The War in the Ukraine

Santamaria

Junior Member
Registered Member
LOL. Where did you get the number? From grifters at Guanxi?

Poland's Office of National Security (BBN - Biuro Bezpieczeństwa Narodowego) commissioned a number of studies into the Russo-Ukrainian war and one of the more interesting findings were the statistics on equipment losses and their causes.

That's all. You people can learn from it, nor not. I don't care. I have more important stuff to do. Have good week.
Thanks for the explanation, but I think I would rather learn from experts of a country with a better military history record than Poland

When you have both Russia and Israel, two countries with a solid MIC and currently involved in a war creating anti FVP defences for their tanks does not ring a bell on you and your armchair office?
 
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Santamaria

Junior Member
Registered Member
They replaced a civil engineer with a mathematician/economist as defense minister. We will see what happens.
At this point both are managers. I don’t think neither Shoigu neither the new guy ever worked as engineer or mathematician.

For me what is more interesting is that Shoigu will take the place of Patrushev as secretary of Security Council.

Patrushev has intelligence background and he has always been very anti west, a real hawk, a hardliner against any trust in the West.
In theory he will get a new Position and that’s why Shoigu got his place but this could be an excuse.

I wonder what this means
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gelgoog

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
Still not the craziest thing I saw in comparison to Rogozin being the head chief of Roscosmos before.
Yeah. Putting a journalist by training as head of the space agency. He is supposed to have undergone training to do his job. Still...
I can't speak too poorly about him because since he went there at least they built Vostochny and the rockets don't seem to be failing as much anymore. But the satellite program is a disaster.

At this point both are managers. I don’t think neither Shoigu neither the new guy ever worked as engineer or mathematician.
You would be wrong. According to Wikipedia:

"Shoigu worked in construction projects nationwide for the next decade, advancing from low levels to become an executive. In 1988, Shoigu became a minor functionary in the Abakan branch of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union, and then in the Komsomol for a few years. In 1990, Shoigu moved to Moscow from Siberia, and was appointed deputy chairman of the State Architecture and Construction Committee of the Russian Federation"

"From 1981 to 1986, Belousov was probationer-researcher and then junior researcher in the simulation laboratory of human-machine systems of the Central Economic Mathematical Institute. From 1991 to 2006, he was head of laboratory in the Institute of Economic Forecasting in the Russian Academy of Science. He was external advisor to prime minister from 2000 to 2006. Then he served as deputy minister of economic development and trade for two years from 2006 to 2008."

Makes sense if you also read the below. The new defence minister will have to bring down costs and enchance military spending efficiency
Yeah it could make sense. An econometric analysis of the current war situation could help improve the bang for the buck.
 
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SolarWarden

Junior Member
Registered Member
Still not the craziest thing I saw in comparison to Rogozin being the head chief of Roscosmos before.


You overestimate the intelligence of Ukrainians when they moved 2 Patriot launchers closer to Avdiivka because Russians were going crazy with the use of FABs in the city which resulted in those launchers being super close together blowing up. Having another weapons package for more Patriots launchers makes it sound like something is destroying them if they received them before in the precious weapons package.
Seems you're avoiding the most important question... Why would Ukraine deploy a 2 missile launcher and radar meters from each other where the radar can get damage from a patriot launch? Because they are decoys. Arguing this is just coping that Russia was fooled and wasted an Iskander.

Btw Russians claimed those were s300 launchers then much later changed it. How convenient, huh? :rolleyes:
 

gelgoog

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
Seems you're avoiding the most important question... Why would Ukraine deploy a 2 missile launcher and radar meters from each other where the radar can get damage from a patriot launch? Because they are decoys. Arguing this is just coping that Russia was fooled and wasted an Iskander.
Could it be that they don't want to use wireless communications between nodes which could be jammed and/or intercepted by the Russians? Could it be that they were in a hurry and didn't bother? Of course that never passes your mind.
 

blackjack21

Junior Member
Registered Member
Seems you're avoiding the most important question... Why would Ukraine deploy a 2 missile launcher and radar meters from each other where the radar can get damage from a patriot launch? Because they are decoys. Arguing this is just coping that Russia was fooled and wasted an Iskander.

Btw Russians claimed those were s300 launchers then much later changed it. How convenient, huh? :rolleyes:
OK Russia destroyed nothing but decoy patriots which is why ukraine needs more decoy patriots, is that the right approach?
 

SolarWarden

Junior Member
Registered Member
Could it be that they don't want to use wireless communications between nodes which could be jammed and/or intercepted by the Russians?
No.
Could it be that they were in a hurry and didn't bother? Of course that never passes your mind.
No.

(sigh) Why would the radar be positioned so close to launcher that radar could get severely damaged after a launch? If anything it looks like Ukraine said meh the Russians will fall for it... and they did. This is not the first or will be the last time Russians take the bait it's part of war especially this war.
 

Tam

Brigadier
Registered Member
All it takes is a bit of thinking and logic... Why on earth would you put a launcher so close to the radar? Launchers can be deployed 15-20kms from its radar.That in itself should have raised a redflag for Russian forces but it did not. Noy only that but the radar was pointing the opposite where the launcher was pointing... another redflag. It was a decoy.

