What if they reverse engineer the missile and put it in games?
The War in the Ukraine
- Thread starter SampanViking
- Start date
If Russia got air superiority, which I will define here as them being able to fly their bombers and fighters anywhere in Ukraine with no risk of being shot down, how much of a difference would it make to the war? Would it mean certain defeat for Ukraine or would they still have a chance? Desert Storm showed how devastating air power can be, but you still need accurate intelligence and targeting data otherwise you've just got fighters flying all over the place not knowing where to shoot. Does Russia have sufficient ISR assets and short enough kill chain from finding a target to destroying it, that they could make air superiority count?
Cruise missile launching flares before hitting target :
Quite interesting footage !
Quite interesting footage !
solarz
Brigadier
That would be air supremacy. They already have air superiority.
Gaijin is a company that has committed fraud in the past and I am sure they are doing so now. The people responsible do deserve a Kinzhal up their ***. Having said that, War Thunder can be useful to learn the basics. More specialized video games/ simulators like Steel Beasts Pro PE are good if a person trying to learn on how to operate a specific vehicle in detail. ODS M2A2 are part of SB Pro PE where one can learn how to operate the weapon station of the vehicle and others.
Somewhere in Zaporozhye, two destroyed Maxxpro and two destroyed Bradley.
Russian drones continue to drop bombs at Ukrainian landing boats near Krynki. One less boat means one less means to resupply, reinforce or evacuate.
Ukrainian temporary deployment points in the village of Konstantinovka in Kharkhiv region (how many Konstantinovka is there) not far from the border, gets Krasnopoled.
Ukrainian ammo depot destroyed at Bugrovatka, Kharkhiv region.
The thermal invisible cloaks can have a game changer in the war.
Ukrainian howitzer in the Bakhmut region gets taken out by Lancet from the 98th VDV Division.
Ukrainian mortar nests tracked down by Seversk-V and destroys them.
Krasnopol delivered to a Ukrainian target.
Tornado-G gets busy at Svatovo direction.
Strange cloud formation over Riga looks like a Sukhoi fighter.
The Russians did Ninja Turtle on this one, going through a 2km Soviet era pipe underneath Ukrainian defenses, sending as many as 150 of the Veterans detachment. (This BARS unit played a major role in the delaying action in the Battle of Liman last year).
This attack echoed the breakthrough of the Russians in the Avdeevka Industrial sector last year in November. Here the international Brigade Pyatnashka went underneath a 170 meter tunnel and came out behind Ukrainian positions.
AFU Buk-M1 destroyed.
Paladin runs out of ammo, covered by CNN.
AFU cemeteries becoming wider, according to El Mundo.
Another Ukrainian SAM misses and lands on a building with devastating effects.
16th Assault Detachment of Wagner dropping bombs from drones in the Soledar area.
Ukrainian BM-21 Grad gets taken out by Lancet.
Russian drones continue to drop bombs at Ukrainian landing boats near Krynki. One less boat means one less means to resupply, reinforce or evacuate.
Ukrainian temporary deployment points in the village of Konstantinovka in Kharkhiv region (how many Konstantinovka is there) not far from the border, gets Krasnopoled.
Ukrainian ammo depot destroyed at Bugrovatka, Kharkhiv region.
The thermal invisible cloaks can have a game changer in the war.
Ukrainian howitzer in the Bakhmut region gets taken out by Lancet from the 98th VDV Division.
Ukrainian mortar nests tracked down by Seversk-V and destroys them.
Krasnopol delivered to a Ukrainian target.
Tornado-G gets busy at Svatovo direction.
Strange cloud formation over Riga looks like a Sukhoi fighter.
The Russians did Ninja Turtle on this one, going through a 2km Soviet era pipe underneath Ukrainian defenses, sending as many as 150 of the Veterans detachment. (This BARS unit played a major role in the delaying action in the Battle of Liman last year).
This attack echoed the breakthrough of the Russians in the Avdeevka Industrial sector last year in November. Here the international Brigade Pyatnashka went underneath a 170 meter tunnel and came out behind Ukrainian positions.
AFU Buk-M1 destroyed.
Paladin runs out of ammo, covered by CNN.
AFU cemeteries becoming wider, according to El Mundo.
Another Ukrainian SAM misses and lands on a building with devastating effects.
16th Assault Detachment of Wagner dropping bombs from drones in the Soledar area.
Ukrainian BM-21 Grad gets taken out by Lancet.
Where? Last time I checked Russian aircraft can't get near the frontlines without getting shot down.
To understand whether or not Russia acquired Air Superiority, it is necessary to understand the respective concept.
According to Joint Publication 3-01, Air Superiority is "the degree of air control by a force that allows it to conduct its operations, at a given time and place, without prohibitive air interference and missile threats".
