing bombing runs after three months of fighting against (supposedly) far stronger opponent. Either Russians are running low on AWACS avability or they won't use them anywhere near Odessa area because they are afraid that Ukrainian fighters shoot them down (not enough fighters for escort duties?).
 

Temstar

Brigadier
Registered Member

This is being reported by multiple sources. The ambassador of LNR (Lugansk People’s Republic) to Russia has reported about the withdrawal of a Ukrainian brigade from Lisichansk and the clashes in Belogorovka, Shipilovka, and Privolye.

Looks like Russian forces have successfully forced a crossing across the Siverskyi Donets River.
 

Atomicfrog

Major
Registered Member
Blue on blue moments especially from drone use shouldn't be that unusual. It has happened with US forces before.

S*** happens. Won't be surprised if the Russians did in their own too.
With all the equipment looking the same, would not be surprising at all. Russians army looked so confused in the first month and Ukrainians so paranoid that they certainly killed a bunch of their own troops.
 

Soldier30

Senior Member
Registered Member
A damaged Russian Su-25 landed in Ukraine on one engine. While performing a combat mission in Ukraine, a Su-25 aircraft, the second in the pair, was hit by a missile fired from the ground by Ukrainian servicemen. The pilot of the damaged aircraft decided to turn off the damaged engine and not leave the aircraft. At this time, the leader of the pair, Lieutenant Colonel Denis Litvinov, seeing the launch of another rocket, released heat traps and covered his friend’s damaged plane from missiles with his plane.

 

Soldier30

Senior Member
Registered Member
Footage of the combat departure of the Su-24M aircraft of the Russian Aerospace Forces in Ukraine. The video shows the moment when the Su-24M low-altitude FAB-250SH aerial bombs are dropped on the positions of the Ukrainian army, the bomb explodes in several modes, in this case it shows a delay in the response time

 

Suetham

Senior Member
Registered Member
Russia's own PMC, Wagner are saying this helicopter was Russian not Ukrainian and those were special forces. And that the enemy destroyed the Mi-8.

The incompetence of the Russians have surprised me. The only group making gains for them are the SOF Spetsnaz, DPR militia men (this group did a lot in Mariupol), the Chechens, and recently the Wagner PMC. I don't see much from others; maybe they don't post enough about their success. Russian marines were also doing lots of fighting in Mariupol and are probably the ones storming the last stronghold in that city.

I can't tell what the Russian army is doing. They are involve but not to a great extent. Russian National Guards just come in and take control once an area has been captured. But so far I see them located in major cities with the bulk in Kherson.

The front line fighting are done in small groups BTGs after artillery and air strikes and this tactic is not effective as it is leaving the rears in Kharkiv and Izyum exposed to Ukraine counter which are happening now.

This is ineptitude is so ridiculous that I'm lost in how to process this. Everything I learned about Soviet doctrine and subsequent Russia's doctrine have been proving wrong. Russia's corruption is so deed that they can't get this done right. PLA needs to take heavy notes and realize this is not how to fight a major fight if any lessons are to be taken from this war. US showed the world how it is done numerous times in the 1990s and 2000s and yet Russia can't remotely replicate it.

For now everything points to lack of troops. Their tactics are not entirely bad. They just need more commitment. Otherwise they will suffer unnecessary casualties.
I would not put much truth in what the Wagner Group announces, they also claimed that things were ugly in Ukraine and that only mobilization could change that, saying that Putin would declare war on Ukraine on May 9, which evidently did not happen. .

They're saying it was a Mi-8AMTSh destroyed on Cobra Island. The helicopter was assigned to the 487th Helicopter Regiment.

To begin with, this regiment was dissolved.

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"28 августа 2009 года во исполнение Директивы МО РФ от 19 января 2009 г., 487-й отдельный вертолётный полк (боевой и управления) (487-й ОВП (биУ)) расформирован и вошел в состав сформированной 6971-й авиационной базы (1 -го разряда). Часть получила наименование «Войсковая часть 12910». Затем, на основании Директивы МО РФ от 18 июля 2010 г., 1 декабря 2011 года на аэродроме Будённовск сформирована 387-я авиационная база (армейской авиации) 2-го разряда « Войсковая часть 44936»."

Also, the Mi-8AMTSh version always has armament carriers, these armament carriers are always present on Russia's Mi-8 MTV5\AMTSh and are quite large.

e5c3001891361010e59446ff28289ccf.jpg

I really want whoever of those who claim it's a Russian helicopter to be able to convincingly explain these tethers that cast doubt on whether the heli was Russian, because I don't see evidence for that, and that includes the initial doubts of the first comment.

You brought news about the attack, I will do the same.

Kiev media reported the death of Lieutenant Colonel Igor Bedzai of the AFU's 10th Naval Aviation Brigade.

Do you know which one of the vectors this unit uses?

The unit uses several modifications of the Mi-8.

Presumably, Bedzai was aboard one of the downed helicopters that Russia claimed to have destroyed.

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How do you explain this?

Don't jump to conclusions.

It is unclear from whom and when, but there was an attempt to land troops which was completely quashed. The footage appears to be from a TB2, but evidence of these claims is still lacking.

The Ukrainians are clearly trying to clear a path for the landing on Cobras Island.

It is worth remembering that the Russians claimed before this video was released that they shot down a Ukrainian helicopter that was trying to land troops on the island. The Russian briefing disclosed that the Russians set a trap, retreating troops on the island and when the Ukrainians advanced with 1 Mig-29, 1 SU-27, two Mi-8s carrying special forces and three boats with troops, they were attacked and destroyed.

