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ChineseToTheBone

New Member
Registered Member
No way ! S-70 got shotdown by Su057 because it have gone haywire over Ukraine !

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Coupled with the video footages going around from Kostyantynivka, does this actually mean Russia previously had their newest generation fighter jet and stealth drone intrude Ukrainian airspace multiple times already without being intercepted?
If so that would be very impressive given the breadth of air defense missiles and radars Ukraine has at its disposal from various suppliers.
 

Gloire_bb

Captain
Registered Member
Su-35 PESA is not much worse than most AESA. It all depends on the power generation.
Power generation is the key.

Su-35s was always meant for a very specific role first and foremost: stopgap 5th gen counter in DEF-CA situation - because US stealth proliferation was a thing (2010s f-22 problem...as was seen back then), and there was a good market niche for countries trying to defend against them.
Originally it was meant to be just a stopgap until su-57(which was meant to be delivered in 2015), but since it got massively delayed - stopgap became even more vital.

Su-35 is a very capable normal gen 4+ MRF of course, but that's secondary - there are better fighters and even flankers for that.
5th gen stopgap defense is how Sukhoi positioned su-35s to PLAAF(remember - it began as an export fighter! Arguably PLAAF is the only force where it went as planned, a safeguard), it's how it managed to get VKS orders (again, it wasn't the original plan, VKS paid from it's own pocket for su-27sm-123 because su-57 will come tomorrow...yeah, smart, I know); it's how it was sold to Iran.

For that specific role it really needed one specific spec - to get fire solution against stealthy opponent at competitive BVR ranges, I.e. to narrow-beam extreme amounts of energy and bruteforce stable return. On 2000/2010s technology, powerful PESA is better at it than AESA, simple as that; without making a whole radar and fcs from a blank sheet, AESA advantages aren't worth the investment.

Heck, even now, a decade later in this specific metric, N035 is probably the most capable fighter radar out there. Certainly more powerful (and at much wider range of angles!) than, say, N036.

Everything else (like extreme track range against 1...3m2 targets) is a neat bonus, ensuring that Su-35 isn't just a single trick pony.
 
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gelgoog

Lieutenant General
Registered Member
Originally it was meant to be just a stopgap until su-57(which was meant to be delivered in 2015), but since it got massively delayed - stopgap became even more vital.
The Su-57 took a perfectly normal amount of time to develop. It took 10 years from flight of first T-50 prototype to introduction into service. Compare this with the F-22 which took 15 years from YF-22 flight to introduction into service.

And yet people keep harping on this nonsense.

Su-35 is a very capable normal gen 4+ MRF of course, but that's secondary - there are better fighters and even flankers for that.
5th gen stopgap defense is how Sukhoi positioned su-35s to PLAAF(remember - it began as an export fighter! Arguably PLAAF is the only force where it went as planned, a safeguard), it's how it managed to get VKS orders (again, it wasn't the original plan, VKS paid from it's own pocket for su-27sm-123 because su-57 will come tomorrow...yeah, smart, I know); it's how it was sold to Iran.
That is also false. The Su-35 was designed for the RuAF. Much like the Su-30 with Bars radar was originally designed for the RuAF. The fact that it was mostly developed with money from fighter exports is kind of tangential to the fact.

As for the Su-27SM series it is pretty simple. They had a lot of extra airframes and components left over, plus production facilities geared up to make the Flanker, that is why it was produced. The regular Flanker no longer met RuAF requirements so it got modernized with new cockpit, avionics, and sensors.
 
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pmc

Major
Registered Member
It would have fell in wrong hands if the SU-57 would have not been there...
S-70 seems like range extender for Su-57 to get closer to target but decision is still with Su-57 pilot.
Also UAVs will be tracking where Ukranian takes the parts. they may have deliberately waiting for it.
In Syria Russians will give stuff to Syrians. they will lose it and than days later who ever playing in routes it got bombed.
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An informed source told Sputnik that small drones have been designed to be loaded onto the Russian fifth-generation Su-57
fighter, which will add unparalleled features to the Russian fighter.
The source noted that these small drones, dozens of which will be launched by the Su-57, allow the fighter to penetrate the enemy's air defenses - either by overloading its information channels (surveillance - radar) or by a concentrated strike on its systems, either by drones or by destruction
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Pride of Russian industry in the grip of the Syrian opposition​

 

Gloire_bb

Captain
Registered Member
S-70 seems like range extender for Su-57 to get closer to target but decision is still with Su-57 pilot.
Also UAVs will be tracking where Ukranian takes the parts. they may have deliberately waiting for it.
In Syria Russians will give stuff to Syrians. they will lose it and than days later who ever playing in routes it got bombed.
S-70 is a bit too pricey to be a flying pylon.
It's a LW, sure, but it's an independent strike drone (not that much cheaper than su-34 btw) in it's own right.
 

Stealthflanker

Senior Member
Registered Member
It needs to be built in numbers first. Comparison with Su-34 is clearly hard as it's already in serial production and have some 100++ airframes. Thus it naturally have lower cost as there is already learning curve/production cost curve in effect.

Being a "bomb/missile" truck however is actual role S-70 can embark, pretty much like everyone else's Loyal wingman program
 
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