The War in the Ukraine

All the butcher spree of krasnopol, Lancet, KA 52 and the new to SMO "Forpost RU" using guided munition, are under the limelight but there are some events which are completely missing from the news;
New and improved Mariupol under Russia :

Question regarding SEAD, with Russian using waves of UAV/cruise missiles to attack Ukrainian infrastructure, it would be the perfect time to conduct SEAD using Russian HARM equivalent as Ukraine has no choice but to respond.

So far we haven't really seen much evidence of this occuring, but rather any destruction of Ukrainian AD infrastructure is conducted using UAVs and drone corrected artillery.

Why is it so? Any degradation of UA AD network will only make future strikes more effective and actually enable the RuAF to provide much needed CAS on the front lines.

tankphobia said:

Question regarding SEAD, with Russian using waves of UAV/cruise missiles to attack Ukrainian infrastructure, it would be the perfect time to conduct SEAD using Russian HARM equivalent as Ukraine has no choice but to respond.

So far we haven't really seen much evidence of this occuring, but rather any destruction of Ukrainian AD infrastructure is conducted using UAVs and drone corrected artillery.

Why is it so? Any degradation of UA AD network will only make future strikes more effective and actually enable the RuAF to provide much needed CAS on the front lines.

Click to expand...

If UAV are doing the job well, why risking doing SEAD with aircrafts and we don't know if the stockpiles of SEAD missiles is low or depleted. Footage of flankers with SEAD and AA payload are common. SEAD from aircraft don't provide footage... so we cannot say for sure that they are not doing it.

Frontlines are close enough that guided artillery rounds and lancet are adequate for CAS. Drone support and designation is the way they go without big risk of losing equipment that take time or are difficult to replace.

Multiple columns of T-90M heading to Svatovo


One of the russian telegram accounts mentions that around 50 T-90M were sent to the area

Atomicfrog said:

If UAV are doing the job well, why risking doing SEAD with aircrafts and we don't know if the stockpiles of SEAD missiles is low or depleted. Footage of flankers with SEAD and AA payload are common. SEAD from aircraft don't provide footage... so we cannot say for sure that they are not doing it.

Frontlines are close enough that guided artillery rounds and lancet are adequate for CAS. Drone support and designation is the way they go without big risk of losing equipment that take time or are difficult to replace.

Click to expand...

Well, the inability to conduct widescale SEAD/DEAD is the major failure of the Russian Air Force in this war.

According to RUSI, they had some sporadic success, but that was about it:
“Throughout March, Su-35S and Su-30SM fighters continued to conduct CAPs between 30,000 and 50,000 ft, but generally without entering Ukrainian-controlled airspace. Instead, they acted as a deterrent to Ukrainian attack sorties, but were also tasked to conduct SEAD operations. To this end, their CAPs were used as bait to try to make Ukrainian SAM systems turn on their radars to fire at them. If SA-11s or other SAMs did try to engage them, the Flankers would fire Kh-31P and, later, older Kh-58 ARMs at long ranges to home in on the radar emissions, and then turn away.”

sheogorath said:

One of the russian telegram accounts mentions that around 50 T-90M were sent to the area

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thought they're running our of tanks.

I could see maybe the T-90M's will be the new standard before the Armata while others like T-72B3M's will slowly disappear.

tankphobia said:

Question regarding SEAD, with Russian using waves of UAV/cruise missiles to attack Ukrainian infrastructure, it would be the perfect time to conduct SEAD using Russian HARM equivalent as Ukraine has no choice but to respond.

So far we haven't really seen much evidence of this occuring, but rather any destruction of Ukrainian AD infrastructure is conducted using UAVs and drone corrected artillery.

Why is it so? Any degradation of UA AD network will only make future strikes more effective and actually enable the RuAF to provide much needed CAS on the front lines.

Click to expand...

Because Soviet GBAD is working as advertised in their doctrines. Shoot and scoot makes it very difficult to conduct SEAD operations, along with them using frequency agile radars and a whole host of passive detection means. On top of that, these systems have the ability to intercept and shoot down HARM missiles thrown at them. Note that the Russians consistently report kills against AGM-88 HARM missiles used against them, the AGM-88 is a core weapon of SEAD and DEAD. We can assume Buks and S-300s can shoot down Kh-31P HARMs thrown at them.

