The Q-5, J-7, J-8 and older PLAAF aircraft

Miragedriver

Brigadier
The Mig-21 has been an amazing aircraft. No longer so much in its ability to stay with the modern aircraft in battle. But its history is just amazing.

By far and away the most produced jet fighter in history. Well over 11,000 of them produced in all.

By comparison, the F-16, which (along with the F-4) is the most produced fighter from the west was produced in numbers closer to 5,000.

The Mig-21 has been in operation since 1959, coming up on 55 years. It's fierce competitors back in the day, the F-8 Crusader and then the F-4 Phantom had their own very long histories. All of these aircraft were amazing for their day.

The F-8 (1,200 produced, started service in 1957) went out finally with the French in 2000. The F-4 (also about 5,000 produced, starting service in 1960) is still flying with Greece, South Korea, Turkey and Japan.

Very true! I really like what the Israeli’s did with the F-4 (2000) Terminator. Just digressing for a bit, but how would you see and F-8 and F-4 air-to-air engagement going? F-4 superior in the BVR and the F-8 in the WVR.

I still see the FTC-2000G as a good cheap aircraft for providing flight time for pilots and as an aggressor aircraft to keep the WVR training sharp.
 
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Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
Very true! how would you see and F-8 and F-4 air-to-air engagement going? F-4 superior in the BVR and the F-8 in the WVR.
That's pretty much it.

The F-8 Crusader did not carry a BVR missile. It was a dogfighter...actually a gun fighter with four sidewindes strapped on. But it was good at what it did.

The F-4 Phantom II was made for BVR combat and carried a big load of Sparrows. It could also do other things very well, like ground support. The F-8 could do that too, but not as much ordinance, or as good at it.

Now, the F8U-3 Crusader III which was built to compete with the F-4 when that competition came out (several years after the F-8 Crusader entered service) was better at BVR and dog fighting than the F-4. The Crusader III was a complete rebuild. It was similar to the F-8, but was high supersonic capable (approaching Mach 3), and carried a load of BVR missiles too. But it was also a single engine and a single pilot aircraft and the Navy at the time was completely going to two engines and two pilots. So the F8U-3 lost the competition on those gorunds, but not on performance. Five were built and the three flying aircaft were transferred to NASA for high altitude testing and spent their lifes there.

The NASA F8U-3 pilots flying out of NAS Patuxent River routinely intercepted and defeated U.S. Navy Phantom IIs in mock dogfights during exercises held for the Phantoms. But, some NAval officers complained and the Navy brass worked with the NASA management and put an end to those "engagements."


6340.jpg

Vought_F8U-3_Crusader_III_taxiing_in_1958.jpeg

F8U-3 Crusader III

Here's how the F-8E Crusader and the F8U-3 Crusader III compared:


XF8U-3+Crusader+III+146341+3.jpg

 
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kwaigonegin

Colonel
That's pretty muhc it.

The F-8 Crusader did not carry a BVR missile. It was a dogfighter...actually a gun fighter with four sidewindes strapped on. But it was good at what it did.

The F-4 Phantom II was made for BVR combat and carried a big load of Sparrows. It could also do other things very well, like ground support. The F-8 could do that too, but not as much ordinance, or as good at it.

Now, the F8U-3 Crusader III which was built to compete with the F-4 when that competition came out (several years after the F-8 Crusader entered service) was better at BVR and dog fighting than the F-4. The Crusader III was a complete rebuild. It was similar to the F-8, but was high supersonic capable (approaching Mach 3), and carried a load of BVR missiles too. But it was also a single engine and a single pilot aircraft and the Navy at the time was completely going to two engines and two pilots. So the F8U-3 lost the competition on those gorunds, but not on performance. Five were built and the three flying aircaft were transferred to NASA for high altitude testing and spent their lifes there.

The NASA F8U-3 pilots flying out of NAS Patuxent River routinely intercepted and defeated U.S. Navy Phantom IIs in mock dogfights during exercises held for the Phantoms. But, some NAval officers complained and the Navy brass worked with the NASA management and put an end to those "engagements."


6340.jpg

Vought_F8U-3_Crusader_III_taxiing_in_1958.jpeg

F8U-3 Crusader III

Here's how the F-8E Crusader and the F8U-3 Crusader III compared:


XF8U-3+Crusader+III+146341+3.jpg


Is that DSI on the F8U?
 

Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
Is that DSI on the F8U?
That F8U-3 first flew in 1958. So no, those were not DSI as we understand those intakes today. DSI was first researched as such and developed back in the 1990s. However, clearly Vought was onto design considerations that would allow the F8U-3 to attain and maintain high mach speeds. The F-8E could break the sound barrier, but it was definitely lower mach numbers at the time and did not require the same considerations..
 
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Miragedriver

Brigadier
Carrier "capable" JL-9G with arrestor hook, no rear fins, longer fuselage and reinforced landing gear.
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And they said it was just going to be a paper design.
 
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Jeff Head

General
Registered Member
Carrier "capable" JL-9G with arrestor hook, no rear fins, longer fuselage and reinforced landing gear.
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If the Chinese continue with their naval air arm development and build multiple carriers, they are going to need a naval trainer like the US Navy's T-45, Goshawk.

I am glad to see this and believe the navalized JL-9G could do a good job.
 
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