Shenyang FC-31 / J-31 Fighter Demonstrator

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mr.bean

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anyway we look at this it shouldn't take that long to make a 2nd prototype and yet all this time we haven't seen it. it looks like a desperate attempt by SAC to ''show something'' about J-31 that they put some video clip of a not finished 2nd prototype. it just further proves J-31 is a dead project.

but even if it's dead it's still a mile better than what japan has done so far for their supposedly stealth fighter!
 
SinoSoldier

SinoSoldier

Colonel
Bltizo said:
There are quite a few differences between the two situations.
But one of the biggest, is that with the Q-5 is that there was a stated need by the Chinese military itself for such an aircraft of that role, and the Q-5 was developed to fulfill that requirement.

OTOH, as far as we know the Chinese military doesn't have any sort of requirement for a medium weight stealth fighter like that of FC-31, otherwise they would've funded the development of FC-31 from prototype 31001 before it even flew.
So essentially SAC are trying to put out this aircraft to try and make it compelling enough for the military to buy it. The massive problem is that these are expensive, complicated stealth fighters, and for the Air Force or even Navy to commit to such an aircraft would have massive repurcussions for their future force structure as well. These are not male drones, pgms or some other weapons system that can be developed in house by a company without a military's stated requirement but still find a role in a military later on.


So frankly I consider SAC's attempts of trying to push FC-31 onto the Chinese military to be naive, unrealistic and bordering on arrogant.
If the military doesn't have a requirement for a medium weight stealth fighter then SAC are simply living on a prayer.

I'm also unsure as to why you expectant about the FC-31 -- this is a project where at this stage we realistically should expect little to nothing to come out of it. The most likely result is they can use their two FC-31 airframes as testbeds for various technologies, and use experience from development of FC-31 to inform their future stealth aircraft projects whether they be UCAVs, or hypothetical 6th generation aircraft or whatever.
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You make a fair point regarding the initial decision to fund the development of a medium-weight 5th generation fighter.

However, beyond that fact, there is little to gauge what the PLAAF/PLANAF really thinks of the merits of that fighter niche. Moreover, I'd argue that the FC-31 would nicely serve as a replacement for existing fighters that would retire in the coming years.

Lastly, there is also the argument that the FC-31 could bring certainly capabilities not offered by the J-20. The point of my post is that although the PLAAF/NAF have not explicitly or proactively expressed interest; future requirements for a FC-31-esque aircraft may not be off the table.
 
Blitzo

Blitzo

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SinoSoldier said:
You make a fair point regarding the initial decision to fund the development of a medium-weight 5th generation fighter.

However, beyond that fact, there is little to gauge what the PLAAF/PLANAF really thinks of the merits of that fighter niche. Moreover, I'd argue that the FC-31 would nicely serve as a replacement for existing fighters that would retire in the coming years.

Lastly, there is also the argument that the FC-31 could bring certainly capabilities not offered by the J-20. The point of my post is that although the PLAAF/NAF have not explicitly or proactively expressed interest; future requirements for a FC-31-esque aircraft may not be off the table.
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I agree that there might be a possibility for the Air Force or Navy being interested in FC-31 if either of them eventually have a requirement for a medium weight stealth fighter in the foreseeable future.

But that window is closing with year by year, and in the end, the continual silence of Air Force or Navy interest or commiting to FC-31 in any form means (at that time) we would have no reason to expect FC-31 to become any sort of serviceable or finished product.



So by all means we can follow the FC-31 with interest as a project, but unless the Air Force or Navy expresses interest and commits to it, then we have no reason to consider the project as having any sort of meaningful consequence for the Chinese military's future fighter force.
 
SinoSoldier

SinoSoldier

Colonel
Bltizo said:
But that window is closing with year by year, and in the end, the continual silence of Air Force or Navy interest or commiting to FC-31 in any form means (at that time) we would have no reason to expect FC-31 to become any sort of serviceable or finished product.
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That would be true if there were no prospects of a second (and most importantly, upgraded) FC-31 prototype, but with the appearance of a "full" variant, the FC-31 could easily become a first-line option if the PLAAF/NAF required such a fighter in the future. At this point, I think both you and I agree that the hurdle is the military's requirement for a fighter of its class in the first place, or the lack thereof.
 
Blitzo

Blitzo

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SinoSoldier said:
That would be true if there were no prospects of a second (and most importantly, upgraded) FC-31 prototype, but with the appearance of a "full" variant, the FC-31 could easily become a first-line option if the PLAAF/NAF required such a fighter in the future. At this point, I think both you and I agree that the hurdle is the military's requirement for a fighter of its class in the first place, or the lack thereof.
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Bold and underlined part is the key word here.

Simply put, without funding and committal by a state military we have no reason to hope or expect anything meaningful out of this project.
The presence of a second prototype doesn't really mean that much; it just means SAC and AVIC are hoping this thing will elicit some interest.
 
Air Force Brat

Air Force Brat

Brigadier
Super Moderator
SinoSoldier said:
It has been reported that the FC-31 booth was quite popular at this Zhuhai Airshow, with lines being formed just so delegates can get information about this aircraft.

Among those present were officials from the Royal Saudi Air Force and Pakistani Air Force.

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There ya go SinoSoldier, and that's just as I stated, no pilot is going to walk by that booth and turn his nose up at it?? not gonna happen, its a very pretty airplane, and flew very well in its first version, and the -2 will likely fly better....

We don't know whats up with AVIC, but the fact that the -1 flew is proof enough that it is a legitimate "proof of concept". I'd suggest folks lighten up, and as Jeff Head says, time will tell.
 
Engineer

Engineer

Major
Bltizo said:
So frankly I consider SAC's attempts of trying to push FC-31 onto the Chinese military to be naive, unrealistic and bordering on arrogant.
If the military doesn't have a requirement for a medium weight stealth fighter then SAC are simply living on a prayer.
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SAC's idea isn't to push medium weight stealth fighter to the military. SAC's aim is to get interests from the military first, then build a heavy weight stealth fighter powered by WS-15.

The size of the current FC-31 probably has more to do with the engines available to build a technology demonstrator. It is doubtful that high-power engines can be circulated outside of non-military sponsored projects.
 
Air Force Brat

Air Force Brat

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Engineer said:
SAC's idea isn't to push medium weight stealth fighter to the military. SAC's aim is to get interests from the military first, then build a heavy weight stealth fighter powered by WS-15.

The size of the current FC-31 probably has more to do with the engines available to build a technology demonstrator. It is doubtful that high-power engines can be circulated outside of non-military sponsored projects.
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That's right, and if you build a Flanker sized FC-31 powered by the WS-15, lots of folks would be interested in a stealthy, healthy performance aircraft...

even the WS-13 in the present sized aircraft would be a winner!

but the Engineer is onto something here, if SAC were building a stealthy Flanker class capable aircraft there would be a market for a 5th gen Flanker.
 
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