The Chinese Cruiser, forget the carrier...

Raven said:

if the PLAN wants a real Blue Water, good at sea support ships are a must. Underway replishment is also part of it. Heavy and Medium lift helicopters are also a big part.

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Amen, well said. And therfore the PLAN will also require the ability (meaning enough good combatants) to protect that logistics part as well. The movement and missions of the fleet can be successfuly interdicted by destroying the logistics trail as well.

that PINR report is obviously written by someone not well versed in this field. Let's see, the "cruiser" is actually a destroyer, the type 051C if you will. HQ-9's performance is unknown, but let's not talk about that. China has had VDS for quite a while now, starting with the Luhu series, which employed the French DUXX-5(?) VDS set.

i think china is goin in2 da rite direction rite now in investing more in submarines.....its suits them better 4 da time being.....i mean if china really wanted a carrier..dey obviosuly hav da money and capability 2 build one rite now...but if china got a carrier now..it be a sitting duck

In short, a carrier has endurance that no surface warfare ship can hope to match

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Amen. As a former Avation oradnceman I can tell you with 100% certanity that a USN CV carries enough ammo to conduct airstrikes 24 hours a day for 3-5 days depending on the mission. After that time the ship would re-arm. You can't beat that firepower.

You mean like the Arsenal SHip, US Navy got rid of that idea because it was not cost effective

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True. But the idea has been revived with the conversion of Ohio class SSBN. Converting them to an SSGN. They can carry 132 missiles.

an arsenal ship...the russians dont have the money...but the chinese do. theyu can pay the russians 2 billion to build an arsenal ship.

MIGleader said:

an arsenal ship...the russians dont have the money...but the chinese do. theyu can pay the russians 2 billion to build an arsenal ship.

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MIGleader. .you always have some sort of answer..no matter how outrageous it may be.

News flash MIGleader..the USN will have 4 subs like the Ohio. The Ohio is due to be fully operational by the end of this year. It's not a dream..it's not on the end some kids drawing pencil or a dream on someones computer. It's real...So are USN CV's. They are real. Manned by real sailors that are trained to do their jobs. It's real. Quit dreaming and tell me this..

MIGleader answer us all this question..besides a nuke missile or a nuke tipped torpedo ..How would the PLAN sink a CVN? Please let me know.

I will check for an answer later. I have to go to work...

well, i never really meant for the plan to go for any kind of arsenal ship it think they are a wate of money.

how does the plan sink a cvbg?
it will be tough. i dont think they can even do it rgight now, looking how well defende a cvbg is. so how...well it needs an unorthodox tactics. perhaps build a few of the new facs...and let the shoot at the cvbg.
other option...shoot all missles pointed at taiwan at the cvbg. even if aegis manges a 100% shoot down rate, there still are too many missles.
subs...the klub and new yj-8's look lethal. attck from all angles not one.
the backfire...designed to kill carrier groups. load them up with standoff missles.

such a venture is costly and risky, but if the chinese put their mind to it, the cvbg will go down. im sure the chinese would never go so far though.

MIGleader said:

well, i never really meant for the plan to go for any kind of arsenal ship it think they are a wate of money.

how does the plan sink a cvbg?
it will be tough. i dont think they can even do it rgight now, looking how well defende a cvbg is. so how...well it needs an unorthodox tactics. perhaps build a few of the new facs...and let the shoot at the cvbg.
other option...shoot all missles pointed at taiwan at the cvbg. even if aegis manges a 100% shoot down rate, there still are too many missles.
subs...the klub and new yj-8's look lethal. attck from all angles not one.
the backfire...designed to kill carrier groups. load them up with standoff missles.

such a venture is costly and risky, but if the chinese put their mind to it, the cvbg will go down. im sure the chinese would never go so far though.

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Thank you for the answer. Personally I think we all realize that some missiles would get through. But sink a USN CV? Nope..damage it? Yes..Severly? Maybe.

The best shot the PLAN has right now of sinking a CV is using desiel subs. You know I always mention my son. He is an instructor of advanced USN sonar technics & equipment/systems at the ASW base in San Diego CA. I sent him an email and asked him why desiel subs are hard to track and was there any nuke sub the USN could not find...This is his answer. Nothing here is classified information. Please don't ask me to obtain any more info. I will not. He can't tell me the good stuff anyway.

<<""STG2 Fleet Anti-Submarine Warfare Training Center)" @navy.mil>
Hi dad.
I can answer your questions. diesel boats are hard to track because when submerged they're running on batteries. no moving parts in batteries so they don't make any noise. nucs have turbines, so there are a lot of moving parts associated with that. all those parts need systems in place to reduce the noise. those systems don't always work and when they fail we can see them. all of the nuc subs that are out there have their problems except for the U.S of course. so in comparison to a submerged diesel there are no nucs that I know of that would be harder to track.

i hope this helps"">>>>

In addition..he has more than once told me no one makes a sub as quiet as a LA class. No one....not on planet Earth..

hey popey just wondering, if there was an reactor leak on a carrier, and it's be on repair, would the admiral force all to abandon ship and get all teh planes off? how long do you think that would take adn would they destory it or wait for a towage ship to come?
well we are forgeting one thing for the PLAN invasion... WEATHER!!! a powerful enough typhoon it stronger than the whole PLAN fleet and can halt or stop any carrier on its track; if i were PLAN i would look for the worst possible weather to attack, they have coverage on mainland, while missiles rain down on ROC... then when the sky is clear land the troops

-Air Force aircraft are cheaper,usually faster and are made in larger numbers.

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Tell me how they would operate in the middle of the ocean.

-SSM and ASM missiles are clear threats to CVSG/CVBGs.

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They are a threat to any surface vessel. The carrier is simply a platform of SSMs and ASMs. The strike aircraft of a carrier can carry SSMs and ASMs. This greatly increases the range of the strike packages of the USN farther than any russian or chinese missile.

Submarines are very dangerous opponents for CVs.

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They are dangerous for any surface vessel however thats why CVs are protected by a ASW shield. It is near impossible of a submarine to penetrate USN SSNs and the USN ASW.

-Naval aircraft, while very effective are serving in very small numbers.

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The US naval airwing is argueably the 2nd most powerful airwing in the world. Second to only the USAF.