PLAN Carrier Strike Group and Airwing

Re: Latest Varyag Pics

crazyinsane105 said:

China has too few advanced escorts to protect the Varyag.

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I have to disagree with this portion of your statement.

With a couple of type 093 SSNs, a couple of Type 52Cs (or one Type 052C and one Type 051C), one Type 52B, one Project 956 Sov, and a couple of the Ma'anshan frigates, they have a credible carrier battle group. The only thing lacking is the carrier itself (that's where the Varyag comes in) and the operational experience...and for any blue water operation, the replenishment group.

But escorts they do have...certainly as credible as the Brtis, the French, or the Russians.

Here's a pic of what it would look like.

Re: Latest Varyag Pics

the picture on the top of this CDF thread gives more indication than anything else. Just check it out.

Re: Latest Varyag Pics

tphuang said:

Just check it out.

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Very interesting. They are clearly planning something significant. The new facilities look to be very capable of major refitting.

We shall soon see I believe.

Re: Latest Varyag Pics

PLABUDDY said:

Nice pictures...one questions though, did PLAN always paint the superstructure red?

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thats not the end of painting - its the first look after sand blasting, may be a first ground painting

Re: Latest Varyag Pics

Sczepan said:

may be a first ground painting

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That was my thought as well...a primer.

Re: Latest Varyag Pics

well, completing the superstructure is only a very small party of completing the whole carreir. the carreir itself stiil needs and engine, weapons, opereting systems, and the whole ships need to be wired with pipe and electricity. safety equipment must be placed on board.
the aircraft choic will depend on what role the plan plans to use the carreir for. most likely the carrier will be a primary air defese vessel with some strike planes. china probaly does have enough ships to escort the carreir, but ti will need tio asmeble tham and train and exercise. a long way to go before the chinese get it operating.

hers my ideas:
for engines, order dual use cruise liner enginese for the main power, and french/indegedous diesels can porvide the speed.

the battle systems on board can be layed out with russian aid, but must be indegedous systems. this is a very hard part. the plan has never used a carreiir, so it will need a completely new system and radars. hjoper they spent the last few years thinkiong and designing...

The weaopons on board...this is going to need alot of change. the soviets used beloiw dechk space for ashm, but the chinese can better utilize the space if those missles are removed. the sa-n-12 can be a good air defese missle, and the chinese may want to put on ak-630s. it needs anti sub rokets and torpedoes too.

the fitting of plumbing, wires, and safety can be done faily quikly, since china has the blueprints.

the airwing...if the chinese remove the ashm, they can have room for about 40 planes. a break down of 30 air deferce mig-29s and 10 su-33kubs will do nicely. add about 5 helixes. china may plan to use the j-10c on board, but i think it should go with the proven gear.

training a crw.. and getting a completed cvbg. the highly skilled destroyer captains can be sent to ruissia for training. the best plnaf pilots can be selected for the airwing. china als needs to test it carrier and get somewhat proficient with it.

lets see, if work begins in 06...by late 2008, the interior, engines and weapons fittings may be completed. the airwing oredered form russia arrives. the crew is sent home from training. the ship can be done testing in 09, and should be in service by 2010.

Re: Latest Varyag Pics

MIGleader said:

well, completing the superstructure is only a very small party of completing the whole carreir. the carreir itself stiil needs and engine, weapons, opereting systems, and the whole ships need to be wired with pipe and electricity. safety equipment must be placed on board.

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Some of these things may have already been occurring. It's been at dock for, I believe, over two years already. I would be surprised if some of this hasn't already been done...maybe a lot.

How much? Who knows. The PLAN may surprise some people.

Re: Latest Varyag Pics

Jeff Head said:

Some of these things may have already been occurring. It's been at dock for, I believe, over two years already. I would be surprised if some of this hasn't already been done...maybe a lot.

How much? Who knows. The PLAN may surprise some people.

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Well..i'm not so sure about the engine and weapon part since we haven't seen pictures of engines or weapons being installed on Varyag. I do believe that electronics may have been already fitted since one of the pictures showed that the elevator can move.:china: anyways..i'm also not sure that if the blue building of the Dalian Shipyard can allow a ship of the size of Varyag to dock neither. What do you guys think?

Re: Latest Varyag Pics

PLABUDDY said:

What do you guys think?

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That's an interesting question...one I do not have an answer for.

But...I also noticed that one of the elevators is now up. Aux power from shore could do that...but with the amount of time they have had...there's no telling what all they may have accomplished inside the Varyag at this point.

One thing is for certain, we will know when she has workable engines when she sails under her own steam away from there.

It will be interesting to watch it develop...progress towards some PLAN goal for her is clearly being made.

Re: My trip to the US Navy Reserve Fleet in Bremerton, WA

bd popeye said:

The Paris peace talks started in '68 true enough. But about the first year or so was spent trying to decide the shape and size of the table used for the discussions. In my opinion to force the North into some real peace negoiations the US launched Operation Linebacker II. And nearly bombed N.Vietnam into oblivion. In the wake of these attacks the North decided to "negoiate"(save it's ass) with the US and S. Vietnamese. As Totoro posted so well..they lied. They had no intention of honoring the agreement.

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Well stated PopEye.

I hope this thread can now get back to what it was intended...a discussion of the US Navy reserve fleet in general, and in Bremerton specifically.