This could mean that there were no Russian troops on the island when the attack with the Ukrainian fighter jets took place as well as the landing in the later event. According to Russian sources, Cobra Island was evacuated after its air defenses (Tor) were disabled by Ukrainian drones. Then the Ukrainians bombed the empty complex to get a good picture and tried to land some troops using helicopters. Then the VKS came in and destroyed the Mi-8s and a corvette. They claim that this video is actually the destruction of one of these Mi-8s. Also, the explosion is too big for a TB2 MAM-L.

In the video it clearly shows +5 soldiers protecting the landing zone, if the Russians were in possession of the island, why do that?

I've been studying footage of the Mi-8 from Cobra Island that was destroyed. The Ukrainian source points out that it was Russian, but this is very unlikely.

Bayraktar didn't seem to be in 'fire mode'. I compared other footage of Bayraktars hitting targets and every time there was a square or a target indication box. None were visible with the helicopter attack on Cobras Island. Second, the helicopter landed in the southwestern part of the island, heading towards mainland Ukraine. A Russian landing would have landed in the northeast part of the island. Thirdly, the Russians claimed they destroyed several Mi-8's shortly before this footage appeared, but I also can't figure out why the Russians would land soldiers and try to protect an island they already owned. And many other arguments.
 

Abominable

Major
Registered Member
I would not put much truth in what the Wagner Group announces, they also claimed that things were ugly in Ukraine and that only mobilization could change that, saying that Putin would declare war on Ukraine on May 9, which evidently did not happen. .

They're saying it was a Mi-8AMTSh destroyed on Cobra Island. The helicopter was assigned to the 487th Helicopter Regiment.

To begin with, this regiment was dissolved.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

"28 августа 2009 года во исполнение Директивы МО РФ от 19 января 2009 г., 487-й отдельный вертолётный полк (боевой и управления) (487-й ОВП (биУ)) расформирован и вошел в состав сформированной 6971-й авиационной базы (1 -го разряда). Часть получила наименование «Войсковая часть 12910». Затем, на основании Директивы МО РФ от 18 июля 2010 г., 1 декабря 2011 года на аэродроме Будённовск сформирована 387-я авиационная база (армейской авиации) 2-го разряда « Войсковая часть 44936»."

Also, the Mi-8AMTSh version always has armament carriers, these armament carriers are always present on Russia's Mi-8 MTV5\AMTSh and are quite large.

View attachment 88511

I really want whoever of those who claim it's a Russian helicopter to be able to convincingly explain these tethers that cast doubt on whether the heli was Russian, because I don't see evidence for that, and that includes the initial doubts of the first comment.

You brought news about the attack, I will do the same.

Kiev media reported the death of Lieutenant Colonel Igor Bedzai of the AFU's 10th Naval Aviation Brigade.

Do you know which one of the vectors this unit uses?

The unit uses several modifications of the Mi-8.

Presumably, Bedzai was aboard one of the downed helicopters that Russia claimed to have destroyed.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

How do you explain this?

Don't jump to conclusions.

It is unclear from whom and when, but there was an attempt to land troops which was completely quashed. The footage appears to be from a TB2, but evidence of these claims is still lacking.

The Ukrainians are clearly trying to clear a path for the landing on Cobras Island.

It is worth remembering that the Russians claimed before this video was released that they shot down a Ukrainian helicopter that was trying to land troops on the island. The Russian briefing disclosed that the Russians set a trap, retreating troops on the island and when the Ukrainians advanced with 1 Mig-29, 1 SU-27, two Mi-8s carrying special forces and three boats with troops, they were attacked and destroyed.

This could mean that there were no Russian troops on the island when the attack with the Ukrainian fighter jets took place as well as the landing in the later event. According to Russian sources, Cobra Island was evacuated after its air defenses (Tor) were disabled by Ukrainian drones. Then the Ukrainians bombed the empty complex to get a good picture and tried to land some troops using helicopters. Then the VKS came in and destroyed the Mi-8s and a corvette. They claim that this video is actually the destruction of one of these Mi-8s. Also, the explosion is too big for a TB2 MAM-L.

In the video it clearly shows +5 soldiers protecting the landing zone, if the Russians were in possession of the island, why do that?

I've been studying footage of the Mi-8 from Cobra Island that was destroyed. The Ukrainian source points out that it was Russian, but this is very unlikely.

Bayraktar didn't seem to be in 'fire mode'. I compared other footage of Bayraktars hitting targets and every time there was a square or a target indication box. None were visible with the helicopter attack on Cobras Island. Second, the helicopter landed in the southwestern part of the island, heading towards mainland Ukraine. A Russian landing would have landed in the northeast part of the island. Thirdly, the Russians claimed they destroyed several Mi-8's shortly before this footage appeared, but I also can't figure out why the Russians would land soldiers and try to protect an island they already owned. And many other arguments.
There's been a bit of a debate on telegram on whether it was Ukrainian or Russian. Rybar is usually reliable and put out a corrected statement that it was a Russian helicopter.

The reasons you point out are reasons I thought it was a Ukrainian helicopter. Also, look at the massive explosion. There's no way a TB-2 could carry enough ordnance for an explosion that big. Look at the explosions against raptor class patrol boats for example. Plus we don't see the projectile in the video footage, it's coming in very fast. If it was a PGM or subsonic missile you'd catch a few frames of it in flight. It looks like a shell or ballistic missile strike to me.

At the end of the day it's one helicopter in a war where Ukraine is losing hundreds of soldiers a day. If Ukrainians did it I'd be interested in knowing how, but that's it.
 
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