The Mali situation

navyreco

navyreco

Senior Member
Franklin said:
It's all a matter of perception. You can say that this is not a "war against Islam" and i agree with you that is most likely not. However if you're sitting in the Islamic world then you may see things differently. This is just another in a long list of Muslim nations that has been attacked by either America or one of her allies.
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Check the facts
-Contrary to A'stan, the local population is highly supportive of France's actions.
-The local population is/was being rapped, limbed cut off, stoned to death, its century olds shrines destroyed (as per Sharia law)
-If anyone attacked Mali, it is the Djihadists in the first place a little over 1 year ago. This is NOT an attack on Mali, and the local population sure doesn't feel that way.
 
F

Franklin

Captain
navyreco said:
Check the facts
-Contrary to A'stan, the local population is highly supportive of France's actions.
-The local population is/was being rapped, limbed cut off, stoned to death, its century olds shrines destroyed (as per Sharia law)
-If anyone attacked Mali, it is the Djihadists in the first place a little over 1 year ago. This is NOT an attack on Mali, and the local population sure doesn't feel that way.
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That may well be the case inside Mali but that may not be the perception outside of Mali especially in the Arab and Islamic world. Reality and perceptions can be two very different things. And in Afghanistan and Iraq the populations where initially very supportive of the interventions there, but things in the end turned sour anyway. But i suppose that France is not planning to stay in Mali for 8 to 10 years like the Americans so there maybe a chance of success for the French but we will have to wait and see.
 
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D

delft

Brigadier
solarz said:
I have to disagree with your claim that this intervention is a war against Islam. 90% of the population in Mali is muslim. This is not a fight between the West and Islam, it's a fight between Islamic extremists and Islamic moderates, and the moderates called on French help because they're getting their asses kicked.

However, it's interesting to note that this war would never have happened in the first place if Gaddafi had not been deposed. So in a sense, France is reaping what they sowed.
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I don't say this is a war against Islam. I ask How do you think you can convince the largely Muslim population of West Africa that it is not. You can't say this is in support of Democracy, as it is a war in support of a government that recently appeared from a coup. The West is again supporting a military dictatorship. To that end we call that government "Islamic moderates".
The states in West Africa are being destabilized by Africa Command in Stuttgart so if the result will turn out unfortunate we know who to blame.
 
solarz

solarz

Brigadier
I will say this for France, they're smart to send in the ground troops right away instead of spending weeks on aerial bombings. Aerial bombings inevitably causes civilian casualties, and would quickly use up any good will from the local populace. By sending in ground troops, they can end the fight much more quickly and cleanly.

And the battle has been joined:

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article said:
In Mali street battles are said to have been taking place between French special forces and Islamist militants in the town of Diabali, which fell into rebel hands on Monday.

Reports say French troop reinforcements have been arriving in the zone where jihadist groups are active.

French and Malian soldiers have been heading north from Bamako, the African country’s capital, as the ground operation gets underway.

On Tuesday hundreds of troops headed north from Niono. Diabali, 50 kilometres away, was bombarded several times by the French air force.

But witnesses say militants are still there.

“We’re in a better position than last week but the combat continues and it will be long, let’s be honest, the goal is to make sure that Mali regains all of its territory’s sovereignty,” said the French Defence Minister Jean-Yves Le Drian.

In Bamako there is a sense of relief at the French intervention.

“I am happy, very happy about the arrival of the French, for the freedom of the Malian people. There you are. We want the unity of our country and a Republican state and throw out once and for all the terrorists and narco-traffickers,” said resident Oumar Camara.

President Hollande has said the aim is to “destroy the terrorists”.

The number of French troops in the country is set to treble, before a West African force becomes operational.

Army chiefs from the West African force are meeting in Bamako to fine-tune the operation, being launched under a UN mandate.
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TerraN_EmpirE

TerraN_EmpirE

Tyrant King
The states in West Africa are being destabilized by Africa Command in Stuttgart so if the result will turn out unfortunate we know who to blame.
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Blaming the US already? I can only assume that as United States Africa Command is Based in Stuttgard If your going too might as well just get it over with and say Washington and get it over with Despite the Fact that once again "Leading form behind" is the buzz of the Obama White house and this is a french- Euro- Nato Action.
 
cn_habs

cn_habs

Junior Member
Since hundreds of ground troops are involved, how many more casualties will the French public accept as the conflict drags on? If they were to make a fundamental change then then'd have to station there for quite a few years.

Western Africa is such a mess that I doubt this joint military intervention will be able to change anything. Either way, French citizens will be targeted more often in the future. Africa is ...well Africa.
 
navyreco

navyreco

Senior Member
ba7e.jpg


A French soldier stands on top of a tank at a Malian air base in Bamako, January 15, 2013. France hit Islamist rebels in Mali with fresh air strikes and deployed armored cars on Tuesday, stepping up its intervention in the West African state as regional allies struggled to accelerate their plans to send in troops. *******/Joe Penney
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ba8y.jpg


French soldiers arrange equipment in a tank at a Malian air base in Bamako January 15, 2013. The French army sent some 50 armoured vehicles to Mali from their military base in Ivory Coast, which arrived late Monday night. France hit Islamist rebels in Mali with fresh air strikes and deployed armoured cars on Tuesday, stepping up its intervention in the West African state as regional allies struggled to accelerate their plans to send in troops. *******/Joe Penney
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ba11p.jpg


A French soldier refuels an Armoured Personnel Carrier at a Malian air base in Bamako January 15, 2013. The French army sent some 50 armoured vehicles to Mali from their military base in Ivory Coast, which arrived late Monday night. France hit Islamist rebels in Mali with fresh air strikes and deployed armoured cars on Tuesday, stepping up its intervention in the West African state as regional allies struggled to accelerate their plans to send in troops. *******/Joe Penney
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ba9j.jpg

French soldiers walk past armored vehicles at a Malian air base in Bamako, January 15, 2013. France hit Islamist rebels in Mali with fresh air strikes and deployed armoured cars on Tuesday, stepping up its intervention in the West African state as regional allies struggled to accelerate their plans to send in troops. *******/Joe Penney
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solarz

solarz

Brigadier
Huh, those so-called "tanks" and "APCs" are really small! They don't even have tracks and use tires instead. Can anyone tell me what those really are?
 
Subedei

Subedei

Banned Idiot
seems, to me, that the french are starting off on the wrong foot already!

they could surely benefit from a presentation of my doctrine of tactical convergence.

long range airstrikes carried out by supersonic fb's may have been a useful tactic of expedience, but they were not effective and will certainly not be the most effective tactic against this particular force. those eurocopters will, however, certainly provide the quality of air support necessary, and it wouldn't hurt to try to get some brazilian super tucanos on loan, either.

additionally, what assets do the "islamists" possess that necessitate the use of vehicles armed with 90mm cannon? they would be much more effective if armed with miniguns or heavy machine guns. this is essentially an anti-personnel campaign. why bog down with unnecessarily heavy equipment?

the french also remind me of the us, early in the 1st gulf war, here, with their forest camouflage uniforms and vehicles.

imho, this is a situation in which france should use light mobile and air mobile (heliborne) infantry combined with helicopters and light aircraft for cas. for the latter, their only candidate is their alpha jet trainer. that's why i suggested a loan of super tucanos. i think this approach would be most effective and least expensive.
 
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