Wow. These look like straight up carbon copies of Eotech, Streamlight, and FAB Defense.Modernised Type 79s
PLA Small arms
- Thread starter Vanguard1688
- Start date
TerraN_EmpirE
Tyrant King
open market Iron man Some of these are the real deal.
The only possible legit buy is the FAB foregrip, and only because I cannot make out its markings. The red dot and light are definitely NOT the real deal as their markings are not Eotech and Streamlight.
plawolf
Lieutenant General
Rather than buy off the shelf, I really wish they would commission one of the countless Chinese accesscory companies to make some custom fittings for their imported optics.
Most of the problem with the placement of those optics is because they are using fittings designed for conventional rifles on top of the carrying handle.
It would be pretty basic stuff to design and machine some fittings that take advantage of the propriety rail interface already built into the 95 handle to drop the sight lines of optics right down to a similar level as if they were aiming down the irons on the 95.
They will need to change the front posts to flip downs, but that a small and easy conversion as well.
Most of the problem with the placement of those optics is because they are using fittings designed for conventional rifles on top of the carrying handle.
It would be pretty basic stuff to design and machine some fittings that take advantage of the propriety rail interface already built into the 95 handle to drop the sight lines of optics right down to a similar level as if they were aiming down the irons on the 95.
They will need to change the front posts to flip downs, but that a small and easy conversion as well.
1) Neither of the above optics are imported, if by that you mean imported from the US. They look exactly like Streamlight and Eotech units, yet their markings betray their non-US origin. Also, both of these units are export-restricted by the Department of Commerce, so the chance that the Chinese military/PAP legitimately got their hands on actual Streamlight laser/lights and Eotech red dots is ZERO.
2) The "fittings" they are using are standard US military MIL-STD-1913 picatinny rails which are not in fact designed "for conventional rifles on top of the carrying handle". Full length pic rails atop military rifles (M-16A3/A4) are now the norm and have replaced the bulk of rifles with non-removable carrying handles (M-16A1/A2), which are being actively retired. Other military rifles like the SCAR-16/17, AR-10, etc. all have full length pic rails.
3) Eotechs (I own two) on a rail adapter will definitely not co-witness with BUIS. The best you can hope for is something like a lower 1/3 co-witness. This is the problem with China exactly copying optics designed for MIL-STD-1913 specs and then using them on rifles that do not comply with MIL-STD-1913 specs. You end up with a frankensteinian setup that is not entirely ergonomic.
plawolf
Lieutenant General
I'm not so sure about that.
I don't really see anyone kicking up a fuss about Chinese police departments ordering a handful of Eotech sights. Hardly the stuff national security nightmares are made off.
An unfortunate autocorrect error. I meant to say fittings NOT designed to be used on top of carrying handles.
Those optics, if copied, would have been made to be sold in western markets rather than being commissioned by the PAP or PLA.
The foundamental problem with poor fitting optics sights on the 95 stems from the fact no one has been willing to pay a company to actually design a mounting system, never mind a modern red dot or holo-sight, that is specifically designed for the gun (I'm discounting the factory option, as that's more a short scope).
So we end up with these jury rigged solutions that are far from ideal.
I think the PLA just doesn't want to spend hundreds of dollars per head to mass equip its troops with modern optics, especially since there is such a low chance of China being engaged in a serious armed conflict.
All the optics makers in China knows this, so no one is really putting much, if any, time and money into developing sights to go with the 95.
However, in the grand scheme of things, that's really just a superficial external configuration issue.
If the perverbial really hits the fan and the PLA tended an order for a million units of red dots and/or holosights, you can expect scopes and sights tailor made for the 95 appear left right and centre.
MwRYum
Major
Law enforcement agencies are excempted from the export restrictions, and they won't ever make orders in large quantities anyway.
These are definitely copies, since the logos are non-Eotech and non-Streamlight, which I also own (I also have the FAB foregrip), which is how I could easily see the differences. So you've basically got units which look exactly like the "real deal" but have different markings; add on top of that the export restrictions, and you've got copies for sure. The US Department isn't concerned about them going to police departments. The concern is obviously that if they can be sold to Chinese police, they could just as easily be transferred to the Chinese military, especially their special forces which would not need large quantities of units.
What we have is a rifle designer without enough foresight to look into the future and see the need for accessories. The US mil-standard pic rail has been out for almost 3 decades along with all the gadgets designed for it. The designers of the QBZ-95 series could easily have redesigned the rifle to adopt this standard and yet they have not. They could still do this now by (e.g.) emulating the Canadian civilian Type 97 which has a pic rail across the entire carrying handle. It's a shame really, because as the PLA gets richer more and more of its infantry forces will have the money to accessorize with force-multiplying rifle mods/accessories.
And where did you get this piece of information, especially when we are talking about Chinese LE agencies? I would love to see a link for that.
MwRYum
Major
Or else how would the PAP got their hands on small batch of Remington M700 series sniper rifles with foreign-made scopes, or Corner Shot, or FAST helmets, plus other Western Bloc products that falls under the Law Enforcement category?
TerraN_EmpirE
Tyrant King
There is alot of Counterfeiting to be sure, However It's unlikely that a PRC agency would procure a fake. The biggest issue with fakes it that they tend to fail under the stress of use.
as to US LE Gear Exports... It's well known to happen.
Another factor to consider Iron is that products like that Streamlight are not unique to manufacture in the US. Streamlight "Assembles in the USA" as there product is composed of parts sourced from across the world. assembly in the US is to meet US Demand, Similarly production in other nations is a option.
There is also second hand export. Where Individuals will buy products here in the US then repackage and ship abroad. This is a method used quite widely.
as to US LE Gear Exports... It's well known to happen.
Another factor to consider Iron is that products like that Streamlight are not unique to manufacture in the US. Streamlight "Assembles in the USA" as there product is composed of parts sourced from across the world. assembly in the US is to meet US Demand, Similarly production in other nations is a option.
There is also second hand export. Where Individuals will buy products here in the US then repackage and ship abroad. This is a method used quite widely.