Hence you need drone assisted munitions that can strike at these systems before they can scoot after they are being lured out by decoys which were in essence the kamekaze drones. The drones provide no choice but to shoot them down or they will destroy infrastructure but also at the cost of your missile worth more than their target.

The way the SAMs are detected as they are sent towards cruise missiles and kamekaze drones, they would be detected by long range AEW aircraft, in which case, the A-20s or Russian AWACS, or even by Penicillin ground stations by detecting and tracking their infrared and optical signatures, then quickly trace to their sources. While a HARM missile requires a turned on radar to home in on it, a loitering drone like a Lancet only needs to rely on the optical image of the target, hence they will continue to track and strike even if the target radars have turned off and gone silent. The same goes with drone assisted artillery whether it's the US Excalibur or the Russian Krasnopol, the drone will continue to target and track the target even if the SAM radars have turned off.

Weird that even with 300K extra manpower, things are still, in Putin's words: "extremely complicated" in the occupied regions. Shouldn't the extra manpower result in a stabilized frontline by now?


This is the first time Zelensky has officially visited a foreign nation since the beginning of the war, he has been video-conferencing into foreign summits since then. Interesting that they allow him to speak to Congress, which means support for Ukraine still has bipartisan consensus. The visit is likely to request for more defense equipment and aid, including Patriot air defense systems and more heavy equipment.

Zichan said:

Well, the inability to conduct widescale SEAD/DEAD is the major failure of the Russian Air Force in this war.

According to RUSI, they had some sporadic success, but that was about it:
“Throughout March, Su-35S and Su-30SM fighters continued to conduct CAPs between 30,000 and 50,000 ft, but generally without entering Ukrainian-controlled airspace. Instead, they acted as a deterrent to Ukrainian attack sorties, but were also tasked to conduct SEAD operations. To this end, their CAPs were used as bait to try to make Ukrainian SAM systems turn on their radars to fire at them. If SA-11s or other SAMs did try to engage them, the Flankers would fire Kh-31P and, later, older Kh-58 ARMs at long ranges to home in on the radar emissions, and then turn away.”

Click to expand...

Shahed 163 is the best SEAD available and has taken out many many platforms and their missile stockpile.

Tam said:

Because Soviet GBAD is working as advertised in their doctrines. Shoot and scoot makes it very difficult to conduct SEAD operations, along with them using frequency agile radars and a whole host of passive detection means. On top of that, these systems have the ability to intercept and shoot down HARM missiles thrown at them. Note that the Russians consistently report kills against AGM-88 HARM missiles used against them, the AGM-88 is a core weapon of SEAD and DEAD. We can assume Buks and S-300s can shoot down Kh-31P HARMs thrown at them.

Hence you need drone assisted munitions that can strike at these systems before they can scoot after they are being lured out by decoys which were in essence the kamekaze drones. The drones provide no choice but to shoot them down or they will destroy infrastructure but also at the cost of your missile worth more than their target.

The way the SAMs are detected as they are sent towards cruise missiles and kamekaze drones, they would be detected by long range AEW aircraft, in which case, the A-20s or Russian AWACS, or even by Penicillin ground stations by detecting and tracking their infrared and optical signatures, then quickly trace to their sources. While a HARM missile requires a turned on radar to home in on it, a loitering drone like a Lancet only needs to rely on the optical image of the target, hence they will continue to track and strike even if the target radars have turned off and gone silent. The same goes with drone assisted artillery whether it's the US Excalibur or the Russian Krasnopol, the drone will continue to target and track the target even if the SAM radars have turned

Click to expand...

Someone correct me if I am mistaken, but my understanding is that many modern ARM's including AGM-88 will continue to home in the last known location of the target if the radar is switched off. In theory, an air defense system could use shoot-and-scoot tactics to evade incoming ARM's, but the high speeds of modern systems like AGM-88 mean that the missile has a very good chance of hitting the target before it has a chance to get clear.