South East Asia Military News, Reports, Data, etc.

cn_habs

Junior Member
Re: ASEAN military news

"These frigates are warships. These have anti-air, sub-surface, they have anti-submarine (capabilities). What we are getting are really meant for war," Gazmin said."

As clear an attempt at saber wrattling as you are ever likely to see in modern politics. Although I somehow doubt anyone in the western press will pick up on it.

$275m for two obselete frigates nearing the end of their useful lives seems like a pretty bad deal for the Philippines tbh. You really must wonder how many years these FFGs have got left in them. The F22Ps China sold to Pakistan in contrast cost $175m each, and that's including fully TOT to allow local production of the ships.

No offence intended, but you really have to wonder just what exactly the Philippines government is playing at with such antics. Paying through the nose for antiquated ships that are of no threat to anyone yet making empty threats about getting these ships for war.

Are they gearing for elections or hiding some local scandal? Overpaying for others' outdated hardware might even have repercussions on its economy. ;)
 

no_name

Colonel
Re: ASEAN military news

No offence intended, but you really have to wonder just what exactly the Philippines government is playing at with such antics. Paying through the nose for antiquated ships that are of no threat to anyone yet making empty threats about getting these ships for war.

The officials gets money for the purchase, and they even made it look like the purchase is needed and desired. There is no better deal than this.

I've mentioned before that in the event of a conflict the people in power is not going to be affected unless there was a regime change which is unlikely. Hell did Marcos ever lost his wealth?
 

clone7803

New Member
Re: ASEAN military news

The Philipino armed force is the most obselete and weakest one in the ASEAN countries,there's no one of.And it seemed the Philipino armed force had a special interst in collecting the old and museum class junk weapons all over the world.
 

joshuatree

Captain
Re: ASEAN military news

Congrats to the Philippines in working towards rebuilding her navy. Putting aside the disputes, its good to see a nation take on the role of self defense itself.

Now on the analysis of the deal, I'm not so sure the ships are the right choice. Clearly, the main priority for PI is in the SCS, don't think Palau is really jostling with the PI in the Philippine Sea. So at 3100 tons and 122.7 m, not as flexible in the SCS. Remember, frigate 560 ran aground and she is only half the displacement. Second, it's already a 30 year old ship that underwent little refurb. The proposed purchase will include refurb but will that mean newer weapons systems?

For the price per ship, PI should have looked into procuring new corvettes instead such as the Baynunah class. About the same price per ship based on the UAE deal. Even if it costs a little more, you're getting a new ship with modern weapons systems. But I feel their internal domestic pressure for some sort of action had a lot to do with it.
 

delft

Brigadier
Re: ASEAN military news

It looks like a good deal for Italy, which is in dire straits financially, even if there is a considerable kick back. Not only does it gets money, but it also won't have to pay for the upkeep and manning of these ships in future.
 

plawolf

Lieutenant General
Re: ASEAN military news

It looks like far far too good a deal for Italy. Either the Philippines have some truely exceptionally bad negotiators, or not everything is above board with this deal.

There is simply no logical reason to be paying new built kind of prices for 30 year old ships the Italians were probably thinking about scrapping before this deal. With the Italians in the financial troubles they are in, it really should have been the Philippines holding them over a barrel and making a killer deal to take those ships off of Italy's hands for a very modest price.

A decent negotiator might even have gotten the ships for free with only the Philippines paying for the refurb with the added sweetener that the Philippines would buy $275m of Italian government debt at reasonable rates.

The Philippines got seriously short changed by this deal and If I was Philippino, I would be demanding to full inquiry to find out just how the hell they got ripped off so badly.
 

Geographer

Junior Member
Re: ASEAN military news

This is a good op-ed from an Australian editor about the gray issues in the Spratly Islands dispute. American and Filipino right-wingers want to portray the issue as "big bad bully Communist China vs. poor innocent democratic Philippines" but forget about Taiwan's involvement.

Hamish McDonald writes:
When a fishing boat packed with sign-waving young Chinese activists arrived on July 4 at a disputed island group south of Japan, escorted by five white-painted coast guard and fishery patrol ships, it touched off an instinctive reaction by hawkish American and allied commentators.

Here again was the rising power of communist China flexing its maritime muscles against its neighbours in the pursuit of a wider band of potentially oil-rich zones in adjacent waters, in this case around the islands called the Senkaku group by the occupying Japanese and the Diaoyutai by the Chinese.

It turned out, however, that the activists and the escorting patrol boats came from Taiwan, the island domain of the vestigial Republic of China, protected by the same US Seventh Fleet whose freedom of movement and control in the western Pacific the communist mainland is seen to be set on challenging.
....
The Chinese republicans claim as much territory as their communist rivals. ''From the perspective of history, geography and international law, the Nansha [Spratly] Islands, as well as the Xisha [Paracel], Zhongsha [Macclesfield Bank] and Dongsha [Pratas] island groups and their surrounding waters are all undoubtedly an inherent part of ROC territory,'' the Taiwanese Foreign Affairs Ministry said this week.

Far from being a simple picture of a big, aggressive power trying to overawe its small and weak neighbours, resisting their efforts to form a united front so it can pick them off one by one, the maritime disputes of south-east and east Asia are a tangle of claims, in which American allies and protectorates are pitched against each other, as well as China. [my emphasis]
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ManilaBoy45

Junior Member
Re: ASEAN military news

PN Rescues Malaysian and Indonesian Sailors ...

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The Philippine naval forces announced that they have rescued a total of 12 sailors, all of them hailing from Asian nations near the southern island of Mindanao.
At the time of rescue, the sailors were precariously clinging on to two rubber rafts, after being thrown out of the cargo vessels in which they were travelling. There is no information about what happened to the hijacked vessels. The Philippine Navy has already launched an investigation in to the incident.

According to the Philippine authorities, the crew were travelling in two cargo vessels, which took off from the Malaysian state of Sarawak. Officials said that the pirate attack occurred somewhere along the South China Sea. There has been a recent surge in the incidence of piracy in the region, although previously only the Strait of Malacca and the Strait of Singapore regions were considered as prone for pirate attacks.
 

jackliu

Banned Idiot
Re: ASEAN military news

It looks like far far too good a deal for Italy. Either the Philippines have some truely exceptionally bad negotiators, or not everything is above board with this deal.

There is simply no logical reason to be paying new built kind of prices for 30 year old ships the Italians were probably thinking about scrapping before this deal. With the Italians in the financial troubles they are in, it really should have been the Philippines holding them over a barrel and making a killer deal to take those ships off of Italy's hands for a very modest price.

A decent negotiator might even have gotten the ships for free with only the Philippines paying for the refurb with the added sweetener that the Philippines would buy $275m of Italian government debt at reasonable rates.

The Philippines got seriously short changed by this deal and If I was Philippino, I would be demanding to full inquiry to find out just how the hell they got ripped off so badly.

Who said Philippine got short changed? I can bet you whatever you want that out of those 275m went to Italy, more than a few of those million goes right back into the pocket of some Filipino politician/generals. So for them, business as usual. Personal interest > National interest.

It has always been like this in the past, and it will always be like this in the future.
 

plawolf

Lieutenant General
Re: ASEAN military news

Who said Philippine got short changed? I can bet you whatever you want that out of those 275m went to Italy, more than a few of those million goes right back into the pocket of some Filipino politician/generals. So for them, business as usual. Personal interest > National interest.

It has always been like this in the past, and it will always be like this in the future.

I was referring to the Philippines as a whole, which did get short changed badly if their leaders made a bad deal to waste hundreds of millions of dollars of taxpayer money so that they could get a few million in kick backs.
 
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