The War in the Ukraine

Atomicfrog

Major
Registered Member
Also i heard Russian lost an Su-24 on Black Sea. Believed to be Patriot, the aircraft was escorted by Su-30SM's. Unfortunately no real indication of exact location except it's said to be near Snake island.
We didn't see a lot of Su-24 on the Russian side during the war, probably needed some adaptation for these winged bomb and they are back in the fight ?
 

gelgoog

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
Had Prigozhin understood this he could've disappeared from public with all that fame and money, but alas his ego got the better of him and not only did he get himself killed but he also took down Surovikin's career in the process.

Even so, Surovikin being the stronger man, when Russian MOD made he take the fall in the aftermath of the Wagner uprising he took it like a man and faded from public without further stirring up drama.
I think you are over analyzing what happened. Surovikin was clearly suffering from physical burnout with the Wagner affair. You just have to see him at the video he made asking for Wagner to stand down. He was clearly suffering from deprivation of sleep and rest. He was put on mandatory leave and forced to go home to rest. Other people replaced him in command activities but he still has his military rank. So it's not like he was removed from the service altogether.
 

_killuminati_

Senior Member
Registered Member
That's a realistic demand tbh. Aside from occassional Ukrainian sabotage attempt within Russian territory, all things that matter seems to never got hit. It also show that Ukrainian industrial base has been essentially reduced to rubble from what was used to be 50% of Soviet Industry.
If I'm not mistaken, a large part of Ukraine's industrial base was situated in that part of the country that is now under Russian control.
 

HighGround

Senior Member
Registered Member
I think you are over analyzing what happened. Surovikin was clearly suffering from physical burnout with the Wagner affair. You just have to see him at the video he made asking for Wagner to stand down. He was clearly suffering from deprivation of sleep and rest. He was put on mandatory leave and forced to go home to rest. Other people replaced him in command activities but he still has his military rank. So it's not like he was removed from the service altogether.
He's also in charge of air defense now if I remember correctly. Either way, he may return to operational command again at some point so it's a little too early to write him off.

That said, I think @Temstar is correct in his assessment. Surovikin probably has the best track record of any general in this war.
 

Stealthflanker

Senior Member
Registered Member
If I'm not mistaken, a large part of Ukraine's industrial base was situated in that part of the country that is now under Russian control.

No they aren't. Things like Kharkov tank plant, lvov tank plant, Arsenal and Luch design bureau, Radionix, Yangel, Iskra, Motorsich are still within Ukrainian controlled territory as well as Antonov. They are of course got knocked by cruise missiles and Geran but they're still there.

What Russia took so far are Donetsk and Lugansk as well as that landbridge, which provided the raw and refined materials (e.g ex Azovstal plant, this provided steel) and logistics to those industries. If they also intend to take the design bureaus etc.. they have to return to Kharkov and shoot their way until Kiev.
 

gelgoog

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
Iskra (who make radars) and Motor Sich (who make gas turbines) are in Zaporizhzhia which is really close to the front line. And the Kharkov tank plant is right next to the Russian border.

But taking large cities like that would be even harder than taking Mariupol. Zaporizhzhia has like twice the population of Mariupol, and Kharkiv is twice that again. There is also a high chance that most of the staff and a lot of the tooling have already been relocated elsewhere. If they haven't been blown up with Russian cruise missiles strikes already. Still, denying access to these resources might be as important as having them.
 
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