Note that the concept is linked to air control in order to avoid prohibitive interference in operations. In other words, the concept refers to an effect and not to the means, tactics or doctrine to be used to obtain it. It does not mention total or partial destruction of aeronautical infrastructure, air and anti-aircraft assets of opponents. And, even less, that this destruction must be carried out by aircraft, bombs and missiles.
Therefore, and by deduction from the concept itself, due to quantitative and qualitative asymmetries between the means of the contenders, they can be used in different ways to obtain the desired effect.
The VKS can, from its territory, attack any point in Ukraine, with surgical precision, in any weather condition, day and night. The radars on their planes detect enemies further away, their missiles are fired at much greater distances and their defenses against aerial and anti-aircraft weapons can neutralize the Ukrainian ones, as they are Russian-made, obsolete and known to work. Similar reasoning applies to the duel between Russian anti-aircraft means and Ukrainian aircraft and missiles.
In the conflict in question, these asymmetries are extreme. Russia is the third military power in the world (Yes... China is the second). Its armed forces are incomparably superior. If used massively, they would annihilate the Ukrainian military in a matter of weeks, regardless of the quality of plans and leadership. The comparative proportions between the respective means range from tens to hundreds or thousands, and, in qualitative terms, the Russian advantage is also extreme.
Therefore, it would be logical to deduce that the Ukrainian air force, recognizing the impossibility of resisting, chose to disperse its air and anti-aircraft assets, in order to preserve them and avoid useless destruction. This dispersion probably occurred on runways and improvised locations, in the west of the country, closer to NATO borders, in an uninvaded area. They could operate from these locations to harass the Russians, however, the sorties would be very limited by logistical support and there would be a very high risk of being shot down, as they would be detected shortly after taking off.
It would also be logical to deduce that Russian forces have identified and monitor this strategy, thus understanding that it is not necessary to attack airfields, aircraft and air and anti-aircraft systems on the ground. Due to their superiority, if Ukrainian aircraft attempted to operate, they would be detected and destroyed. The few medium-range anti-aircraft systems, when activating their radars, would be targets of anti-radiation missiles. If they launched their missiles, they would be neutralized by the target aircraft's electronic defenses. And if any aircraft managed to bypass Russian air control, they would be shot down by the superior anti-aircraft of their surface forces.
In this way and considering the concept of Air Superiority, the asymmetry of military power, the Russian political objective, as well as the facts, it can be said that Russia effectively has Air Superiority. The effect of controlling the air has been obtained. However, this was not achieved in the most traditional way or in line with the classical doctrine that recommends the destruction of infrastructure and resources, as seen in the Desert Storm that you exemplified.
Russia obtained Air Superiority through deterrence resulting from the asymmetry and readiness inherent to the operational characteristics and lethality of its means.
I know some will not accept the argument, however, at worst, you need to accept the fact that the Russians have effectively achieved a Favorable Air Situation which is defined as “an air situation in which the extent of the air effort applied by forces enemy air operations is insufficient to undermine the success of friendly land, sea or air operations.”
Air Parity is the lowest level of air control, where neither side has any level of control of the skies and this Ukraine has hardly achieved, especially if it is increasingly closer to where fighting is active.
I agree with most of that you said. But Ukraine did upgrade at least some of their air defenses with more modern electronics and radars. They also have made software which enables them to see the whole air defense sight picture using a regular tablet. Even operators with MANPADS can use this software on their smartphones. So they are not exactly as they were in the Soviet era.
The main issue Ukraine is having is that they are running out of air defense missiles and a lot of their launcher platforms and radars were also destroyed by the Russians. So it's not like they can cover their whole territory like they used to. And the few Western supplied systems aren't enough to cover their whole airspace. There are significant gaps in coverage and the Russian Air Force can exploit them if they want to.
There are a lot of lessons to be drawn from the war, but tech is really not one of them. I agree. The war shows Ukraine is not falling behind due to technology. The fancy things like Khinzal, SU-57 are not the game changer despite resource invested. Things like drones, EW, ISR are where things matters, and difference is not that large between the two. Where Ukraine is losing is on the political side and economic side.
By politically I don't mean things like international good will. I mean its structural influence to military strategy. Russia made a lot of mistakes, but is quick to adapt. Russians are not afraid to change plan, embarass themselves by abandon territory. Not afraid to swap generals. Ukraine on other hand cannot afford to lose face or risking aid cut. Although I would say at this point it is better to lose aid than wasting resources on Krynsky.
Economically lack of ammunition despite under support of collective west is crippling them. End of the day warfare is still about bread and butter like gun and ammo. Those are not that profitable like fancy techs, but they matter the most. The difference is quality of economy type, not quantity of economy like GDP. The EU lawyer that earns 10x of Russian grunt cannot contribute a fraction to the war like the latter.