PLAN Carrier Strike Group and Airwing

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

Jeff Head said:

My point is simply that I believe that the Japanese have the capacity to build the aircraft...both technologically and manufacturing wise. They may not have the desire or will due to cost and political ramification, but I believe if they were sufficentlly motivated that they could do it.

Click to expand...

Actually, I agree with crobato in that Japan doesn't have the ability to build fighter aircraft. Otherwise, they would have stretched the constitution and built them already. As for needs, they don't need helicopter carriers either, but they built them nevertheless. As you can see, need is not such a big reason as you are making it out to be.

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

Jeff Head said:

My point is simply that I believe that the Japanese have the capacity to build the aircraft...both technologically and manufacturing wise. They may not have the desire or will due to cost and political ramification, but I believe if they were sufficentlly motivated that they could do it.

Click to expand...

Actually, I agree with crobato in that Japan doesn't have the ability to build fighter aircraft. Otherwise, they would have stretched the constitution and built them already. As for needs, they don't need helicopter carriers either, but they built them nevertheless. As you can see, need is not such a big reason as you are making it out to be.

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

not likely IMHO for S. Korea...but a possibility for Japan in a few years.

Click to expand...

Why do you say that? Korean shipyards are outproducing Japanese yards by a significant margin these days.

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

not likely IMHO for S. Korea...but a possibility for Japan in a few years.

Click to expand...

Why do you say that? Korean shipyards are outproducing Japanese yards by a significant margin these days.

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

not likely IMHO for S. Korea...but a possibility for Japan in a few years.

Click to expand...

Why do you say that? Korean shipyards are outproducing Japanese yards by a significant margin these days.

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

Engineer said:

Actually, I agree with crobato in that Japan doesn't have the ability to build fighter aircraft. Otherwise, they would have stretched the constitution and built them already. As for needs, they don't need helicopter carriers either, but they built them nevertheless. As you can see, need is not such a big reason as you are making it out to be.

Click to expand...

Sorry...we disagree.

Japan definitely can see the need for helicopter carriers to help in ASW operations. In fact, without stretching their constitution at all they can, and now have, built such carriers.

The Hyuga is not an amphibious or OTH assault carrier. The Osumi Class fills that role already, and they have built three of them. The Hyuga is strictly a helo carrier, principally for ASW and C&C work and that role is a very critical role for the Japanese as an island nation, and one they have been doing for a long time. Now they have a new, capable tool to help their destroyer flotillas in that regard.

Their problem is that these carriers "appear" much more like typical flat tops with a potential use for offensive aircraft and I persoinally believe that they could be relatively easily refitted to carry them.

That is where the problem would come in on their constitution...but again, stretching it or changing it is a matter of will...principally political will because they have the capacity technologically to make it happen as far as the vessel itself is concerned.

That's all.

As to fighter aircraft, I believe it is the same issue. Japan has the technological and manufacturing capabnility of building their own...they just haven't seen the need to do sustain such production yet, though they have made some starts.

Understand, I am not talking about some immediate, design it in a year and your done...I am talking about developing the infrastructure and experience to do so...which would take several years. Just like the Chinese are doing with their Aircraft carrier and fighter development programs. Japan could do the same if they were sufficiently motivated.

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

Engineer said:

Actually, I agree with crobato in that Japan doesn't have the ability to build fighter aircraft. Otherwise, they would have stretched the constitution and built them already. As for needs, they don't need helicopter carriers either, but they built them nevertheless. As you can see, need is not such a big reason as you are making it out to be.

Click to expand...

Sorry...we disagree.

Japan definitely can see the need for helicopter carriers to help in ASW operations. In fact, without stretching their constitution at all they can, and now have, built such carriers.

The Hyuga is not an amphibious or OTH assault carrier. The Osumi Class fills that role already, and they have built three of them. The Hyuga is strictly a helo carrier, principally for ASW and C&C work and that role is a very critical role for the Japanese as an island nation, and one they have been doing for a long time. Now they have a new, capable tool to help their destroyer flotillas in that regard.

Their problem is that these carriers "appear" much more like typical flat tops with a potential use for offensive aircraft and I persoinally believe that they could be relatively easily refitted to carry them.

That is where the problem would come in on their constitution...but again, stretching it or changing it is a matter of will...principally political will because they have the capacity technologically to make it happen as far as the vessel itself is concerned.

That's all.

As to fighter aircraft, I believe it is the same issue. Japan has the technological and manufacturing capabnility of building their own...they just haven't seen the need to do sustain such production yet, though they have made some starts.

Understand, I am not talking about some immediate, design it in a year and your done...I am talking about developing the infrastructure and experience to do so...which would take several years. Just like the Chinese are doing with their Aircraft carrier and fighter development programs. Japan could do the same if they were sufficiently motivated.

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

Engineer said:

Actually, I agree with crobato in that Japan doesn't have the ability to build fighter aircraft. Otherwise, they would have stretched the constitution and built them already. As for needs, they don't need helicopter carriers either, but they built them nevertheless. As you can see, need is not such a big reason as you are making it out to be.

Click to expand...

Sorry...we disagree.

Japan definitely can see the need for helicopter carriers to help in ASW operations. In fact, without stretching their constitution at all they can, and now have, built such carriers.

The Hyuga is not an amphibious or OTH assault carrier. The Osumi Class fills that role already, and they have built three of them. The Hyuga is strictly a helo carrier, principally for ASW and C&C work and that role is a very critical role for the Japanese as an island nation, and one they have been doing for a long time. Now they have a new, capable tool to help their destroyer flotillas in that regard.

Their problem is that these carriers "appear" much more like typical flat tops with a potential use for offensive aircraft and I persoinally believe that they could be relatively easily refitted to carry them.

That is where the problem would come in on their constitution...but again, stretching it or changing it is a matter of will...principally political will because they have the capacity technologically to make it happen as far as the vessel itself is concerned.

That's all.

As to fighter aircraft, I believe it is the same issue. Japan has the technological and manufacturing capabnility of building their own...they just haven't seen the need to do sustain such production yet, though they have made some starts.

Understand, I am not talking about some immediate, design it in a year and your done...I am talking about developing the infrastructure and experience to do so...which would take several years. Just like the Chinese are doing with their Aircraft carrier and fighter development programs. Japan could do the same if they were sufficiently motivated.

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

FriedRiceNSpice said:

Why do you say that? Korean shipyards are outproducing Japanese yards by a significant margin these days.

Click to expand...

I feel that S. Korea has less motivation than the Japanese to build true aircraft carriers and the aircraft to deploy on them. That is all.

That is why I said it was less likely (not impossible by any means) for them to do so. I believe they have the production capability and the technology, particularly for the shipping, to do so, if they were willing to economically and politically make the effort. I just feel it is less likely that they will do so for those reasons so than the Japanese.

...but, who knows? if the Japanese were to do so, that may well give them the motivation nationally to do it.

Re: Ideal chinese carrier thread

FriedRiceNSpice said:

Why do you say that? Korean shipyards are outproducing Japanese yards by a significant margin these days.

Click to expand...

I feel that S. Korea has less motivation than the Japanese to build true aircraft carriers and the aircraft to deploy on them. That is all.

That is why I said it was less likely (not impossible by any means) for them to do so. I believe they have the production capability and the technology, particularly for the shipping, to do so, if they were willing to economically and politically make the effort. I just feel it is less likely that they will do so for those reasons so than the Japanese.

...but, who knows? if the Japanese were to do so, that may well give them the motivation nationally to do it.