Russia Vs Georgia..a widening crisis!

Re: Georgia Attacks South Ossetia, War With Russia Looms

The planes could have been flying low and delivering dumb bombs, thus AAA or Shorter range missiles then SA-11 could have been effective in destroying the one and certainly damaging the other two. All speculative at this point.

Seperately. How long do you Russia will need to fully mobilise the army? I expect another week or two to bring full might of their military.

Re: Georgia Attacks South Ossetia, War With Russia Looms

It is a violation of international law but the picture is of an empty (and very bloody) flight helmet, not of a corpse. Very nasty looking pictures coming out of South Ossetia and Georgia though but it looks like escalation will just continue, especially if the VDV are deployed

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There is a video capture of a Russian pilot. The body is right next to the helmet. See that elbow?? I won't display that photo. But here's a link.

WARNING!! GRAPHIC IMAGE IN THE LINK BELOW!!

Re: Georgia Attacks South Ossetia, War With Russia Looms

One that I have whished to see (thougth not yet been able) is some sort of force stats or order of battles to tell what sort of forces have Russia deployed.

The bits and pieces I have managed to gather is that there is 150 armoured vehicless crossed the border...wich sounds like reinforced tank regiment or a brigade (Im aware that russia has some brigade formations but Im not familar of their organisation)
If there is indeed only few regiments, perhaps a division figthing in South Ossetia, it takes the whole situation into new ligth. Appears that its more close to what Russian side claims, a policing operation to restore the South Ossetian situation and not some annexation of Georgia by some evil empire's mystic dark deeds.
Thougth it puts the whole Russian cognigent into hazarious situation if Saakashvili manages to muster all of his forces to push them back.
Also, our news showed images of Russian VDV loading into cargo planes, wich was rather expected move, knowing the use of desants in these sort of proxy wars

Russian consripts are telling reporters that they are having to move every hour as Georgian Art his hitting them.

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Well it would be more alarming if he would have told that they are just standing while shells pour into their heads
I mean that what modern ground war is, scooping away from artillery fire, redeploy and then scoop away again...it was what we did back on my army days and we were the bloody artillery

But Utelore asked about what Georgians can do with their artillery....
well win the war if they can use it correctly. Thougth I dont know what they have and more importantly, how they use it, but as this war seems to focus on land fighting, artillery - naturally as the king of the battle field - comes as decisseve element over which side will win.

Re: Georgia Attacks South Ossetia, War With Russia Looms

I think at this time we can pretty safely say that Gori is still in Georgian hands and so are it's vital bridges.

Re: Georgia Attacks South Ossetia, War With Russia Looms

There are about 150 Armoured vehicles plus some Paratroopers reported to have entered South Ossetia. What you say is probably true Goli, but may only mean that Russia intends to send in other units on a much wider front. There do appear to be Russian forces in Abkhazia, plus Naval movements by the Black Sea Fleet.

After all, if you have a numerical advantage you might as well use it.

Hi Norfolk

No doubt about it that Putin will be the better operations man for a military operation.

My point on Medvedev is that he didn't exactly flinch from making the call when the Georgians attacked. The other part is that the papers treat him as though he was just some sap of a policy wonk who just does what Putin tells him. None of them ever mention that his main job from 2000 to May 08 was as the President of Gazprom and responsible for increasing its Capitalisation in that time by some 40 times!! He is nobodies cipher and certainly no nobody!

Re: Georgia Attacks South Ossetia, War With Russia Looms

SampanViking said:

My point on Medvedev is that he didn't exactly flinch from making the call when the Georgians attacked.

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Probably because the Kremlin under Putin was doing its best to create an excuse to walk over the border - Medv was just continuing that policy.

And who knows - maybe he got the call from Putin, his real master, to tell him to do exactly what he has been doing.

Re: Georgia Attacks South Ossetia, War With Russia Looms

So far the only Russian formations publicly confirmed to be in South Ossetia or Georgia are a Brigade from the 58th Army (probably a Brigade Tactical Group with perhaps a Tank Battalion, 3 Motor-Rifle Battalions, a Reconnaissance Battalion, and Brigade Troops), which is the Army that normally garrisons the Caucasus, and elements of the 76th Air Assault Division (composed of two Airborne Regiments plus Divisional Troops) from P'skov, plus SF. We'll see what else shows up.

Re: Georgia Attacks South Ossetia, War With Russia Looms

crazyinsane105 said:

Yes, they have SA-11s which are more than capable of bringing down Backfires.

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Well according to some sources the Russian military are acknowledging this to be true. I'm just surprised that a Russian bomber can be shot down by a Russian SAM system. Surely it's easier to protect your own assets from weapons systems that you've made and know inside out than those made by a hostile state. Surely the Russians would have foreseen that they'd be sending Backfires against countries like Georgia that have a lot of ex-Soviet hardware and planned accordingly?

Putin is accusing Georgia of "genocide" in South Ossetia, That's ominous, whatever the situation on the ground that sounds like the gloves being taken off.

Re: Georgia Attacks South Ossetia, War With Russia Looms

The Georgian's appear to be giving the Russians a bloodynose.

How long can they hold out though? A week? Two weeks?

I'm having a terrible time getting news on the situation in the USA.

Is there better coverage of this in Asia or Europe?

I'm loving all of the fairly informed comments in on this forum, if you guys have news or know about the battle tactics of the Russians, please speak! I know there are several guys on this forum that were in the military in the 80's, they probably have the best insight into how Russian ground forces work.

Re: Georgia Attacks South Ossetia, War With Russia Looms

Mr T said:

As I explained, they're too different situations - by "responding" you were attempting to compare regardless of what you say.

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Very convenient of you to quote half of my post and ignore the other half. What part of 'Im not comparing' is so hard for you to understand?

Russia has to sell to someone, so it cannot say "take these unreasonable terms or you get nothing". It's economy is supported by energy sales. Even China could not take on all of Europe's consumption, and if it did it would screw Russia over prices because it would be in the stronger position.

Then there are the pipelines that Russia wants to buy. If it was difficult before to do that it would be impossible if it occupied Georgia.

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Europe has to get gas from somewhere, majority of it from Russia, so too it cannot not give the Russians the prices they want.
So if Russia gains control of Caucuses region, they will control almost all land gas routes into Europe...needless to say that is a extremely powerful position to be in at negotiation tables.