Position didn't matter. If you're trying to fool the Russians anyway you would also try to position the radar as realistic as possible. You also do not want to waste two decoys in one strike, if you can lure two separate missiles on two separate targets.

If it was a decoy both the launcher and radar would have been to blown tosmithereens. It wasn't. There were still big discernable metal wrecks there. I doubt that with the corruption going on with the Ukrainian MIC they would spend so much expense on an extremely sturdy metal decoy. Decoys are usually made from wood or balloons.

The radar is obviously in the clearing because it has a clear unobstructed view of the sky, particularly towards the horizon which is needed in dealing with low altitude targets. Trees would obviously affect the radar. Since they obviously affect radio waves that would also mean radio communication between the radar and the launching unit. So it makes sense to put them close in a wooded area. This isn't a clear empty field or a desert.

There's also the expense of this clearing. Clearings are a scarce resource by themselves, since it takes a lot of work to find the right position and clear it. This makes the position very valuable. Wasting it on a decoy would actually be an act of self suppression.

And then there's the surrounding fires. Seen enough vehicles on fire inside a forest to know what those are. Oh and an evac vehicle and a fire fighting vehicle coming to the scene. For a decoy. Yeah right.

Dima of Military Summary channel is also calling it real.

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If there's anything that was a decoy it's from that satellite pic you posted on the S-300 launchers after the ATACMS strike in Crimea after the real ones have left their clearings, which would mean if there's anything left its likely a decoy.


Onto other things.

YouTube version of the Iskander-Tornado S strike on Ukrainian temporary helicopter parking field.

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Another M777 taken out by Krasnopol.

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105mm L119 howitzer gets knocked out by Russian counterbattery fire.

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The result of a failed counterattack on the 39th Brigade yields a captured Spartan APC.

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Casualties on the Belgorod apartment strike now up to 11 civilians including two children.

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Lancet strike on a Western type 155mm SPG that's heavily masked. Probably a Krab.

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Another Ukrainian SPG goes down by a Lancet, either an Akasya or a Gvozdika.

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Krasnopols hit Ukrainian shelters in Krasnogorovka by the 238th.

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Near Liptsy, Kharkhiv region, a FAB-1500 strikes a Ukrainian position.

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Another Abrams gets Krasnopoled in the Avdeyevka Ochertino direction. This time, the target wasn't lighted by an Orlan but by a Granat-4 UAV, making this a first case use. This UAV is produced by Kalashnikov-ZALA. The drone has a range of 70km. Consequently this means the drone can light targets for Kitolov, Gran, Smelchak shells and X-38ML missiles.

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ODAB-1500 with some messages.

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Lancet strike on a Ukrainian T-72.

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AGM-88 found landed in a muddy field.

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The Mad Dogs and the Siberian Association takes out a Maxxpro. Both Spetznaz units operate in the Avdeyevka Ochertino region.

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Russian T-72B3 firing at Ukrainian stronghold in support of an assault. Gets hit by an FPV drone but shrugs it off like a boss.


Lots of Ukrainian POWs including from Kraken unit coming from the northern front. Which means frontline contact with that unit has been made with Group North. Forum policies forbid posting of POWs however.
 
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SolarWarden

Junior Member
Registered Member
Position didn't matter. If you're trying to fool the Russians anyway you would also try to position the radar as realistic as possible. You also do not want to waste two decoys in one strike, if you can lure two separate missiles on two separate targets.

Says who? You? Maybe the one launcher trick isn't working anymore ever think of that?
If it was a decoy both the launcher and radar would have been to blown tosmithereens. It wasn't. There were still big discernable metal wrecks there. I doubt that with the corruption going on with the Ukrainian MIC they would spend so much expense on an extremely sturdy metal decoy. Decoys are usually made from wood or balloons.

If they were real the petrol in the generators would have ignited.
The radar is obviously in the clearing because it has a clear unobstructed view of the sky, particularly towards the horizon which is needed in dealing with low altitude targets.

Its deployed right next to trees.
Trees would obviously affect the radar. Since they obviously affect radio waves that would also mean radio communication between the radar and the launching unit. So it makes sense to put them close in a wooded area. This isn't a clear empty field or a desert.

There's also the expense of this clearing. Clearings are a scarce resource by themselves, since it takes a lot of work to find the right position and clear it. This makes the position very valuable. Wasting it on a decoy would actually be an act of self suppression.

And then there's the surrounding fires. Seen enough vehicles on fire inside a forest to know what those are. Oh and an evac vehicle and a fire fighting vehicle coming to the scene. For a decoy. Yeah right.

Dima of Military Summary channel is also calling it real.

Please, Log in or Register to view URLs content!

If there's anything that was a decoy it's from that satellite pic you posted on the S-300 launchers after the ATACMS strike in Crimea after the real ones have left their clearings, which would mean if there's anything left its likely a decoy.

Another reason why it's fake is US uses Lorry/pull trailers for their Patriot and that one is in Kyiv while Germans use a launch truck.
I guess Ukraine has no more Patriot batteries since one was destroyed few months ago and now this one according to Russians.
 
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